Multiple difficulty scaling dungeons

I think this would make a great feature in FFXIV. Similar to Mythic+ system in WoW... I am not saying copy directly from that game but take the basic ideas and features and implement it in a unique way. Right now in FFXIV the dungeons are very easy. Basically in most of the dungeons I see tanks mass pulling the entire mobs until they face a wall and then dps AOE them down. This type of playstyle is very boring and not fun at all.

I main healers so if anyone has a bad time with the megapull mentality it's me. That being said I don't think this is the solution because the idea of always trying to pull more is so ingrained in the playerbase you would need to make some kind of instant wipe mechanic incredibly prevalent to prevent it.


Assuming (either through physical gating or some kind of "oops-more-than-one-pack-party-hp-instantly-zero" mechanic) that you successfully prevent large pulls the rewards would need to be so significantly better for these dungeons for players to run them instead of just doing expert roulette. Do you want to spend 10-15 minutes on a dungeon or the 25-30 they can take pulling one pack at a time? Most people have an easy time there.

In order to implement this higher reward you are torn between higher ilvl gear (which isn't even in Ultimate) or some crazy amount of tomestones. I get 90 current tomestones for running Expert and rarely have it take more than 15 minutes. If Mythic takes 30+ minutes is SE giving me more than the 140 tomestones I would have gotten for investing that same amount of time in an Expert then another 70 dungeon? I genuinely don't think so.

I don't mean for this to be harsh I just don't see this system fitting into the game without such huge changes it becomes unrealistic.

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Originally Posted by Kragon

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there was a thread on this already use the search function. :/

also if you prefer WoW feel free to play it. Seems all your suggestions are about talking things from WoW that to be frank may not work in this game. I did play WoW a bit in Wrath and cata and players did dungeons exactly like players do them here. Mass pull aoe down, beat boss repeat. SE tried to make some gates, like in bardems, or doma castle. hell till people cleared and got better gear a few people struggled with the sb starter dungeons.

they also are changing them up again like bardems mettle such as having a minigame boss to switch stuff up a bit. the speed pulling is a choice, it is the means to get the most tomes per hr. Which stems from pre cata WoW. n o matter the diffivaulty people will try to speed run it to get the most seals per hour.

not everyone had 4-5 hours to play now a days. i work a 12 hr 6-6 chem job with an hr drive to and from my job. i get 2-3 days off a week based on my scheduled, and 1-2 days of those i'm "on call". so the proposed change would not benefit me at all.

it would be fun to have dungeon runs with handicaps (stronger enemies, more enemies, more ground aoes and such stuff), which make dungeons less of a faceroll and reward people that take that kind of challenge with slightly better gear, more tomes or whatever

try it with minimum ilevel synch for the whole party

The megapull mentality exist on wow mythic+ too, the point of the mentality is that it easier to clamp up as much mobs as you can and kill them all together than focusing down them 1 by one, honestly no dungeon atm could work with that same system because the mythic runs use also some clever skips in between mobs thanks often to the terrain itself, something that we lack and unless the reward is considered worthy ppl would avoid it most of the time, take notice that mythic+ became "interesting" only because they give you crapton of loots otherwise they would have suffered the same fate of pandaria/wod challenge modes, which honestly is a damn shame

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Originally Posted by Felis

try it with minimum ilevel synch for the whole party

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Just takes longer. That's why item level sync in current max level dungeons has always been silly. It doesn't suddenly make mechanics difficult or add challenge, but it does make the hp sponges even more spongey.

It would be nice to see actual interesting 4-man content since not everyone can get an 8-man static going, but I gave up hope of that with how well Palace of the Dead was received.

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Originally Posted by Remedi

The megapull mentality exist on wow mythic+ too

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True but healers don't have the same set of tools in both games. In WoW healers actually have a decent set of very strong cds to cast on a tank. In FF they don't. This may seem small but as a long time healer in WoW and a healer in this game, I can tell you it's a serious game changer. The hardest megapulls I have had to heal were in FF, not WoW. And yes I did heal challenge modes.

On top of that there is far more cc in WoW across all the classes than there are in FF. That can greatly affect the amount of incoming damage.

In FF there are less tools to draw from to mitigate damage.

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Originally Posted by Remedi

honestly no dungeon atm could work with that same system because the mythic runs use also some clever skips in between mobs thanks often to the terrain itself

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And this is another huge game changer. Terrain in FF dungeons can only be used for line of sight reasons. In WoW you can use it to skip loads of trash.

Not saying I wouldn't like to see some ultra hardmode versions of 4-mans. Just saying the experience will not be the same as Mythic + at all because of the above reasons.

0.o

I played WoW myself. What you describe is basically how WoW dungeons have been played since its first expansion came out. Dungeons went from a tactical game to a who can faceroll it faster game. Even the harder mythic dungeons after you outgear them.

I'd suggest finding a group of like minded individuals and running some dungeons in your birthday suits for more of a challenge.

A scaling dungeon system (like Mythic+) is really the way to go. I enjoy dungeons in XIV, but they're just a creation tome farm, no more and no less. I would absolutely love to be able to ratchet up the difficulty and try much harder versions of these dungeons.

Oh and folks? Just because Blizzard implemented a system in their own games, does not make it a horrible idea to implement in XIV.