Questions about reaper lore and potential alternatives !

Hello !

I have a few questions concerning the reaper and wonder if some of you could bring your opinion and elements of answers :D

--> Reapers use avatars from the void, that is the 13th shard, but what would happen to their powers and ability to call their avatar if, as the msq seems to hint it atm, we were to clear the 13th shard from its darkness as we've done it with the 1st shard with its light flood ?

--> In the same way a Reaper is able to call an avatar from the void, as an alternative, would a reaper be able to tame and call a sin-eater from the 1st? (or by extension, any other aetheric entity from any other shard, or even aetheric entities from the primitive world, like the elementals for example)

--> That brings my last question: as hinted in my 1st question, do all the sin-eaters disappeared when we cleared the 1st from its light or do some of them would be able to survive even after we parted from the 1st?

Thanks in advance for your answers :D

Iirc without the wardens and flood new sin eaters cant be "naturally" created so theyll eventually die off and as for a possible reapers voidsent replacement i cant see it working since its a trade between the two (aether from enemies in exchange for power). As for healing the 13th, unless its shown to be immediate its gonna take a very long time like the eden raids conclusion (they were able to heal a small section but its gonna take decades if not centuries for to to spread) so we're in no danger of losing our voidsent.

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Originally Posted by Astralia

--> Reapers use avatars from the void, that is the 13th shard, but what would happen to their powers and ability to call their avatar if, as the msq seems to hint it atm, we were to clear the 13th shard from its darkness as we've done it with the 1st shard with its light flood ?

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Chances are the voidsent themselves would still remain, but that would depend on what theoretical method we'd even be using, but like Sidurgu said, we ain't gonna do that instantly. If we zero down into the specific question of 'what would happen if you specifically de-Voidsented a Reaper's Avatar', that may also not be possible if the rules we know about tempering hold true for voidsent as well, but I'd wager it would break the bond, just looking at Zero.

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--> In the same way a Reaper is able to call an avatar from the void, as an alternative, would a reaper be able to tame and call a sin-eater from the 1st? (or by extension, any other aetheric entity from any other shard, or even aetheric entities from the primitive world, like the elementals for example)

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That's in the Air Bud realm of 'there's no rule saying they can't', but there would be other logistical issues. The Void is 100% full of Voidsent, so there's not really difficulty fishing for one; that isn't true of the First and Sin Eaters, and not to mention there's much less reliable way of cracking open a gate there. So while that's certainly plausible, I imagine it's less reliable as a practice. You also have to keep in mind that thanks to the timestream weirdness, the First wasn't actually a meaningful source of Sin Eaters for very long at all by the Source's clock, so this theoretical Sin Eater Reaper would basically have had to come up with this technique during, like... exactly Stormblood. (Granted, Stormblood is the longest expansion going by 'time said to have elapsed', they've got time.)

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--> That brings my last question: as hinted in my 1st question, do all the sin-eaters disappeared when we cleared the 1st from its light or do some of them would be able to survive even after we parted from the 1st?

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Again, as Sidurgu mentioned, it's more that there's no longer a naturally replenishing source of sin eaters. They're still around, and we both fight them (in the role quests) and hear of them fought (it comes up in 5.3), they're just eventually going to die out, and unlike voidsent they don't have the ability to come back afterwards. So right now, this strategy would work; eventually, it won't.

I think a lot of the magic around summoning Voidsent is essentially space-time magic.

In order to bring a Voidsent into the Source, you either need to provide a vessel for them to occupy (i.e. what we did with our friends in our journey back from the source) or you need to open a voidgate or 'hollow' for them to enter directly (i.e. what we did during our last excursion to the Thirteenth). The same basic principles apply to any form of travel between the shards.

Reapers make pacts with Voidsent in order to bring them into the Source. The only difference is that instead of using an inanimate vessel (like a statue for a gargoyle) or a partially biological one (like the Diabolos Armament did with a partially biological Weapon made utilizing chimerical cells), the Reaper uses their own body as a vessel for the Voidsent. You could, in theory, do this with anything by using soul transfer, including ordinary people on other shards. I also wouldn't be surprised if the principle applies more generally to soul transfer, and there may be a degree of overlap here with what we saw with Athena's experiments, Ascian Primes, and even Aulus mal Asina's research in Garlemald. You essentially just have two souls bound simultaneously to the same bit of corporeal aether.

To answer your questions:
1) If you were to restore the Thirteenth completely to its original state, you probably wouldn't have any more Voidsent. But as we saw with the Empty on the First, even when you disperse the aspected aether it still may not be a change that we see completed in our lifetime. Alternatively, it may just be that there's a deeper reason why the Void needs to exist, and some people may choose to remain Voidsent voluntarily in the name of some higher purpose. Who knows.
2) If you're able to invite another soul into your own body (as Hephaistos did), then perhaps you could do the same for a Sin Eater. The main difference is that its relatively rare to engage with a Sin Eater that we can actually converse with. So the question would be whether you could form a 'pact' in the first place (assuming that this mattered).
3) The Sin Eaters are still around, as is the Empty. This is largely covered in the Eden questline. I think that if you go far enough into the future, the First might regain some semblance of the world that it used to be, which may mean that the Sin Eaters eventually regain their original forms as the aspected aether is dispersed.

Once the 13th is healed, then no, the Reaper job wouldn't work anymore.
I imagine that by the end of this, we'll have initiated a healing process that will take decades or centuries.
This allows Reapers to stay in the game since Voidsent will still be around until that somewhat far off time.
Same way there are still Sin Eaters around in the 1st, but they are "on the way out".

I see, thanks for your answers so far !
That brings me a better understanding of this stuff I can use for my rp !

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Originally Posted by Astralia

Hello !

I have a few questions concerning the reaper and wonder if some of you could bring your opinion and elements of answers :D

--> Reapers use avatars from the void, that is the 13th shard, but what would happen to their powers and ability to call their avatar if, as the msq seems to hint it atm, we were to clear the 13th shard from its darkness as we've done it with the 1st shard with its light flood ?

--> In the same way a Reaper is able to call an avatar from the void, as an alternative, would a reaper be able to tame and call a sin-eater from the 1st? (or by extension, any other aetheric entity from any other shard, or even aetheric entities from the primitive world, like the elementals for example)

--> That brings my last question: as hinted in my 1st question, do all the sin-eaters disappeared when we cleared the 1st from its light or do some of them would be able to survive even after we parted from the 1st?

Thanks in advance for your answers :D

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If the WoL were to learn the spell employed by Elidibus in 5.3, we could partially summon a warrior's spirit from another shard to act as our battle companion. It wouldn't work how reaper works now, but that's as close as we could get if we restore the 13th.

Of course, the other shards aren't the only worlds to call souls from. With the introduction of Dynamis, it'd be fairly easy for the writers to re-write Reaper to call the souls of the dead longing for life via a Dynamis interaction. The specifics of which are entirely theoretical, and therefore well suited to roleplay.

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

With the introduction of Dynamis, it'd be fairly easy for the writers to re-write Reaper to call the souls of the dead longing for life via a Dynamis interaction. The specifics of which are entirely theoretical, and therefore well suited to roleplay.

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I hadn't think of dynamis yet indeed ! But, unless I misunderstood it during the MSQ, doesn't the aether from the planet stop us from feeling and using the dynamis as we could in Ultima Thule? Like some kind of interferences between aether and dynamis

If aether is dense enough it will drown out dynamis. It's why the Ancients weren't directly affected by the Metiea. While their thinner in aether creations were. Dynamis is kind of like air. It's always there but you won't see it unless you inject something into it to make it visible. The reason we weren't being affected by it was due to Zodiark's shielding. Once Zodiark died his shielding faded away and allowing the planet and us to be susceptible to dynamis once more. Well once more for the planet in general.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

If aether is dense enough it will drown out dynamis. It's why the Ancients weren't directly affected by the Metiea. While their thinner in aether creations were. Dynamis is kind of like air. It's always there but you won't see it unless you inject something into it to make it visible. The reason we weren't being affected by it was due to Zodiark's shielding. Once Zodiark died his shielding faded away and allowing the planet and us to be susceptible to dynamis once more. Well once more for the planet in general.

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Specifically while the aether of the Ancients was too dense, creation magic was able to be manipulated by dynamis.
Which makes me believe that creation magic might not be powered by aether at all. It may be able manipulate and shape it, but the actual source of creation magic might be something totally separate from dynamis and aether.