MP/TP squish?

Is it surprising that there hasn't been more discussion from SE about the specifics regarding something as apparently-significant as the TP/MP squish?

I'm all-healers, mainly, but the non-healer jobs I've leveled don't seem to feel much of a constraint from TP during play so it would seem that any sort of limit to them would now feel pretty significantly different in application. OTOH, making them limitless would seem to have its own issues.

Either way, from my relatively inexperienced view point this appears to be a pretty major mechanical change, that people would want to hash over (insofar as internet forums are meaningful, of course) BEFORE they drop, instead of waiting until its in live deployment to see if it's really balanced?

I've only been here since September-ish, so perhaps those of you with more experience with SE could say whether this lack of info at such a relatively late phase is normal for them, or is this unusual?

Or (of course) did I miss some massive announcement that explains it all and I'm just a dope?

Thanks for any comments.

It's normal, they won't say anything until May (most of the stuff is not confirmed yet, even MT/OT split is tentative) when they'll have a live letter explaining most of the changes along with the job changes. They'll probably end up having a media tour where they'll get people to play an in development test build that has all the job changes and such again and we'll get that information then.

They probably don't want to start sharing details on the specifics until they're closer to release, when all the big changes and general plans are finalized and they just need to tweak details.

If they said 'our plan is to do this this and this' but then during development they end up changing course because they had another idea they liked more or idea A just didn't work out in practice it may lead to confusion or people being upset because they liked the first approach etc. So they don't give us the details until closer to launch when there aren't likely to be any big changes beyond tweaking some potencies or something.

The change itself, also, is pretty minor considering how few jobs actually use both TP and MP. Paladin, Bard, Dark Knight, and Red Mage if I'm not mistaken are the only jobs who use both. For every other job one of the two resources is pointless. Like no melee DPS needs MP, no healer needs TP so as they change the battle system, it makes sense to only have one resource as opposed to two since it just means adjusting a few jobs to make them run on one resource.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

The change itself, also, is pretty minor considering how few jobs actually use both TP and MP. Paladin, Bard, Dark Knight, and Red Mage if I'm not mistaken are the only jobs who use both. For every other job one of the two resources is pointless. Like no melee DPS needs MP, no healer needs TP so as they change the battle system, it makes sense to only have one resource as opposed to two since it just means adjusting a few jobs to make them run on one resource.

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The change is pretty significant though, given that TP is basically infinite outside of AoE spam. While MP users run dry on a regular basis and need to at least use Lucid in order to maintain ST rotations, if not also benefit from Refresh.

Meaning that unless they change some things, suddenly all TP users will find themselves having to actually manage a resource - Which is pretty major.

With jobs that use dual resources also being heavily affected too because of how they rely on their "Free" actions that use TP in addition to their MP management.

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Originally Posted by Styopa

Is it surprising that there hasn't been more discussion from SE about the specifics regarding something as apparently-significant as the TP/MP squish?

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They will want to wait until the changes to combat have been all finalized. Since, one of the things they've mentioned is they don't want to give out any information about any specific part of the system on its own, because they mentioned that it might not make sense to us until we have the entire systems function before us.

Like, how they're doing this removal of TP might not make sense unless we know about how resources are going to be managed, what MP costs are going to be like, what the availability of skills like Refresh or Invigorate might be like, whether they want to make classes that currently don't have to care about resources because of how TP works have to manage their MP now etc.

The majority of jobs use either MP or TP.

The only jobs that use both are PLD, DRK, BRD and RDM.

PLD and DRK only use TP for their melee combo.

BRD only uses MP for Foes Requiem

RDM is the one that will probably be most effected ny the change, using both MP and TP for their core rotation.

But most of these issues are already solved if single target melee attacks simply have no cost at all, given that their current TP costs don't really have any effect anyway.
It's only AoE rotations that have a cost to prevent endless spam, DRK's is MP already, do the same for PLD and RDM's AoEs, and its just Foes Requiem we need to worry about.

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Originally Posted by Kalise

The change is pretty significant though, given that TP is basically infinite outside of AoE spam. While MP users run dry on a regular basis and need to at least use Lucid in order to maintain ST rotations, if not also benefit from Refresh.

Meaning that unless they change some things, suddenly all TP users will find themselves having to actually manage a resource - Which is pretty major.

With jobs that use dual resources also being heavily affected too because of how they rely on their "Free" actions that use TP in addition to their MP management.

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This isn't entirely true.... physical jobs that scale well with skill speed (monk is a great example) do start to feel the pinch on TP as a resource as a fight goes on. The skill speed monk build is what I use and while I don't run dry on TP as fast as I do MP on red mage, I do still have to use purification and invigorate to keep doing if there's little to no down time. Some jobs haven't had to pay as much attention to it since Stormblood launched, but melee jobs have had to manage TP before, Heavensward was pretty bad for this, and melee jobs in longer fights with lots of up time really relied on TP songs from machinists/bards.

They'll probably just remove costs on single target weaponskills, it's not a major change at all.

Single Target attacks will more likely than not be free of cost, with AoE attacks and the ranged attacks on melee classes costing MP.

The main things needing any real work with that is BRD with Foe Requiem, and possibly PLD with Total Eclipse, Holy Spirit, Shield Lob and Clemency.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

PLD and DRK only use TP for their melee combo.

BRD only uses MP for Foes Requiem

RDM is the one that will probably be most effected ny the change, using both MP and TP for their core rotation.

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RDM uses TP very infrequently single target or AOE. it really should be a non-factor for RDM.

Shield Bash, Shield Lob too for PLD, but both DRK and PLD are going to much more concerned about how they are going to be balanced against WAR and GUN to worry about the TP/MP change.

This whole thing really should not be significant unless they really mess it up.