DPS or no DPS isn't the problem

Hi all,

Sounds a little bit provocative, but it's on purpose. To start the debate, because yes it’s a debate ( I hope, but it’s the internet so…). I’m not foolish enough to think SE will take this thread into account, furthermore 1 month before ShB release. But see it like an exercise, what are your ideas? I’ll start by exposing the problem and then add my ideas. I’ll be happy to read yaours.

We all know there is a war between two ideologies: Should healer DPS or not? First let’s begin by setting aside people who don’t want to play, don’t want to push buttons. Those are… I don’t know… why are you playing again?

Now the problem is obvious: it’s not DPS vs no DPS. It’s: what am I doing when my party is full HP? Nothing new here, every healer on both sides already know that. But let’s dig a little bit deeper.

I see 2 separate problems here.

1. Currently the only possibility to fill this gape is DPSing. Because, there is nothing else to do. The only specific role of healer is to keep the HP bars full. Ok some esuna from time to time but, yeah…
2. There is only 3 ways of healing: direct, hot or shield. There are multiple ways to apply those type of healing: casting, instant, pet, aoe, zones, single target but at the ends it’s only 3 ways and it’s a little bit boring.

Here are my ideas, suggestions about those 2 problems.

Firstly, for the down time. Aside of needing more heal, either by mobs hitting harder or less effective heals, another solution is to add other mechanics that only healers can take care of

• add heal rotation, with either heal bonus the more you follow the rotation or buff at the end of the rotation.
• Stack of debuff that needs to be cleaned in a certain order (with different skills)
• Debuffs which needs a combination of skills to be cleaned
• Debuffs on 2 people which needs to be cleaned in a given order
• Debuffs which change incoming healing into damage.
• Debuffs that cannot be cleaned but must be absorbed by the healer with a skill and then be cleaned.
• A mechanism that allows to transfer none cleanable debuffs on other players.
• Debuff that increase by a lot the aggro of the healer when the target is healed.
• Uncleanable dot that ticks really slowly but really hard and each tick can be nullified by a skill.
• A dot that ticks harder and harder but can be reset by a skill.

Secondly, only 3 types of heal, but there is so much more possibility.

• Canalisation heal, as long as you cast there is healing (like the Fey Union but for the healer)
• Leech heal, you put a mark on someone and then DPS mobs. A percentage of the damage is transformed into healing.
• Buff on a DPS which changes its damage into healing (yeah, I know, my ideas are becoming worst)
  

And here are some ideas of how to add variety in how to apply those heal:

• For full party, skills that can only be activated when both healers use it. (in a time window)
• A short radius hot aoe following the healer for 10 sec, forcing him to go at melee range to apply heal and thus take risk
• A heal with potency related to the distance of the target (either the further the better or the opposite)
• A heal with potency related to the number of people around the healer.
• A weak hot that can stack to get stronger and stronger.
• Skill which you can be applied on the mobs which transform the next attack into heal (not all of them)
• For shields, more than one type of shield : hot shield, debuff shield, magic shield, physic shield.
• Strong shield which prevents healing while applied.
• Shield that deals damage if not deplated at the end of its timer.

That’s the ideas wandering in my head right now. I’m interested into yours and your comment about mine (oh god, why am I asking that on the internet).

Darky

I'd love to see more interesting mechanics for healers, though I don't think having a buff (shield) that is physical or magical dmg aligned is such a good idea. I struggled in HW knowing what to use with dark mind and what skills it was useless against. There are too many instances and mobs in game now to reliably be able to remember what to use where and it will only get worse.

My contribution to the the thread is allowing healers to transform/explode their HOT or their shields for a quick burst heal on the target if needed. You could even make that a burst of dmg, or an area cleanse (esuna).

The core issue with your ideas (many of which I find interesting at least in terms of occasional mechanics) is that they all substantially raise the skill floor for healers in casual content.

Please don't misunderstand, I don't personally find this to be problematic... but SE will.

For some time now healers in casual content have had very little that they actually need to do. Keeping the party alive is almost never an issue in dungeons and in content with two healers one can usually pick up the slack of the other. Sure, getting two... um... "differently skilled" healers in one party on a fight with some kind of heal-check can be challenging but this doesn't happen too often.

Let's look at what happens when people are forced to deal with more HPS demands in light party content - the Mist Dragon. I could tell you all about how I literally healed this fight from 75% as a RDM but for some reason occasionally esuna-ing a dot while dodging and tossing some AoE healing is already too much for some. Either they get overwhelmed with the healing requirements and people die to unavoidable damage or they focus on the healing and themselves fall victim to mechanical failure. This is evident in the calls for nerfs both on the OF and Reddit.

This all boils down to how wide the skill gap is in this game. If SE wants to force more skilled players to heal more and dps less by raising the mechanical and healing thresholds of an average encounter they would alienate the least skilled part of this pool; the "forum princess healer" if you will. They don't want to do this, this is why there has never been direct feedback on the issue of healer dps - some people want to RP as an hp battery and SE wants their sub as well.

Tl;dr- I like a lot of it but the bads are too bad to keep up. Maybe we'll see mechs like these in raids which could be cool but some people can't manage as-is so we all must suffer.

@Lozza oh yeah shield explosion is a great idea, like hearthly stars but with shield and single target ^^

@Veis_Alveare Yeah you're right, but you could adjust the consequence of not following those mechanism.

Like DPS don't following rotation make less DPS. This isn't an issue in normal dungeon because there is no DPS check but becomes one in raid where you have DPS check.

You can adjust that with my ideas too. In normal mode, the consequence is a little bit damage on the target that you can heal throug if you want. So people following mechanism are entertain all along with multiple tasks and people don't following mechanism are forced to heal more. And in raids, it's an instadeath if the mechanism isn't done.

Or another idea to force healing : each unused GCD from a healer triggers an aoe dealing damage to the whole party ;) (this is a joke)

TBH, I don't really have a problem with the majority of healer toolkits. I don't want more DPS buttons. The number of heal buttons I have are fine.

My biggest problem with FF14, then, is the ratio in which I push them. I push my DPS buttons a lot more than my heal buttons. That I don't like very much.

Of course there are ways that specific kits could be improved (lillies anyone?), but I feel the above is more of a fundamental/foundational problem.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

TBH, I don't really have a problem with the majority of healer toolkits. I don't want more DPS buttons. The number of heal buttons I have are fine.

My biggest problem with FF14, then, is the ratio in which I push them. I push my DPS buttons a lot more than my heal buttons. That I don't like very much.

Of course there are ways that specific kits could be improved (lillies anyone?), but I feel the above is more of a fundamental/foundational problem.

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I'm the complete opposite. I can't stand games that require a chain of 4 healing abilities over, and over again. And, if they ever dumb down the SCH role that much I'm finished with FF14.

On my WHM I spend more time dodging colored lights than either healing or dps'ing.

I like the leech heal idea if it was something you could maybe only use every so often. Would be kind of cool if it worked like Synnastry for AST except instead of healing the target with a % of heals that went to other players, it healed the target with a % of heals based on DPS done. Mix that with Cleric and that would be pretty sweet.