[Writer's Note: Unfortunately, I ended up going over the 11,000 character per post cap when writing this up, so this thread is divided between this starting entry, and a second one just below it. Apologies for the required double post due to my verbosity!]
I'm sure this has been brought up in previous threads, so forgive me if this is an idea or a topic that has been overdone. I'm hoping that it has not been, for the sake of not overdoing it.
Let me also preface what I am about to throw out on to the forums by saying that I totally and completely understand that in the grand scheme of this train wreck of a situation with Final Fantasy XIV, there are a plethora of other issues that need to be fixed that are surely more important than this. I don't presume to think that this topic is more important than matters of complete and total battle system redesign, deeper quests, overhauls to the armory system, whatever. Still, it never hurts to suggest things that down the line could be considered, and perhaps even liked, right?
So, rambling aside, let's talk housing.
I'm going to piss off the "This game needs to stop trying to be Final Fantasy XI Version 2.0" crowd and just come out and refer to FFXI right here and now, but hopefully the reason for bringing it up can be tolerated: one of the things I really liked about FFXI was the Mog House. It was something that not a lot of other MMOs out there have, really. How long has a certain, most popular MMO flirted with the idea, but never got around to it, for example? More than that, how many MMOs out there that had respectable market shares in the genre have them? Why, I bet you'd only be able to count on one hand. Off the top of my head, all I can even think of is the aforementioned FFXI, EverQuest 2, and Ultima Online. Yes, that UO, the MMO that basically trailblazed MMOs all the way back in the late 90s.
Back to Mog Houses, though, I loved them. They were fun. They were a place where I could throw gil at not for any real reason other than for the sake of enjoyment, and maybe a little "Lookit my swag!" with friends I invited over. Mannequins, awesome beds, a myriad of event items, fish, desks, chairs (well, more stools, which we couldn't even use ... derp), dividers which could give a Mog House a feel of being more than one room. I could go on, but basically, it felt like your slice of the game. It was something you and you alone had, and were individually able to change.
And when I realized that they basically blew up any sort of personal housing in FFXIV, I was quite saddened. It seems almost as though they were trying to add it somehow, whether it's by noticing zone lines in the cities that are not accessible (the Lily Hills in Gridania to use an example), or even the uselessness of the innkeepers in each city at the moment. Whatever the case, it's been something that has basically been dead from the get-go, no mention of them I can recall in interviews, and even if it was, it's been largely pushed aside or mentioned in a very minimal capacity.
Anyway. I've done enough rambling without any sort of actual meat and potatoes to this thread, so let's get to my idea. I admit, I'm no game developer, programmer, whatever; I'm just some bum who wants to see this game succeed, and after throwing this idea around with a few other MMO friends of mine, tinkering here and there, decided I'd toss out what I came up with and see if it stuck.
[SIZE="5"]Getting personal housing[/SIZE]
Now, this may end up vexing some people, but let me get this out of the way: I think that if housing is implemented in Final Fantasy XIV, it should not just be something given to you the moment you make a new character, a total stranger, who wanders in to a city-state looking for adventure. It should be something you earn. Something you can feel proud about putting a little bit of effort in to attaining.
But don't worry! I don't want to make it some sort of herculean task which takes getting to end game to do. No, what I would like to see is it somehow tied in to your character themselves actually earning it, through their deeds in their starting city-state. So to give an example of the requirements I had in mind ...
First, a rank requirement. Nothing extreme, and especially considering the rate of leveling up nowadays, probably a real pushover in just one day. For this, let's say Rank 10 in any job. By this point, you will have completed a good few storyline missions, and should be known around where you began. It makes sense, then, you'd begin to look for a place to live, from an in-game standpoint.
Secondly, a quest line. Again, nothing extreme. At the worst, a two-part quest line in which you would learn about housing, prove to the city-state that you're deserving of personal property and a place to live, and what have you. At the end of it? Congratulations! You now have a humble abode to begin living in.
[SIZE="5"]Types of housing[/SIZE]
Much like Final Fantasy XI, no two housings should be alike, especially when it comes to the different styles one can see when comparing the three city-states currently available to explore and start in in Eorzea. A place to live in Gridania is hardly going to have the same aesthetics as a place in Ul'dah, considering Gridania is a spread out forest city-state, whilst Ul'dah is by and large a giant, Jeuno-esque city with a tower at the base of the city, and Limsa Lominsa is pretty much numerous, connected cliffs over the sea itself.
This is also something I wanted to see done differently from Final Fantasy XI, with the majority of my inspiration coming from Ultima Online. To give an example ...
http://www.uoherald.com/node/220
Even considering that the stress on servers and computers back then is likely nowhere near what FFXIV is now, you have to confess to be impressed that they could have such a varied amount of places to live, not just in how the houses looked, but the sizes. From one room huts to whole castles, even!
Why bring this up? Well, simple: I'd like to see a mechanic for housing which would allow for players to not only be able to actually get their hands on personal housing, but even have the opportunity to upgrade them in size. Remember that much like in FFXI, housing was all instanced for the owner, so larger residences would by and large not be an issue, in my personal opinion, since it isn't like a zone would change depending on the players and what they own.
Anyway, what I would like to see is at least three to four different levels of housing, for each city-state, each upgrade befitting the style and design of the city-state. Let me give you one example by using Ul'dah ...
Tier 1: Basically your one room, Mog House-esque place of residence. Everyone has to start somewhere, after all.
Tier 2: Further renovation, or moving to a larger place (whatever justification you wish to use) would give you a second room with which to wander about, fill with furniture, and so on.
Tier 3: Another upgrade, another room. Perhaps even at this point there could be discussion for some sort of special function to your place of living, though I can't say I've worked the details out yet. Truly I've been more focused on just having housing, period.
Tier 4: This is where, being the creme de la creme, you'd see a very impressive change. Basically, Ul'dah being very much in the spirit of living in apartment-esque complexes and buildings, would also have multi-floor suites, penthouses, whatever you want to call it. By this point you would have four rooms, and not just one floor, but two, with two rooms on each. Talk about swanky, right?
So that's just a very rough idea right there of how Ul'dah's system might work. Limsa Lominsa, and Gridania, being entirely different and unique places, would have different places. Perhaps a top tier Limsa Lominsa abode would give the player a beautiful view of the ocean that his residence is atop? As for Gridania, well it's hard to explain, but if you have some time when the servers go up again, head to the Lily Hill zone line, and look at the house off in the distance. It sits on a small cliff with wooden support beams holding it up. Wouldn't that be a great idea there, with a view of the forest down below to soak in, for example?
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03-20-2011, 04:57 PMSatisiun[Suggestion] Housing: old ideas, new ideas, borrowed ideas, and how to make it work.
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03-20-2011, 04:58 PMSatisiun
[SIZE="5"]Upgrading housing[/SIZE]
This was something I hemmed and hawed about for a while, actually. What sort of prerequisites should there be? Should there even be any? What should it involve? Quests, kind of like the Mog Safe upgrade quests in Final Fantasy XI? Or maybe just cold, hard gil that you can throw at some NPC who would then make your place bigger/move you to a larger place? Level requirement, maybe, like how you had one to even get a place in the beginning?
In the end, I decided to go with a couple of those. The reason being, to me, I didn't like the idea of low-ranked folks somehow, for whatever reason, having access to a high end residence. What sense did that make, either from an in-game universe standpoint, or otherwise? What's more, I again wanted people to feel as if they had something to attain, something to work towards. So much of MMOs are about carrots on a stick after all, and I figured this should be no exception, while also not being so impossibly daunting that no one wants to do it.
The requirements that spoke to me the most were as follows ...
Gil - This made the most sense to me. After all, a bigger place should cost more money. It's simply how things work in life, be it real or fantasy. The first upgrade shouldn't be too big of a hit to your wallet, but further ones should definitely require taking more gil out of the economy.
Level - Let's put it this way; why should an adventurer who is still making a name for themselves be able to have a four room suite in Ul'dah, when they only just got a place to live? A friend of mine rightfully pointed out her concern about "twinks" just getting oodles of gil, and plowing through to the best housing the moment they got to Rank 10.
To stop that, I thought that perhaps there should be a Rank requirement before you can upgrade your residence. That said, every 10 rank seemed not only doable, but respectable, and also not something so far off that it seemed too daunting to players. So in essence, Rank 10? One room. 20? Two. 30? Three. 40? Four, plus the second floor. It fits with the idea that you are an adventurer rising up the ranks -- figuratively and literally -- and in turn capable of having a more respectable place to live.
Time - Do you remember how you could only upgrade your place once every real-life week in Final Fantasy XI? Yeah. Basically, I didn't think it would be a good idea if people could just power their way through in under a couple weeks.
I admit, there may be some excess overlap considering the time needed to get levels in job rank, and basically waiting a week between potential house upgrades. But I figured this would give people the time to savor what they've earned before barging along to a larger place.
[SIZE="5"]Final thoughts[/SIZE]
In the end, this is just one idea amidst a sea of many. And like I said, I understand housing may not be the #1 biggest, most important priority for Final Fantasy XIV right now. But to me, I think it is something that would add some real meat on the bones of an otherwise very bare game, which has little to do beyond the grind. The ability to use excess, piling up gil on furniture, on a place to live, and just have a place to go and take your friends intrigues me, and excites me. It also adds something to strive for, thanks to the way that the process of attaining a place to live occurs, not to mention the upgrading process as well. Who knows, maybe other things could be added to make residential housing more than just personal eye candy, like access to your retainer there, a (desperately needed) mailbox system, or even something new and different that I nor anyone else is even thinking about just yet.
Whatever the case, I am certain that this is something that needs to be brought back. It's something not many MMOs have, like I said much earlier, and would add some legitimacy to this game when it comes to player content. -
03-20-2011, 05:19 PMLdempsey
for the larger house, possibly have an option to add simple facilities for a craft of your choice, or be able to set up a small store with your retainer if you wanted. Houses have many options, being instanced zones. idk what the requirements would be server side for the more complex ideas, but I think they should at least be able to implement some simple house, possibly with the ability to put chests in it, as a crafter extra storage space is always nice
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03-20-2011, 05:29 PMBelgianRofl
I'm sorry, but you are crazy if you think SE is going to take the time translate and read this wall of text. You should break it down into bullet points. I'm very interested in what you have to say on the matter as well..
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03-20-2011, 05:54 PMSatisiunSigh.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
The things I do at 4:30 in the morning. Alright, then. Just for you, Belgian, a bullet point layout for each section.
Getting personal housing- A required Rank of 10 is needed prior to getting your first place to live. This would give players a sense of something to work towards. It's also easy enough, since getting to Rank 10 is so easy now.
- A quest line would follow, in which the city-state you started in recognizes what you've done so far. Just a couple quests at most, and at the end of it, you'd be given access to a place to live in your city-state.
Types of housing- Each city-state would have a theme to their housing which fits with the city's style, like how FFXI had differing interiors to each Mog House depending on the nation.
- Each residence would also be able to be upgraded. There would be anywhere between three and four upgrades, each one adding a room, and perhaps even a second floor to the house/suite/whatever by the end.
Upgrading housing- You would have to meet a requirement before you can upgrade your house further. You wouldn't be able to just go from a one room to a top tier place in one sitting if you have tons of gil.
- The ways to upgrade could require waiting (time), attaining a certain rank (20, 30, 40, each 10 ranks giving you a chance to upgrade), or quests (a friend actually just recommended even quests involving favors for the Carpentry guild, and in turn they upgrade your place, either for free or for a modest sum).
- Whichever way, it would also require gil. That's how housing works, after all. But you'd still have to meet other requirements so you can't just buy everything the second you get a place to live.
In conclusion? I need coffee because of how late it is. Good night. :p
@Ldempsey - Thank you for your own suggestion as well. Yes, that is actually one thing to consider. Perhaps if there was a four-tier system, at the third tier of house upgrades, you would then get a room which you can pick and devote to a craft of your choice, with the ability to change it later for a price of gil. Perhaps to stop people from just changing it ad nauseum as well, they would only be able to do so one every real life week. -
03-20-2011, 05:55 PMPicoman
Im looking forward to player housing. I would be surprised if it hasn't been developed in any way over the years.
Looking forward to the next letter from the producer. Should contain more information on Grand Companies and possibly company housing, which may give a better idea of what personal housing could be like.
I would also be very surprised if furniture hasn't been developed in any way. Im sure its just a matter of time, when all the pieces of the jig-saw come together, that we will see the big picture. -
03-21-2011, 02:02 AMSatisiunSee, that was my thinking even before the game's release. Back when a lot of people thought there was going to be some 'miracle' patch after beta that would implement a plethora of things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Picoman
Especially because all three areas had two things in particular:
-A zone line which was cordoned off, but seemed to give the impression of access to a residential area. Like I used as an example, Lily Hills in Gridania.
-There was also the useless tavern/inn NPC (who might I add is still suspiciously, well, useless). I had thought perhaps instead of Rent-A-Rooms like in FFXI, they planned to do something involving inn rooms at the different city-state Adventurer's Guilds, both because of the NPCs as well as, well, come on. Why make them? And why even make a tavern icon separate from the Adventurer's Guild icon that appears on the map as well?
See, I'm also interested in if there may be some sort of Company housing, though personally I'd much rather see individual housing implemented first, if either is in the pipe line. I respect that some may feel differently, but I'd sooner players get their own, individual places to call their own, over having to join a guild just to get access to a place to congregate in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Picoman
Not that I don't want them, period! Just ... priorities, really. -
03-21-2011, 02:22 AMMega
I support all of this!!+1 Housing is great. Earning it and its expansions sounds even better. I would like to see upgrades become exponentially difficult. The most memorable moment of the mog house is dropping your subjob to be the epic warrior who made it to end game without a sub lol.
I never tricked out my mog house in XI but I would like the opportunity to try again. -
03-21-2011, 03:27 AMBelgianRofl
Thank you for breaking it down for me. I agree with this system. There needs to be some sense of ownership in Eorzea. Right now there is none. I also think there should be some physical housing around the world that people could rent for exorbitant amounts of gil. There could also be instanced apartment complexes, so semi-rich ppl could use those areas closer to the markets of the towns, rather than further away in the slums.
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03-21-2011, 03:48 AMSatisiunPhysical housing was something I considered with my idea, actually. But I felt that, unfortunately, it would be too complicated. And while I'm no computer engineer or programmer, it also seemed like it would put too much strain on the servers or on required loading or what have you. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
Still, and this is just in my wildest imaginations, I remember back in the days of UO, the player community actually creating and maintaining towns that were entirely player housing. In a "If I could have everything I wanted" scenario, I would love to see those currently very neglected hamlets all over Eorzea (you know the ones; each region except for Mor Dhona has two of them) actually have such a thing. An actual, tangible building or three that players can be allowed to live in.
And it's not just because of the "Oh, wow, a place I can see that isn't just instanced!" either, but the fact it would give people an excuse to go to the hamlets. As it is right now, they're just sad little places with no reason or rhyme to visit, except when you go on a crafting job quest, with no shops, no buildings you can enter, no nothing. Selbina/Mhaura those places certainly aren't.