A reason Final Coil is a better raid tier than Creator Savage is T9 requirement

The fact that the 3.x design decision for endgame goes from pure faceroll to be able to go into a savage encounter that drops BiS equipment is a gigantic design flaw that must be addressed in 4.0. Having a gate that tests player skill between the braindead content and the most rewarding content in the game is common sense.

T9 was a gate to get into final coil was a great design that improved the average player skill across the board in those dungeons in 2.4 and onward. It reduced frustration from non-static but skilled players and it created tighter knit endgame communities. This is a stark contrast to the current PUG environment. Sure there were trap players back then, but T9 was keeping the most underperforming players at bay, and this was good for the game. Sure, people could buy a clear or get carried back then, which did happen, but it was better than no gate at all. And when players were ready, they would clear T9 and would be better players going into final coil than if they were just let into final coil the way current endgame is designed.

If this design isn't duplicated or with tweaks in 4.0, then there needs to be other ways to keep players who have no business being there out until they are proven to be ready for it in both game knowledge and job skill. What are some ideas that we can give SE to keep the skill curve balanced instead of going from one extreme to the other?

edit: 2.0 had demon wall as well which really helped wake players up and learn their jobs in 2.0 and 2.1. For those that don't know Amdapor Keep had a dps check with an enrage(hornets and damaging floor along with an insta death push back if not positioned right). Yes, a 4 man dungeon that actually challenged player skill did exist at one time. This type of thing needs to be brought back as well. Dungeons should be scary places that are moderately difficult, require crowd control, mechanics, etc. This also helps prepare players for endgame.

Nah sorry I liked the fact that I could jump right into A9S with my team. I hope SE keeps doing what their doing right now in regards to this.

And WOW! A post like this comes straight from gilgamesh! Why am I not surprised?

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Originally Posted by ToasterMan

Nah sorry I liked the fact that we could jump right into A9S with my team. I hope SE keeps doing with their doing in regards to this.

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I want to know if most people agree with this. If they do, I will likely have to find a new game to play, sadly.

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Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge

I want to know if most people agree with this. If they do, I will likely have to find a new game to play, sadly.

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You can't fight the entitlement of this game's players. YoshiP will never stop carebearing them.

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Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge

I want to know if most people agree with this. If they do, I will likely have to find a new game to play, sadly.

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You're not going to find any consensus on these forums, nor will you find anything resembling a proper sample size of what the playerbase as a whole thinks here.

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Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge

I want to know if most people agree with this. If they do, I will likely have to find a new game to play, sadly.

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What does people being able to go into content straight-on have to do with you raiding?

Are they going to be raiding with you? No? So why does it matter and what do you care if other people are able to do the content?

And if you go into a PUG anyways, always set your expectations low so you aren't surprised when the DRG is actually a lolDRG and the AST spreads a spire and royal road's a balance.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

What does people being able to go into content straight-on have to do with you raiding?

Are they going to be raiding with you? No? So why does it matter and what do you care if other people are able to do the content?

And if you go into a PUG anyways, always set your expectations low so you aren't surprised when the DRG is actually a lolDRG and the AST spreads a spire and royal road's a balance.

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Chances are u are going to somehow end up raiding with them through party finder, and no u can't set expectations low when it comes to savage or extreme.

its like zurvan, what business do they have there if they simply cannot perform their opener right, and ruining everyone else experience.

A big reason why raiding in heavensward sucks is all of the gear you get from it is essentially useless outside that raid tier. You don't keep it - instead, you throw it away for new crafted gear on patch day. That's fucking stupid and a fundamental problem with the 3.x system. If they continue it into 4.x then they really have no idea wtf they're doing.

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Originally Posted by SundayTrash

its like zurvan, what business do they have there if they simply cannot perform their opener right, and ruining everyone else experience.

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This problem can be solved with a static group to be honest, if you can't have a static group that problem is with the player no with the game. People complain about this in every multiplayer game this days, they spect to have a premade experience with pugs and thats never going to happen outside very few scenarios.

But anyway if you ask me allowing players to jump to the last PvE content aviable is not working and they need to find an alternative.