Guardian

Hi,

Now I'm far from expert so firstly, is it just me or is it not entirely right for a pld guardian to cover people while they are taking elixir?

I couldn't somehow believe it when it was happening in front of me because it occurs that this is a huge amount of healing, too huge and too easily arranged at just the right time by the players who are able to communicate...

Is there any other ability with this potential? Does it seem fair?

Thank you,

They should have made cover be 99.9% reduction so the target always takes at least 1 damage from the start, that way both the onsai exploit and things like this would never have happened.

I actually like this about paladin. It's a cool niche thing that only they can do, and it's on flavor for the job to boot. As far as I know there's nothing else that lets you do this though.

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Originally Posted by Bluish

Hi,

Now I'm far from expert so firstly, is it just me or is it not entirely right for a pld guardian to cover people while they are taking elixir?

I couldn't somehow believe it when it was happening in front of me because it occurs that this is a huge amount of healing, too huge and too easily arranged at just the right time by the players who are able to communicate...

Is there any other ability with this potential? Does it seem fair?

Thank you,

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i would say its more than fair in fact its unfair for PLD when you think of the drawbacks of guardian

1) its a damage multiplier
2) depending on the situation it forces PLD to use its resources more quickly if it doesnt have guard
3) it forces the player keep guard on reserve
4) it doesnt stop DOTs
5)in the event the player uses guard + cover for an ally to heal it then creates a 3v5 or however of the enemy is left
6) animation lock

assuming who you covered didnt run away
all of these give guardian the nickname "suicide button" so when you factor these in for the 1 gain of an ally getting to use an elixir then id say its more than fair,
if youre in this scenario you best move is to hammer both with aoe's

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Originally Posted by Llynethil

They should have made cover be 99.9% reduction so the target always takes at least 1 damage from the start, that way both the onsai exploit and things like this would never have happened.

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it doesnt stop DOTs and is a damage gain for the enemy so if its 99.9% effective then youve added more of an unfair advantage to the opponent

Thanks for this info,

I don't have any dots on my preferred job...but it does seem at least that there can be a way to deal with that pesky skill.

You have to understand that the way I've seen it used in cc convinced me that there is no way to win against that. It seemed that people were getting the buff just when they were out of stcks and dropping hp. Even with disadvantages that you mentioned this seemed to happen a good few times per match. Full stack of heals is worth some 60k healing, plus whatever is missing from hp bar... If you picture being in a team dealing with that kind of healing potential, wasting over 60k worth of damage just to see the person restoring it while invincible and facing that almost every time when trying to get someone to pop is demoralising. My team members were clearly not dealing with this just as much as me, every time...It was a very effective strategy, and I mean scary effective. I'm not easily put off, I like odds being against me because it makes it more fun, but this, along with other issues of ranked cc such as win trading and voice chatting among the top players makes it incredibly off putting.

It all makes me think that this skill ought to be adjusted. How many genuigne pvp enthusiasts would you be willng to loose by retaining skills this easy to exploit? Most of what I see when pvp is mentioned is people putting each other off, saying how they hate it, don't go there kinda thing and it's because of the issues like this^^

If this skill seems unfair to everyone including people who play this job then how do we get it changed?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bluish

Thanks for this info,

I don't have any dots on my preferred job...but it does seem at least that there can be a way to deal with that pesky skill.

You have to understand that the way I've seen it used in cc convinced me that there is no way to win against that. It seemed that people were getting the buff just when they were out of stcks and dropping hp. Even with disadvantages that you mentioned this seemed to happen a good few times per match. Full stack of heals is worth some 60k healing, plus whatever is missing from hp bar... If you picture being in a team dealing with that kind of healing potential, wasting over 60k worth of damage just to see the person restoring it while invincible and facing that almost every time when trying to get someone to pop is demoralising. My team members were clearly not dealing with this just as much as me, every time...It was a very effective strategy, and I mean scary effective. I'm not easily put off, I like odds being against me because it makes it more fun, but this, along with other issues of ranked cc such as win trading and voice chatting among the top players makes it incredibly off putting.

It all makes me think that this skill ought to be adjusted. How many genuigne pvp enthusiasts would you be willng to loose by retaining skills this easy to exploit? Most of what I see when pvp is mentioned is people putting each other off, saying how they hate it, don't go there kinda thing and it's because of the issues like this^^

If this skill seems unfair to everyone including people who play this job then how do we get it changed?

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The way to deal with a PLD Guardian is to hit the PLD and whoever is under the effect of guardian because of the damage multiplier will drop the PLD relatively easily because the damage you inflict is transferred to the PLD and if the PLD is using guard shift your focus on 1 of the other opponents because by using guard and cover this disengages 2 out of 5 opponents by doing this you've more than leveled the field, if you don't have DOTs then keep up the aoes however if you're trying to face a PLD and whoever is under the effect of Guardian by yourself, well that isn't a good tactic but if you have any knockback abilities you can use that to disrupt Guardian

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bluish

Thanks for this info,

I don't have any dots on my preferred job...but it does seem at least that there can be a way to deal with that pesky skill.

You have to understand that the way I've seen it used in cc convinced me that there is no way to win against that. It seemed that people were getting the buff just when they were out of stcks and dropping hp. Even with disadvantages that you mentioned this seemed to happen a good few times per match. Full stack of heals is worth some 60k healing, plus whatever is missing from hp bar... If you picture being in a team dealing with that kind of healing potential, wasting over 60k worth of damage just to see the person restoring it while invincible and facing that almost every time when trying to get someone to pop is demoralising. My team members were clearly not dealing with this just as much as me, every time...It was a very effective strategy, and I mean scary effective. I'm not easily put off, I like odds being against me because it makes it more fun, but this, along with other issues of ranked cc such as win trading and voice chatting among the top players makes it incredibly off putting.

It all makes me think that this skill ought to be adjusted. How many genuigne pvp enthusiasts would you be willng to loose by retaining skills this easy to exploit? Most of what I see when pvp is mentioned is people putting each other off, saying how they hate it, don't go there kinda thing and it's because of the issues like this^^

If this skill seems unfair to everyone including people who play this job then how do we get it changed?

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The reason I think its unfair for anyone who mains PLD is because most don't understand (even some crystal players)or even see the effect so when they run away I just ended up wasting a skill that could've went to someone else, as well as the requirements of Guard being the only effective DR to keep both participants alive, my preference would be if the tether is broken within the 1st 5 seconds then the ally should get a residual effect of 10-20% DR

Thank you for explaining so well,

Eh I'm one of those who like to learn as they go and even though I tried most of the jobs on dummies, the implications of this skill went complately over my head and I'm also reconsidering my ability to figure out wth is going on altogether. On the bright side my somewhat traumatic experience with learning about this payed off, else I would continue being one of those blissfully oblivious people XD Not that I expect a pld dropping guard on me anytime soon since I'm playing bard...and I don't have a knock back for them either...hmm

Also I'm not sure that even being strategic as a whole team and bringing pld down or alternatively their team members would tip the scales that much...you will take that hard won kill just to deal with it again in some 10-20 seconds when they come back at you fresh as daisies and with lb at the ready. I would like to know if people overall have much luck going against teams focused on using guardian/elixir strategy.

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Originally Posted by RyanCousland

it doesnt stop DOTs and is a damage gain for the enemy so if its 99.9% effective then youve added more of an unfair advantage to the opponent

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It's not about doing damage to them, it's about being able to stop nonsense like this which you could if you did 1 direct damage to the covered perso.

Losing 0.01% damage means nothing and makes 0 difference, being able to stop a full pot is way more important then that.