does PLD generate enmity less than the other 2 tank?

just wondering, after my drk reach 70 i though i level my pld too.

and it seems i lose my aggro more frequently than drk when it come to mobs. no problem on single target/boss thankfully.

You may need to work in some more flashes then if you're losing agro, or if you're not using circle of scorn, make sure you're hitting that too once the mobs are all gathered up.

I don't have the experience with DRK to really compare it to pld but if you're losing enmity on aoe, using Flash more is about all you can do. Now you don't need to ONLY spam flash you should have time for total eclipses too once you have a lead.

What are you doing for these mob pulls where you're losing agro as a paladin?

^nothing, i just the same method from my drk.

enmity range pull -> enmity aoe x2
in case of drk = unmend -> unleash x2
in case of pld = shield lob -> circle scorn -> flash

then the usual enmity combo, but nevertheless, there is always 1 or 2 enemy lose my aggro after a while if my party is heavy aoe (blm, smn, etc)
for my drk, that method alone is enough to hold the mobs aggro even with heavy aoe party, at least around level 50 ish

total eclipses? but it didnt generate enmity right? is it good?

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Originally Posted by gumas

^nothing, i just the same method from my drk.

enmity range pull -> enmity aoe x2
in case of drk = unmend -> unleash x2
in case of pld = shield lob -> circle scorn -> flash

then the usual enmity combo, but nevertheless, there is always 1 or 2 enemy lose my aggro after a while if my party is heavy aoe (blm, smn, etc)
for my drk, that method alone is enough to hold the mobs aggro even with heavy aoe party, at least around level 50 ish

total eclipses? but it didnt generate enmity right? is it good?

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You should be using total eclipse if there are 3 or more enemies anyway because its always a damage gain. It doesn't have any emnity modifiers built in, but if you're in shield oath that will give you some aggro, and actually doing damage to the mob pack will help. Don't be one of those people who single targets in a mob pack, every mob 3 and after drastically increases your damage output through aoe.

From my experiences yes but that could be due to a potency variation. I notice on single target mobs my Warrior and DRK do far better in terms of enmity generation for openers. And others here confirmed that. I do hope they up the enmity for all tanks in 5.0 because we all know the enmity problems that happened when 4.0 launched.

In AoE, it's a bit weird...

DRK doesn't really generate more enmity with its enmity moves, Unleash is a 50 potency with a 20.5 multiplier (yes odd) for a total of 1025 and Abyssal Drain has a x5 multiplier (Surprised it wasn't buffed with the rest of enmity buffs).

AoE is a bit unfortunate for PLD because only Flash has any enmity modifiers worth mentioning (where it is a 1200 worth of potency). Some might say Circle of Scorn but that's a joke, it has a 3x multiplier that applies ONLY to the initial hit, so it's 300 worth of potency.

WAR's Overpower has a x10 multiplier, so it's 1300 worth of potency. Steel Cyclone is x3, but it ignores defiance penalty and has defiance's multipliers.

The reason DRK and WAR don't feel this issue is that their AoE damage, almost every hit, has a bit multiplier. And the ones that don't (Quietus and Decimate) are odd moves you toss in after certain conditions are met. For PLD, it has to literally choose between massive enmity and 0 damage... or mediocre damage and no enmity.

In single target it's WAR >= DRK > PLD when it comes snap enmity. But neither really matters under proper play for sustained enmity as it is pretty easy to stay ahead of DPS.

If you're still leveling PLD it could be a gear issue, as well. Usually 2-3 flashes + CoS at level 70 is good enough, but leveling you might need to pay more attention because you could encounter higher geared DPS & healers. It might be safer to use a couple more than that at the start once you have them gathered up.

i guess for pld i need spam flash a bit more than drk then, my friend also suggest to flash again after the blind debuff out so it didnt overwrite the previous seconds. he also think that spirits within should have enmity generation for extra aggro skill.

i didnt realize circle scorn enmity is actually lower than flash, considering the skill come with 30sec cooldown i though its going to be enmity heavy hitter

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Originally Posted by gumas

i didnt realize circle scorn enmity is actually lower than flash, considering the skill come with 30sec cooldown i though its going to be enmity heavy hitter

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It's oGCD, meaning it's just added damage/enmity as soon as it's available, so you can use it and Flash at the same time.
It's more of a slight extra push than something to be used on its own.

Pld aoe pulling and dps is (imo) the simplest, bar none. Sprint > flash 1st pack > proceed and flash 2nd pact > circle of scorn and one more flash for good measure if you want. After that, pop FoF and swap to sword oath with a a defensive CD active and spame TE until you're blue in the face :) (just don't go under 300 tp).