7.0 Black Mage Spells

Demi-Ultima - Trait/Spell

Requires 3 requirements -

Thunder spell must be active/casted on the target
Must have Switched from Ice to Fire - Dark Requiem Status effect
you must cast Flare 3 times in a row. This allows Flare turn into Demi Ultima

Ultima deals 750 Potency All nearby targets. same range as flare 100% chance to crit chance

Absolute Zero - Requires Umbra Ice 3 - Abiltity
Next Ice Spell casted freezes target solid for 2-3 seconds. with frozen effect. frozen effect is like a stun but also freezes debuffs/dots on the target extending there time. this one of few effects that will work on bosses it just wont stun them. instead place a 20% slow instead.

this spell extends timers for 2-3 seconds . dots of healers. duration of trick attack slow effect on arm's lengh however does not effect things from holy watch share dimishing returns with other stun effects

Ultima the actual spell

An idea to adding Ultima spell to Black Mages in FF14, Square could implement a proc system around the Polyglot and Enochian upkeep.
Xenoglossy would function as the skill that procs Ultima which could work one of two ways.

First method. Xenoglossy has a chance to proc Ultima which in this state would be an instant cast spell like Xenoglossy with a third less potency and is off GCD, a good estimate chance say being 20% to proc Ultima. And Ultima would in turn proc at a 30% rate to recover a Polyglot. This would make the interaction react somewhat back and forth on good rng sort of equivalent to how Dancer's Fan Dance and Fan Dance III combos work. While having to track the investment of good proc rate with balancing Enochian still.

Second Method would be Xenoglossy still has the proc function to mold into Ultima, but Ultima's potency is much higher than Xenoglossy and still has an off GCD component, however a 30-90 second cooldown and the chance to return a polyglot to recast Xenoglossy would be around 10% instead. Making Ultima into a solid huge nuke that can be rarely seen, but rewarding to get the chance of using during a fight.

Both methods could lead to some interesting extra gameplay additions to Black Mage while giving a spell some have been wondering if Black Mage will get.

Demi-Ultima: ...Why? Why would you add a spell with so many restrictions? Such only reduces the possible nuances of the spell and, at the effective potency you've set here, would makes all else of the job feel like mere prologue to Ultima per Ether or Convert CD (each spender phase of which will end up painfully identical).

Absolute Zero: No effects are random. It will be either 2 seconds or 3. If you want to extend debuffs, make it 3, since all DoTs operate on a per-3-second tick rate. Regardless, allowing for a 3-second AoE stun on a DPS is, at this point (or really any point since HW) very, very strange. Moreover, you've not given a cooldown for this ability, meaning that Absolute Zero + a GCD- or sub-GCD-casttime Ice spell would allow it to extend Trick Attack and Chain Stratagem infinitely. It likely still wouldn't be worth the damage it'd cost the BLM itself, but even the idea that it may do so could oblige BLMs to forfeit their actual rotations in favor of going full-time buff-extending Ice Mages. This is a horrible idea.

Ultima: You do not want to attach such massive and iconic sources of damage to RNG. You've here fettered both BLM's most powerful spell and its second-most powerful to low proc rates, meaning that they more than likely will not see this spell even go off in a majority of dungeon boss fights, for instance. Allowing it to work off Sharpcast, however, would be little better, as it'd essentially kill what little decision making remains to that ability, as it'd absolutely have to spent on Xenoglossy alone. Any why have you made this oGCD? BLM has never had oGCD attacks. Ever. Only buffs. That's been core to its identity, even. And even if you make this the newest, coolest tactical nuke, that needs to do more than merely displace its current ones, else you're effectively just chopping off two main points of interest (Zeno and Foul) to replace them with a far slower, far more restrictive singular point. The latter is not a positive change. Additions are not necessarily additive; ones like this are instead more likely to be disruptive, or even destructive.

A backend idea for how to spin Ultima into Black Mage lore in 14, is using a mixture of lights protection and implications involving Enochian and Polyglot mechanics.

The implication of Enochian is that the upkeep management sets you in a sort of trance in which this time you can channel the occult language in whispers, sort of like tongues and polyglot in this manner would imply that there are dialects to this worlds definition of Enochian dialects.
Since Ultima is considered an unwieldy magic, mechanically speaking it would be whispers between the whispers of the occult language channeling, so a proc would be a perfect fit, a sudden boom of uncontrollable magic.
To constitute how fast you would wanna make this vary the animation and particle type.
Small hint explosions of Ultima sparking out from the end phase of a Xenoglossy animation for the first faster gameplay loop or make it one giant boom out of nowhere in the second method to adjust the randomness of it, but the terrifying nature of what kind of magic just got thrown out.

Though the idea is also to give black mage players a new engagement to their endgame mechanics while preserving the current playstyle and something that could be I guess would be pretty cool for Black Mages to have in this Final Fantasy.

Honestly did you really think casting most powerful black mage spell that will not have consequences if you casted out right. rng isn't bad thing

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Demi-Ultima: ...Why? Why would you add a spell with so many restrictions? Such only reduces the possible nuances of the spell and, at the effective potency you've set here, would makes all else of the job feel like mere prologue to Ultima per Ether or Convert CD (each spender phase of which will end up painfully identical).

Absolute Zero: No effects are random. It will be either 2 seconds or 3. If you want to extend debuffs, make it 3, since all DoTs operate on a per-3-second tick rate. Regardless, allowing for a 3-second AoE stun on a DPS is, at this point (or really any point since HW) very, very strange. Moreover, you've not given a cooldown for this ability, meaning that Absolute Zero + a GCD- or sub-GCD-casttime Ice spell would allow it to extend Trick Attack and Chain Stratagem infinitely. It likely still wouldn't be worth the damage it'd cost the BLM itself, but even the idea that it may do so could oblige BLMs to forfeit their actual rotations in favor of going full-time buff-extending Ice Mages. This is a horrible idea.

Ultima: You do not want to attach such massive and iconic sources of damage to RNG. You've here fettered both BLM's most powerful spell and its second-most powerful to low proc rates, meaning that they more than likely will not see this spell even go off in a majority of dungeon boss fights, for instance. Allowing it to work off Sharpcast, however, would be little better, as it'd essentially kill what little decision making remains to that ability, as it'd absolutely have to spent on Xenoglossy alone. Any why have you made this oGCD? BLM has never had oGCD attacks. Ever. Only buffs. That's been core to its identity, even. And even if you make this the newest, coolest tactical nuke, that needs to do more than merely displace its current ones, else you're effectively just chopping off two main points of interest (Zeno and Foul) to replace them with a far slower, far more restrictive singular point. The latter is not a positive change. Additions are not necessarily additive; ones like this are instead more likely to be disruptive, or even destructive.

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Don't engage with this one. You're better than that. I'm not.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VictoriaLuv

Demi-Ultima - Trait/Spell

Requires 3 requirements -

Thunder spell must be active/casted on the target
Must have Switched from Ice to Fire - Dark Requiem Status effect
you must cast Flare 3 times in a row. This allows Flare turn into Demi Ultima

Ultima deals 750 Potency All nearby targets. same range as flare 100% chance to crit chance

Absolute Zero - Requires Umbra Ice 3 - Abiltity
Next Ice Spell casted freezes target solid for 2-3 seconds. with frozen effect. frozen effect is like a stun but also freezes debuffs/dots on the target extending there time. this one of few effects that will work on bosses it just wont stun them. instead place a 20% slow instead.

this spell extends timers for 2-3 seconds . dots of healers. duration of trick attack slow effect on arm's lengh however does not effect things from holy watch share dimishing returns with other stun effects

Ultima the actual spell

An idea to adding Ultima spell to Black Mages in FF14, Square could implement a proc system around the Polyglot and Enochian upkeep.
Xenoglossy would function as the skill that procs Ultima which could work one of two ways.

First method. Xenoglossy has a chance to proc Ultima which in this state would be an instant cast spell like Xenoglossy with a third less potency and is off GCD, a good estimate chance say being 20% to proc Ultima. And Ultima would in turn proc at a 30% rate to recover a Polyglot. This would make the interaction react somewhat back and forth on good rng sort of equivalent to how Dancer's Fan Dance and Fan Dance III combos work. While having to track the investment of good proc rate with balancing Enochian still.

Second Method would be Xenoglossy still has the proc function to mold into Ultima, but Ultima's potency is much higher than Xenoglossy and still has an off GCD component, however a 30-90 second cooldown and the chance to return a polyglot to recast Xenoglossy would be around 10% instead. Making Ultima into a solid huge nuke that can be rarely seen, but rewarding to get the chance of using during a fight.

Both methods could lead to some interesting extra gameplay additions to Black Mage while giving a spell some have been wondering if Black Mage will get.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by VictoriaLuv

rng isn't bad thing

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RNG will be good or bad depending on the gameplay it generates, which in turn will depend on the parameters and unique results of that RNG. RDM, for example, where the effective potency difference isn't huge and itself plays into a further mechanic via Flare/Holy? Fine. Old MCH, where you had high chances and multiple charges of guaranteed procs? Fine. This? Not fine. Too much rides on it with too little chance and too little control and no integral context.

Quote:

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A backend idea for how to spin Ultima into Black Mage lore in 14

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And let's be clear here. A toolkit ought exist for for the enjoyment of the player, not just to house old lore elements at minimum negative impact to playflow.

Yes, this could be worse. But it's hard to call it an overall positive, either. Absolute Zero is plain wonky. Ultima (as proc) is too gated to be seen in most fights outside of trials/raids. (Demi-)Ultima (as AoE, written earlier) is decent, but also just feels like an arbitrary tack-on, rather than something that'd make the existing actions themselves any more exciting through its addition; Triple-Flare (or Flare-Flare-Despair) is already plenty entertaining; you've now simply tacked a further 750n potency onto each time you do so, making Ethers tremendously necessary (while effectively removing Flare-Flare-Despair as an option).

Ultima should be for the end of days for 14 where they give up the toys to go nuts and melt faces

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

RNG will be good or bad depending on the gameplay it generates, which in turn will depend on the parameters and unique results of that RNG. RDM, for example, where the effective potency difference isn't huge and itself plays into a further mechanic via Flare/Holy? Fine. Old MCH, where you had high chances and multiple charges of guaranteed procs? Fine. This? Not fine. Too much rides on it with too little chance and too little control and no integral context.



And let's be clear here. A toolkit ought exist for for the enjoyment of the player, not just to house old lore elements at minimum negative impact to playflow.

Yes, this could be worse. But it's hard to call it an overall positive, either. Absolute Zero is plain wonky. Ultima (as proc) is too gated to be seen in most fights outside of trials/raids. (Demi-)Ultima (as AoE, written earlier) is decent, but also just feels like an arbitrary tack-on, rather than something that'd make the existing actions themselves any more exciting through its addition; Triple-Flare (or Flare-Flare-Despair) is already plenty entertaining; you've now simply tacked a further 750n potency onto each time you do so, making Ethers tremendously necessary (while effectively removing Flare-Flare-Despair as an option).

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Still want ultima be easy proc. specially with lore behind it. then might as well make it suicide attack completely evaporates you upon finished casting, you do not get it. ultima isn't just some spell thats easy to achieve. its a dangerious spell. very much kill the user. in not enough control introduced to the spell. do to the amount damage it deals. full spell or the complete spell. is equalivant to weapon that can wipe out a whole city. in an instant. ultima im suggesting is only 3% of that power. still keeps black mage intact as well not killing teammates everything else around you as well

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VictoriaLuv

Still want ultima be easy proc. specially with lore behind it. then might as well make it suicide attack completely evaporates you upon finished casting, you do not get it. ultima isn't just some spell thats easy to achieve. its a dangerious spell. very much kill the user. in not enough control introduced to the spell. do to the amount damage it deals. full spell or the complete spell. is equalivant to weapon that can wipe out a whole city. in an instant. ultima im suggesting is only 3% of that power. still keeps black mage intact as well not killing teammates everything else around you as well

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You're still not getting it. Ultima does not need to go into the BLM kit, in lore-fitting form or otherwise. The kit is there for engaging gameplay, not merely to play museum to spells from other iterations.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

You're still not getting it. Ultima does not need to go into the BLM kit, in lore-fitting form or otherwise. The kit is there for engaging gameplay, not merely to play museum to spells from other iterations.

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I second this; it wouldn't fit in terms of lore and would also look super off, even if it was turned into a newer Limit Break animation.