One for the books - YES. Yes, you can sue RMTs for cheating and 'bots!

Why yes Virginia, you can sue RMTs...

We all know that RMT and their bots are a significant and negative threat to our game. Just the mere fact that related permanent account bans averaging up to 25,000 a week seem to be a regular thing is enough to tell us that.

Until now, the common wisdom is that SE can't really do much to sue these people to stop them. I believe that may have changed, or at least the common wisdom may have to be adjusted.

The folks behind League of Legends won $10 million in a case against a bot/cheating service called "LeagueSharp", in addition to granting Riot (LoL creators) control over LeagueSharps websites.

See the links;

Gamezone story about LoL suing LeagueSharp

Engadget story about the lawsuit.

It seems that RIOT may have got creative and used the Digital Millenium copyright Act to sue because there was circumvention of the digital protection of their software.

It may not be possible for SE to use the same grounds against the various RMT organizations that plague us, but this does show that it's possible for game operators and creators to go after these parasites.

This makes sense because hacks alter the product into something it was not designed to be and damage the experience of paying customers. Unauthorised tools which disrupt our immersion and create an unfair play environment severely impact our enjoyment of the product.

Blizzard has also gone after botmakers in the past and won against two different ones.

Jagex (Runescape) is another big one.

Also a couple years back during FFXI, SE also took down a bot service called FFXIApp, it was way more prominent though.

It probably just costs too much in legal fees to make this viable for all companies. Probably depends on where this bot service originates from as well so they can mental gymnastics some kind of loophole.

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Originally Posted by Vaer

Blizzard has also gone after botmakers in the past and won against two different ones.

Jagex (Runescape) is another big one.

Also a couple years back during FFXI, SE also took down a bot service called FFXIApp, it was way more prominent though.

It probably just costs too much in legal fees to make this viable for all companies. Probably depends on where this bot service originates from as well so they can mental gymnastics some kind of loophole.

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Costs can be awarded in lawsuits also...

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Costs can be awarded in lawsuits also...

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Right but sometimes they have to try multiple times to jam it though, appealing losses etc, like Blizzard had to attempt a bunch of times before they won against their more recent one. All those costs add up that could be spent elsewhere.

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Originally Posted by Vaer

Right but sometimes they have to try multiple times to jam it though, appealing losses etc, like Blizzard had to attempt a bunch of times before they won against their more recent one. All those costs add up that could be spent elsewhere.

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It's a business decision, how much business do you lose due to the negative impact of the bots and RMT services vs the potential costs.

SE thinking: pay millions to lawyers to take down an RMT company? Or, let RMT continue to pay a sub fee to us which makes lazy people who use RMT continue to pay a sub fee to us?

Patch notes: RMT fix- all RMT tells will now start with "and now a word from our sponsors!".

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

It's a business decision, how much business do you lose due to the negative impact of the bots and RMT services vs the potential costs.

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Probably not as much as you think. Case in point: YOU clearly hate RMT a great deal. And yet, you are still subscribed, and still play the game. I, too, am not fond of RMT, but they'd have to get a WHOLE lot worse before I'd consider quitting the game because of them. And yet, you think there are enough other players who hate RMT enough to actually go through with it and unsubscribe, that it would balance against a multi-million dollar lawsuit which may or may not succeed, and may or may not recoup losses even if it does succeed?

It's nice to see examples working out, but I sure don't fault SE for not being the ones to trailblaze this kind of thing. They're being sensibly cautious; SE has made some notoriously bad business decisions in the past, after all. Once suing RMT becomes routine, with lots of legal precedents, SE will start to follow suit, but I wouldn't expect to see it before then.

Even if it works, though - is this going to work against the Chinese? While not all RMT are Chinese, enough are that it's flat out become a stereotype. If I'm not mistaken, a company based in Japan has no legal rights to sue anyone in China.

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Why yes Virginia, you can sue RMTs...

We all know that RMT and their bots are a significant and negative threat to our game. Just the mere fact that related permanent account bans averaging up to 25,000 a week seem to be a regular thing is enough to tell us that.

Until now, the common wisdom is that SE can't really do much to sue these people to stop them. I believe that may have changed, or at least the common wisdom may have to be adjusted.

The folks behind League of Legends won $10 million in a case against a bot/cheating service called "LeagueSharp", in addition to granting Riot (LoL creators) control over LeagueSharps websites.

See the links;

Gamezone story about LoL suing LeagueSharp

Engadget story about the lawsuit.

It seems that RIOT may have got creative and used the Digital Millenium copyright Act to sue because there was circumvention of the digital protection of their software.

It may not be possible for SE to use the same grounds against the various RMT organizations that plague us, but this does show that it's possible for game operators and creators to go after these parasites.

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I hate to burst a bubble here, but I feel that I need to clarify a point that's generally forgotten with things like this...

The only reason that Riot was able to sue LeagueSharp for this is because companies are based in the United States where the DMCA is in effect. Both Riot and LeagueSharp are US entities and, while it has a subsidiary in the US, Square-Enix is at its root a Japanese company. This means that it doesn't really have the same standing to file a suit like this in the US, also since many of the RMTs and GoldFarming organizations aren't based here either. This may be good legal precedent for US based companies like Blizzard and what-not to purse issues, but it doesn't help SE out since they're not an American company and have to go through the Japanese system instead. As pointed out below...

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

Even if it works, though - is this going to work against the Chinese? While not all RMT are Chinese, enough are that it's flat out become a stereotype. If I'm not mistaken, a company based in Japan has no legal rights to sue anyone in China.

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And nope, they do not.

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Originally Posted by Cabalabob

SE thinking: pay millions to lawyers to take down an RMT company? Or, let RMT continue to pay a sub fee to us which makes lazy people who use RMT continue to pay a sub fee to us?

Patch notes: RMT fix- all RMT tells will now start with "and now a word from our sponsors!".

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http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...688955aeff4da4 that's why this happens on a near weekly basis? It's really annoying that people think SE does nothing about RMT. They clearly take the time to notify the playerbase of banning notices that take place due to RMT activity.