Put a cooldown on Medical Kit in Frontlines

I know this will go on deaf ears because the devs don't care about whitey/non-jp forums.

But Frontlines is nowhere near as punishable as it should be. A NIN can run in blow his entire kit in the middle of like 7 people medical kit 3 times and then jump out. Same with DRG.

Like a 3 second cooldown so you can't spam it when you're low hp would fix it. Or reduced effectiveness if you use it within 5 seconds of your previous usage.

Or anything to prevent spam using it because it's a crutch that helps bad players when they make bad decisions but it becomes absolutely broken when a good player uses it correctly.

And because of how the values update delayed in this game because of the god awful tick rate a lot of those are gonna be close to 5-6k Potency heals too if people are constantly dealing damage to you.

My feelings on potions in Frontlines are mixed.

For one, melee dps REALLY get shafted in Frontlines. You don't usually live long enough to get your rotations off, because everyone will be focusing you. You're also dealing with healers AOE and target healing, each of which is about as effective as a potion itself.

But on the flipside, potions are extremely strong. They're basically a second health bar, and most forms of hard CC just basically don't exist anymore to combat them. You literally can't be a lone DPS and pick off stragglers because by the time your opponent in Frontlines runs out of potions, he'll have 2-3 of his buddies coming to help. Fights last too long.

I don't know how to combat this except maybe reducing hp totals. Tanks are fine, they're meant to eat hits, but healers and other ranged DPS should be penalized down to maybe ~13000 (down from 15000 for ranged/magic dps and 17500 for healers). This means if a backline gets jumped there's a very real possibility for you to get kills before people pop potions.

Also, add crowd control/heal reduction back onto Dragoon's AOE. Make the bonuses for hitting several people with AOEs much more significant for non-tanks. Anything that inhibits zerg.

You will not making improvements if you are making excuse by blaming on a mechanic that everyone had access to it. If medic kit is really an issue , you will not see people with KD ration more than 5 kills

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Originally Posted by iAxX23

I know this will go on deaf ears because the devs don't care about whitey/non-jp forums.

But Frontlines is nowhere near as punishable as it should be. A NIN can run in blow his entire kit in the middle of like 7 people medical kit 3 times and then jump out. Same with DRG.

Like a 3 second cooldown so you can't spam it when you're low hp would fix it. Or reduced effectiveness if you use it within 5 seconds of your previous usage.

Or anything to prevent spam using it because it's a crutch that helps bad players when they make bad decisions but it becomes absolutely broken when a good player uses it correctly.

And because of how the values update delayed in this game because of the god awful tick rate a lot of those are gonna be close to 5-6k Potency heals too if people are constantly dealing damage to you.

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I think this is kind of a misdirection for how PvP is played in 5.X.

In general, the paradigm has shifted further away from burst, and more toward attrition. They gave everyone potions, and while they used to have separate ones from tanks and melee compared to ranged and healers, now we all have the same universal Medkit that can heal potentially the same amount, and everyone has the same charges. While tanks and melee have an easier time getting more value, the general shift is it means everyone's collective HP pool is bigger, which means tanks and melee have a smaller HP pool advantage, which to no surprise meant that as melee arguably had better survivability than tanks, they had to shift huge buffs to tank team sustain in a recent patch.


But I digress. Now, it's a lot less about being able to kill someone outright in the context of FL. The reason why ranged are strong is because despite their general inferior lethality to melee, they can tax enemy resources more safely. Medkits, cooldowns, adrenaline, MP, are exhausted, and as product, the enemy either has to retreat, or die. If a ninja has to burn all three medkits and two charges of Shikuchi, it would be a win for the enemy team. They are no longer participating in an engagement to their full potential, and are no longer a threat for a key objective.

I'd say if there was anything I'd like changed about the new system, is to change Medical Kits to be based on maximum HP to better emphasize the intended differences of durability between roles. Cooldowns? Ehh. I feel like this is more a fixation of people obsessed over killing for killing's sake. Useful, and will get you points, but only one half of a coin.

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Originally Posted by Kagahami

My feelings on potions in Frontlines are mixed.

For one, melee dps REALLY get shafted in Frontlines. You don't usually live long enough to get your rotations off, because everyone will be focusing you. You're also dealing with healers AOE and target healing, each of which is about as effective as a potion itself.

But on the flipside, potions are extremely strong. They're basically a second health bar, and most forms of hard CC just basically don't exist anymore to combat them. You literally can't be a lone DPS and pick off stragglers because by the time your opponent in Frontlines runs out of potions, he'll have 2-3 of his buddies coming to help. Fights last too long.

I don't know how to combat this except maybe reducing hp totals. Tanks are fine, they're meant to eat hits, but healers and other ranged DPS should be penalized down to maybe ~13000 (down from 15000 for ranged/magic dps and 17500 for healers). This means if a backline gets jumped there's a very real possibility for you to get kills before people pop potions.

Also, add crowd control/heal reduction back onto Dragoon's AOE. Make the bonuses for hitting several people with AOEs much more significant for non-tanks. Anything that inhibits zerg.

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Ehh. Kind of. The game is such that, the closer you are to a greater number of enemies, the more damage you are taking, As such, melee are supposed to be opportunistic. They take small engagements, attack people off to a side, or wait for something to disrupt the enemy enough to do work. A melee who died before they could get off their full rotation has probably over-extended, and they are in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Keep in mind DRG is one of the top DPS in FL right now, along with SMN, BLM, and arguably BRD. Most of this is because they have such a good midrange game, increasing the scope of their opportunity to deal damage, while still having the burst to deliver kills like the other melee. I am in favour of talking about shifts in design, but it would have to come at a cost because DRG is already really good. MNK could be good in 4.X but think they definitely need help in FL for 5.X, perhaps a ranged attack to open chakras and refresh GL. SAM needs a little help, too.

That's more the enemy being bad than medical kits being good. When every phys has at least a silence (and most take the bind or heavy additional too) - and everyone and their nan plays Bard, sleep also pseudo interrupts and locks a gcd, then you have weapon throws, holms, stun etc, you realistically can die before even using a single defensive.

Dragoon is an issue, but don't let that take away the fact FL is full of people who aren't exactly competant and won't kill you in a 4 second lockout.

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Originally Posted by iAxX23

I know this will go on deaf ears because the devs don't care about whitey/non-jp forums.
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You've never experienced a Live Letter or Q&A have you? Which takes questions world wide and I have seen plenty of NA questions being answered. Yoshida has even answered questions for Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/wiki/pax_2020_interview

But more on topic, no. Players aren't bad, they just know how to survive. Tanks often serving as bait because they know someone will be dumb enough to chase them while the ranged get hits in and complete objectives. If people targeted healers as top priority, followed by ranged- they wouldn't even get a chance at using the med kit.

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Originally Posted by Esmoire

I am in favour of talking about shifts in design, but it would have to come at a cost because DRG is already really good. MNK could be good in 4.X but think they definitely need help in FL for 5.X, perhaps a ranged attack to open chakras and refresh GL. SAM needs a little help, too.

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I agree that mnk needs help but SAM is the tankiest boy out of all the melee right now + has a dash that deals damage, which I think is a good niche.

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Originally Posted by Leareaux

I agree that mnk needs help but SAM is the tankiest boy out of all the melee right now + has a dash that deals damage, which I think is a good niche.

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Yeah. That's fair. SAM is pretty tanky. I think this is something we will be able to appreciate better on Shatter where the ability to have high sustained DPS against an objective with hostile threats nearby is pretty helpful. Guess I'll reserve my judgment until we can see the changes and the return of the other maps to the daily challenge.