*This is all just me rambling while at the office and should be working, but please feel free to share your thoughts and ideas if you have any about how other jobs can do the something similar*
Title is pretty self explanatory. Of course I don't want things that are exactly the same between the jobs but I like the idea of the job gauge being used to build up into a form that plays or acts completely differently than the usual rotation.
I am by no means the first person to come up with this idea, I saw a post talking about how the dragoon rework can use it's gauge to build up to a potential dragon rider phase where you ride around for a bit attacking that way. That is so incredibly impractical with the spaghetti code this game runs on, but hey a boy can dream.
Red mage is probably the closest alternative, but "here is a mechanic that pushes casters away from the boss right during your melee burst AHAHAHAH EAT SHIT"... if you can't tell im jaded by P12S then idk.
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08-03-2023, 01:33 AMRychuReaper's Enshroud is the only skill I am okay if other jobs use for inspiration
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08-05-2023, 01:06 AMCKNovel
Machinist has the exact same thing as the heat gauge.
Except Enshroud is superior and much more flexible in all aspects.
As someone once said, Enshroud is what Hypercharge should've been. -
08-05-2023, 01:53 PMLyth
In fairness, Enshroud is what every resource-based burst should have been. In the absence of less predictable/proc resource gains which have since fallen out of favor, its precursors on older resource-based jobs might as well have been designed as generic timer-based burst with attractive GUI elements. The possibility of situationally 'storing' your one minute burst until the two minute mark for tincture usage or mechanics like Everburn is what keeps it interesting. I'm sure we'll see more ideas built off of this concept on other jobs now that they've figured out the trick to it.
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08-05-2023, 07:31 PMValenceCare to elaborate?Quote:
Originally Posted by CKNovel
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08-05-2023, 11:23 PMSottiri
they're 5 fast gcd hits usually with ogcds in between, same skill different vfx the xiv special
(next expansion reduced to 3 hits with guaranteed crit dhit on a flat 60s cd) -
08-05-2023, 11:31 PMNoox-115The fact that I can see them do that fr-Quote:
Originally Posted by Sottiri
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08-06-2023, 02:27 AMCKNovelCost 50 gauge.Quote:
Originally Posted by Valence
Enter a rapid fire burst phase with oGCDs to weave-in.
Main difference is that MCH doesn't have a finisher.
Except at release RPR had charges and 30s duration, MCH had no charges and 9 seconds.
RPR is also much more flexible, able to use other actions during the Enshroud.
MCH was very rigid on heat gauge management and forced to spend it in a specific way.
Flexibility makes rooms for creativity. A rigid rotation that will always be the same will be boring over time and in all content. -
08-06-2023, 05:51 AMLyth
Enshroud is actually pretty rigid in terms of how it gets used in practice under two-minute burst, unless you're playing freestyle. You want to fit two Enshrouds into an Arcane Circle window, which means that you specifically have to enter your two-minute burst with 50 shroud and 9 seconds left on Death's Design. This is because Enshroud has a 15 second recast, while Arcane Circle only lasts for 20 seconds. So you have to have your first Enshroud occur at least 5 seconds before you Arcane Circle. Those 'other' GCDs action choices that you're going on about? Yeah, Shadow of Death and Harvest Moon, which are your options, are specifically there to buy time to let 5 seconds of recast tick off. You're not using them for fun. Likewise, Communio's cast generally syncs up with mechanic checks, which may require you to make clever use of Ingress/Egress on the fly.
No, the thing that makes Enshroud's design interesting is the fact that you have control over where you place your 1 minute mini-burst for a potential Triple Enshroud, which in turn requires you to understand how your kit interacts with fight mechanics. -
08-06-2023, 11:51 PMValenceI'm a little confused by your use of past tense here, when in your original statement you used present tense, so I have a hard time telling if you think that both are comparable today but were a lot less before, or if they're not comparable at all in any time period...Quote:
Originally Posted by CKNovel
Either way, Enshroud is definitely more interesting visually because it's been designed visually from scratch where MCH was just a salvage job of SB already existing abilities (Cooldown/Hypercharge animations). And yeah, it benefits from a finisher with a cast time which MCH doesn't have and I wouldn't mind exchanging some of those heatblasts for a cast finisher tbh, as long as it doesn't nuke the loopium that is...
Today you can actually use another action during HC since the addition of stacks apparently added a filter only using the stacks on HB and ACB. It's more flexible than it used to be but on top of making you clip slightly the recast of tools it still is limited to one normal GCD use in the middle of the whole sequence because they want the timer to remain strict somewhat. I kinda understand why since it's the main mechanic of the job and that being able to tell when to fit it between tools and when you don't have enough time for it is part of the "skill" of playing the job. Personally I find the tool alignment/drift tedious and not very engaging, but in its current state if you add a super long timer to HC then 1) you'll remove all skillplay there is around it and 2) you could just remove the hypercharge button altogether and go back to Stormblood's Cooldown ability that was just removing from the gauge at that point. Fact of the matter, I don't see how extending the HC timer would allow for anything else (easier weaving?) than removing most job constraints, much like DNC procs from flourish being decorrelated from the normal procs removed absolutely all skill play there used to be not to overwrite them.
Now I'm not saying that it was or wasn't tedious for DNC. But it removed something without adding anything else in counterpart, and pushed the job even further into the abyss of residents sleepery. If you do that with MCH hypercharge, it's gonna have the exact same effect. No more punishing bad uses of HCs on timings. It's not like the Shroud gauge (that is somewhat more equivalent to the battery gauge), the way the heat gauge is designed allows for approximately 20-25% of your time spent hypercharging with the job (it's a lot, and it's too much, but then the job has nothing else at all to offer to fill the gaps because they removed ammo...).
Heat has issues with the loopium and has always had since ShB inception. I don't know how it is exactly for RPR, but heat doesn't loop properly on MCH, which introduces different amounts of heat cycles at every burst, and it can also change at different speeds. The problem becomes then how not to waste heat, and there is workarounds for it, which promotes some skill play but the system is also cumbersome imo. If you delay barrel stab because of potential overcap (which happens right at 120:00 on current rotations), then the next burst when you'll not overcap will require a possible slight clipping because BS is still finishing its cooldown when you're supposed to engage HC (for WF). It's a sloppy design overall imo, and let's not talk about that reassemble 55s recast bandaid.
I'm all for flexibility and especially changing rotations (procs are the superior design, and i'll die on that hill, give me my ammo back), but it has to actually work with the job kit without breaking everything.