So, now that we've seen a large number of changes to both Paladin and Warrior I'm curious to see how others are tanking with Paladin. I mean it's a different playstyle than Warrior so I wanted to get some input.
Is it feasible to just use AF? I mean I know the norm is to just go with HP melded gear up to 4k and use whatever else but does that really override all of the skill bonuses from AF? If not full AF, which parts are best to keep? I ask this as a player who doesn't really have a lot of money or motivation to throw at double/triple melding gear.
Does blocking matter now? Can we see a decent reduction in damage from at least physical attacks?
What, in your opinion, is the best way for a Paladin to hold hate now? I mean I know there's the usual "engage > sentinel > rampart" and whatnot but what are some of the tricks you utilize?
Is Holy Succor/Cover more useful now, especially for hate generation? I mean it would require having a close-range melee teammate to cover and heal which some people are afraid to bring along in things like Coincounter. I mean if the mages can hold off on healing them and let the Paladin do it, I would imagine it would bring some nice returns, especially on things that are more physical dmg resistant.
How is survivability outside of straight HP now? Are the various tools Paladin has (Holy Succor, Aegis Boon, Sentinel, etc...) really cutting it for keeping Paladin alive?
Just looking to get some answers and maybe a little bit of discussion. Thanks.
Tanking as of 1.22b, a few questions.
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06-02-2012, 03:06 AMArcellTanking as of 1.22b, a few questions.
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06-02-2012, 03:40 AMyukikaze_yanagi
i'm new of paladin, so i'm looking for tips too. Anyhow i can respond to something
-af isn't bad, aside feet who's a bit lacking. If you're going with melees body is nice for augmented cover. Hands are good too, legs useful but replacable with melded felt trousers. Head is good, and options are very sub-par in that slot
-yes
-can't say much here. Generally i go sentinel - rampart/flash -divine veil- phalanx-spirits within, then provoke. Divine veil can also be changed with aegis boon, but give more room of blocks in case phalanx miss
-holy succor heal a nice amount but cost a lot mp. Isn't spammable without ballad or ethers. I don't find cover much useful, outside with af body
-survivability it's awesome, if you tank with war too you'll see a big difference
ps: on this last statement, the eternal war vs pld dispute mainly focus on pld' difficulty to hold AoE enmity since have any aoe ws, war drum is shitty and flash alone isn't enought. Also, pld is more difficult to use, while war it's easier and do more damage. But pld hold better hate and have better survivability, so dd can spam much more and the lost damage can be recuperated from them -
06-02-2012, 04:11 AMMolly_Millions
Imo the PLD af is the worst of all the AF. A good melded set is much more beneficial. Ultimately that goes for all of the classes, but it's especially true for PLD. As said above, if you're gonna keep one piece, make if the head piece. For feet, there really is nothing else better than double melded sentinel's feet aside from darklight. Don't buy them, they are too damn expensive. But if you have a few sets of gear to spiritbond, I'd recommend taking that gear out with a group to the sentinal's sabaton camp and hanging out there for a few hours until you get a few pairs to try to meld. If you're the main tank for your LS, ask them to bring you out there and donate the drops to the cause. Ultimately, it will benefit them. Even with a single meld, it's hard to argue against the usefulness of the extra 9 enmity. For hands, go with whatever. I've got a set of double melded sentinel's gauntlets, but they don't really offer much over the cobalt ones with the same meld. At the end of the day +5 block is negligible. You can easily use cobalt guantlets because they are relatively cheap to make so getting a double or triple meld on them should not be too expensive in the end. As for the body, I use a double melded cobalt cuirass, but the pld body will get you through content until you can get one of those.
I created a list, which you can see here, of what I think is the best in slot materia for PLD. I took cost into account somewhat when ranking materia as well. -
06-02-2012, 06:01 AMXinundra
For me, I tank both with PLD & WAR and still found that WAR is better for tanking due to the HP bonus that WAR get from a full party with just wearing all AF gears on both.
For single target, (take Ifrit for example) to be able to hold hate on him as a PLD, I will Engage > Sentinel > Rampart > Flash > Provoke then I'll use Aegis Boon > Phalanx > Spirits Within. Of course you got to hope that Phalanx > Spirits Within does not miss. After all that done, I just go about normally, with you're normal combos and always Flash & Provoke when they are up.
For multi-targets, it's really depend on how you're party is position for both WAR and PLD. WAR has a upper hand on holding or creating hate due to the fact that their aoe (Steel Cyclone & Whirlwind ) does not have to rely on WHM to perform the AOE (Divine Veil).
Survivability on PLD is a little issue for me with wearing all AF gears due to the HP gain. PLD get around 3100 with a full party and WAR get around 4080 with a full party. That around 820 HP that you could use on a PLD to stay alive a little longer. Yes, PLD has more tools than WAR to keep them alive like Aegis Boon, Holy Succor, Hallowed Ground, WHM healing and protection spells, and finally Bloodbath. However Holy Succor, WHM healing & protection spells take time to cast and use MP, not to mention that if it doesn't go off while you're low on HP, you can kiss yourself goodbye. -
06-02-2012, 06:34 AMyukikaze_yanagiThat's because usually a serius pld don't go full af, and war is the actual faceroller. But well, we got plenty of topic on thisQuote:
Originally Posted by Xinundra