Bard in FF14 is so much like Hunter without Pet in Ragnarok Online

And Bard in Ragnarok Online is way more of a Bard than Shadowbringer's Bard....
Just saying.

https://irowiki.org/wiki/Bard

Isn't this a JRPG fantasy game or is it becoming lazy like WoW on the job design?

SE, you were so close in Stormblood, so close to get it right. What a pity.

Please further explain how they became lazy? So far Bard is in a good spot is this a troll post???

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Originally Posted by giwaman

Please further explain how they became lazy? So far Bard is in a good spot is this a troll post???

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Good spot for refulgent and procing and DPS wise. The DPS mechanic side, I have no complaint, but can you elaborate on how are all the songs and utilities disappeared make it in a good spot?
Or are you simply trolling? Cause if you can compare what I said with the Bard in Ragnarok, you can certainly make a conclusion. Even a primary school kid can tell.

If you objectively look at things, the bard rotation got much better in ShB. They improved on many poor elements of RNG that plagued the job. Both single target and aoe rotations are much smoother, fast paced and fun to play now. Overall the current iteration is far more fun to play then the older one. Sure we lost some utility but the trade off is we have a much better and improved core combat and gameplay. This being my personal opinion. I also personally feel that bard should of never had a base class of archer. Archers/hunters/rangers in almost every game conceivable are always about high physical ranged damage with high mobility and no cast times with forms of side utility to assist the party through CC , buffs and/or debuffs. Bard as a core concept and design is much better served if it was the advanced job of a spell based caster class.

Either way I think they are on the right track if they keep all the core rotational changes and potentially introduce some new forms of utility/party utility they can elevate the job even further. Overall though I am a having a blast playing my bard, it is fast paced, non linear with elements of rng that make optimizing and split second decisions prevalent. I find many other jobs more linear to play which can become stale as most their inputs are always predetermined with little to no variance or little to no reactive play.

Also the core concept for bard is still intact, they could even make it so that songs were not just a personal buff which changed our rotation, they could maybe attach some party utility/buffs to our songs to also impact our teammates via the form of giving them buffs or maybe even debuffing our enemies based on the song that we are playing at the time.

The current bard plays directly into his own headphones now, thats why the old song buffs are no longer avaible to the party. Except for when he wants to show he cares about others and plays a song to them, except the brd himself doesnt listen to it since it is played in a frequency that brds cant hear...

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Originally Posted by Silkerin

The current bard plays directly into his own headphones now, thats why the old song buffs are no longer avaible to the party. Except for when he wants to show he cares about others and plays a song to them, except the brd himself doesnt listen to it since it is played in a frequency that brds cant hear...

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LOL, I had a good laugh. This.
We are a bard who plays three songs into our headphones no one else can hear.... then there is the shout we can't hear it ourselves. And there are some one one person songs that only one can hear.

For example, that one song that cures aliment except when the raid savage boss put affliction on, it's so painful, the song does nothing. LOL

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Originally Posted by Silkerin

The current bard plays directly into his own headphones now, thats why the old song buffs are no longer avaible to the party. Except for when he wants to show he cares about others and plays a song to them, except the brd himself doesnt listen to it since it is played in a frequency that brds cant hear...

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More like he shouts while still having his own noise-proof headphones on and that's why he can't hear it lol.

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Originally Posted by TcomJ

Good spot for refulgent and procing and DPS wise. The DPS mechanic side, I have no complaint, but can you elaborate on how are all the songs and utilities disappeared make it in a good spot?
Or are you simply trolling? Cause if you can compare what I said with the Bard in Ragnarok, you can certainly make a conclusion. Even a primary school kid can tell.

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Objectively not having utility/support doesn’t automatically mean that it’s bad design, nor lazy.

It’s a design you personally agree with, it’s not a fact so please stop treating it so.

Just because u prefer ragnaroks bard doesn’t mean I do. It’s not how it works.

The rotations smooth, it works together. And it isn’t flawed objectively. Simply it doesn’t suit you.

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Originally Posted by Drayos

Objectively not having utility/support doesn’t automatically mean that it’s bad design, nor lazy.

The rotations smooth, it works together. And it isn’t flawed objectively. Simply it doesn’t suit you.

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It does when the job is question has an identity defined by that utility and support.

Nobody is claiming that Bards current toolkit doesn’t work mechanically or numerically, just that it doesn’t match up with what the job is being sold as (a battle hardened archer that sings in the heat of battle to inspire their comrades). And I’ve seen quite a lot of other players voicing the same concerns about Bard losing its identity, so this isn’t an issue limited to the OP (obvious confirmation bias). At the very least I personally agree with them that Bard has dropped its identity of favour of an ‘archery’ focus that has dominated the jobs identity, instead of being a balance between the archery and musical aspects

You say you’re giving an objective opinion then state you think the job works.But consider if you’d have the same ‘objective’ opinion if you didn’t think the job worked? If you though the job would be a balance of support and damage with musical and archer elements (like it was sold as), would you still say it’s ‘objectively’ fine?

There’s nothing wrong with saying that you believe that Bard is fine in its current iteration. Nobody is trying to take it away from you. But throwing around the word ‘objective’ doesn’t lend any legitimacy your argument, because nobody is ever truly objective.

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Originally Posted by Drayos

Objectively not having utility/support doesn’t automatically mean that it’s bad design, nor lazy.

It’s a design you personally agree with, it’s not a fact so please stop treating it so.

Just because u prefer ragnaroks bard doesn’t mean I do. It’s not how it works.

The rotations smooth, it works together. And it isn’t flawed objectively. Simply it doesn’t suit you.

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Like Connor said.

But I have to ask, are you seriously thinking you are more objective in your view reading the job description as it was explained and the job title is literally Bard. I'm not sure how many RPG games out there you place, but this is so far removed Bard.