Bigger-picture Bard feedback maybe

Yet another thread on this stuff, but I thought it valuable to back up a bit and get away from specific suggestions that are all too easy to get into fine-details debates about.

If SE is truly as lost as they said in figuring out what to do, the most useful feedback isn't going to be "you should do exactly x". Better to give a more general sense of what people want, and leave them to figure out the details.

I think there are three important points, all told:


1) All three ranged are too far behind and need significant buffs, assuming nerfs to high-performing jobs are off the table as usual.

Once groups have some gear and don't need every scrap of Vitality, it's likely going to be considered optimal not to bring a ranged at all (even with the party losing 1% to mainstat in the process). This will be especially true if/when NIN and SAM are made competitive with at least DRG, let alone MNK, in the melee space.

This is an important point, because it makes job changes for design or QoL reasons easier when you don't actually need to offset gains. Particularly for Bard, for whom a lot of the complaints / issues are only really addressable in ways that would result in increased damage contribution of some kind.

It is critical though, that whatever might be done for Bard, to make sure that the other two ranged are buffed by similar amounts (perhaps Dancer by a smidge more) to keep the three ranged dps balanced amongst themselves, as they have been so far.


2) Bards' desire for party utility is much more about "feeling" than numerical power.

By and large, I don't think Bards expect to be adding as much damage to the group as i.e. Ninja or Dancer. Maybe they expect to add a bit more than they do now, but in the end that's not really the point. What they care about is feel and flavor.

Although it wasn't a good design overall, the passive crit bonus had this flavor of "I'm constantly helping the party". And despite its clunkiness, the flexibility of Foe Requiem encouraged Bards to consider when it was best to use it. That creates a feeling of "I'm putting in thought and effort to be better at supporting my party".

Battle Voice fails on this front, because it's a button that you simply press when it lights up, or at most you hold it in the same way you hold a Battle Litany or any other party buff.

There's no uniqueness there at all, and that matters too. No other job had anything like the passive crit buff, and no other job had anything like Foe Requiem. The uniqueness of those things furthered that feeling of "this is a job that specializes in support" in Stormblood.

These kinds of feelings are the point of all this. It's about giving players the feeling of "I'm supporting my group with songs" when they play Bard. That's all that really matters. The numerical outcome is secondary at best; it follows from those feelings, it's not what drives them.


To try and hit the mark on what players are looking for, SE should ideally aim for song skill designs that are flexible, unique, and feel useful/impactful - even if the bottom line math ends up being that they're only worth ~half or whatever of what Dancer adds in sum.

Using DH for Battle Voice is an example of a good call on the impactful front, because it lets you use a fat number (20%) for a mediocre (just under 5%) buff, making it feel more impactful than it actually is. Things with shorter durations despite higher frequency, or buffs that split among physical/magical damage types, are other examples of ways this can be done on the damage buff side.

In terms of flexibility, the charge system is an obvious candidate as it would also be unique (no other job has charged raid buffs), or dipping back into MP, or re-imagining the Soul Gauge. The important thing is to present timing decisions, it doesn't matter too much how.


Defensively, Nature's Minne is a good contribution and probably the only skill that brings any true support feel to Bard at all. Unfortunately it's undermined a little by how poorly it compares to Mantra, which the strongest job in the game gets to have for seemingly free. Warden's is neat but unfortunately too rarely used to register in the hearts of most Bards.

While pushing defensive support is a little scary because it can "tie-break" otherwise balanced jobs, historically non-res stuff hasn't been a major factor in job preference since the days of permanent -10% int madness. Making Warden's slightly useful or giving Minne some small edge over Mantra should not have major negative consequences. Tactician could be made a bit better as a counter to Bard/Dancer heal stuffs if needed too.


3) Other QoL issues and concerns should not be ignored.

Many of the ones for Bard are enumerated here, and to touch on the other ranged a bit, MCH's ping issues really are not okay, and I'm sure DNC could use a little QoL (if nothing else re: Improv) as well.


Again, I kind of don't want to get too in the weeds of specific suggestions here, there are multiple other threads for that, but please bump if you agree / disagree with the general goals laid out here. (mainly of (2) I guess, as (1) is just fact stuff)

I don't know how much we can really expect NA forum Bard feedback to be considered in light of the burning riots that are apparently going on over on the JP side, but there's nothing for it but to try and pitch in some thoughts as usefully as we can think to do.