Of openers and rotations

Hiya
FF14 is my second MMO but I never understood why there is an opener and then a standard rotation? Is the opener meant to front load the damage? Why can't the opener become the main rotation? Cos of long cooldowns? How much dps will I lose if I don't use the opener?

I suppose this is presumed knowledge in the MMO community but I have never understood it. Can someone pls explain? ;)

Basically, the Opener is a certain amount of time where you use the skills and buffs you have in a certain manner that can't be upkept for the entire fight (often combined with potions as well).
It tends to deal a huge amount of dmg (more than it would if you spread out selfbuffs and the like over the course of the fight) and therefore increases your overall dps.

For example on BLM, during the opener I have a full timer on Enochian, the buff that allows me to use my main dmg spell (which gets shorter and shorter after each refreshment during the rest of the fight), so of course that gets paired with spellspeed+ and dmg+ and a pot and MP regen so I can throw a crazy amount of superpowered Fire 4's in a short amount of time. After that I have to switch back into a normal-powered cycle of dealing dmg and regenerating MP + refreshing Enochian (the last 2 ones not exactly great for dishing out dmg ;)). So no, the opener rotation can't be upkept throughout the entire fight.

How much dmg exactly you'll lose nobody can tell you, it depends on how much dps you normally do in the first place, how well you can pull off your opener (there are different ones for different playstyles/level of play), and so on.
You can parse yourself or use SSS to measure the difference though to see how well you fare with and without an opener :)
But it IS a significant chunk.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

Basically, the Opener is a certain amount of time where you use the skills and buffs you have in a certain manner that can't be upkept for the entire fight (often combined with potions as well).

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Thanks Atoli this makes sense ;)

However it seems the normal rotation is not just the opener minus the long cooldown support skills? At least in the guides I have read, it is not presented this way and a lot less emphasis is given to the normal rotation even though this takes up most of the fight. I might be wrong though?

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Originally Posted by nilh

Thanks Atoli this makes sense ;)

However it seems the normal rotation is not just the opener minus the long cooldown support skills? At least in the guides I have read, it is not presented this way and a lot less emphasis is given to the normal rotation even though this takes up most of the fight. I might be wrong though?

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Its a little different for each class. For some of them the opener is more or less the standard rotation with all the buffs they can have sequenced in the most efficient way. For other classes you do things out of the "normal" order during the opener to take the best advantage of all those buffs that you wont typically have for the remainder of a fight(which often have different refresh times, so even when they come back it isnt always together). For instance: if your rotation takes 30 seconds to get through but you only have 20 seconds on your best buff, you might want to hit as many of the hardest hitting parts of your rotation as you can before the timer is out. Different guide authors might have different reasons for emphasizing different elements, but in many cases its because the standard rotation is easier to understand and pull off. Look at the DRG rotation from the DPS forum. If i oversimplify a bit, the standard rotation listed is essentially buff move > combo 1 > filler move > combo 2 > repeat. Its not super hard to remember and the reason you do it in that order is obvious enough once you look at the moves(the first move enhances your damage, the first combo applies a DoT and debuffs the defense of your target, the filler is an additional DoT, the 2nd combo hits hard, and you start your repeating just before all the timers run out). The opener is more complex because youre trying to do more in a limited time window, and they discuss it in greater detail so they can understand and explain why their way gets the most out of the tools they have available.

tl;dr The rotation is the basics, the opener is the advanced stuff.

Don't worry about the long, complicated openers you see posted. As long as you use your Abilities, all those complexities have a pretty minor effect compared to simply keeping your attacks going. Opener stuff is for after you've mastered your normal usage of weaponskills/spells. After that is when people look at ways to squeeze out a bit more damage from them by looking at how to line up cooldowns at what times, such as Blood for Blood or Raging Strikes. The only reason openers are even things that people look at, really, is because you're always going to start a long, hard fight with all of your cooldowns ready to use at the same time, and a very few, select fights are very tightly tuned where every bit of damage counts.

Thanks Frizze and Teiren!!

I understand better now (at least not so concerned/confused about the long list of skills and buttons to hit). Some of the guides for openers are pretty confusing, and just as confusing is the relatively paltry information on the basic rotation (speaking about monk here). When you are new to the game and have to learn the dungeons, it's not easy to put everything together in the proper sequence. I often end up not hitting the cooldowns and utilities.

Yeah, it's easy to forget to use them, but just remember that anything is better than nothing. Just try to not use them when most of it will be wasted is all, though some waste is inevitable sometimes. Monk has a few more Abilities (off-GCD actions) than other jobs, so I understand it's annoying to try to watch them all the time. It's probably the biggest reason I don't personally play Monk, even though I enjoyed it while levelling, just like how I enjoyed levelling all the jobs.

However, the basics of Monk are actually among the simplest in the game. At Level 50+, it's literally just Dragon Kick+Twin Snakes together (both flank weaponskills) and then Bootshine+True Strike together (both rear weaponskills) and alternating those two pairs forever. Deciding the Coeurl form ability you use at the end of each one is just based on if Demolish isn't on the target (and it'll live 9+ seconds longer) or if you have 3+ enemies to hit with Rockbreaker. As for Touch of Death, that's only worth using if the target will live for at least 24 seconds, or in other words, its whole duration practically. Btw, you don't technically have a weaponskill combo system like the other melee jobs, so you can perform Touch of Death at any time.

And really, what contributes MOST to ANY Job's DPS is knowing the fight. That will only come with practice and your own personal experience that comes with that practice. The more practiced you are in a fight, the more comfortable and calm you are, which naturally helps, but also the better able you are to think about certain things like, "This target is going to go invulnerable soon, so I won't maintain buffs or DoTs." You can also reliably know where you'll be at a certain point in the fight and be better able to get back on target, make a better plan of when to use Abilities, and, if you're melee, get more positional damage bonuses.

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Originally Posted by nilh

When you are new to the game and have to learn the dungeons, it's not easy to put everything together in the proper sequence.

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Biggest piece of advice i try to give new people is to ask for help when they need it(dont be afraid to say you dont know something - we all had to learn at some point), and not get stressed out about the things they dont understand yet. This game like every MMO is huge, complex, and can be hugely complex if you let it.

Yeah, some classes are much easier to learn basic sequencing on then others. Black Mage is literally a 4 button class for a long stretch of levels(fire 1 for damage, transpose to stance switch, blizzard 1 for mana regen, thunder 1 for extra DoT damage - sequence is essentially Th F F F F Tr B Th B Tr F F F F for almost 30 levels and switching from single target to AoE only even means swapping F2 for F1), and you slowly start adding/changing some of those in the later stages until everything shifts radically at level 58-60. My understanding of monk is secondhand and limited, so i wont say anything class-specific thats likely to be wrong and confusing. But one piece of advice i can give that is more universal - if you arent feeling comfortable with your rotation you can always practice. Easiest way is to get to know a striking dummy for a little while. Many FCs/people have level 50 or 60 ones in their yards. You cant "kill" them(their hp bar just refills when depleted), so you can practice going through the moves as long as you want until youve got a good feel for them. They dont really simulate positionals well, and a real fight usually has some mechanics to worry about, but if you have the moves down youre well on your way. Then like Teiren said knowing the fight is key. Between knowing your moves and the fight mechanics, youve got 95%(roughly) of the toolbox, THATS when the theorycrafting(openers, cooldown management, etc) becomes relevant if you need to be the absolute best.

Anyway, if my rambling barely coherent thoughts have been at all helpful then im glad to have shared them. Continue having fun, and never be afraid to ask questions.

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Originally Posted by Frizze

Biggest piece of advice i try to give new people is to ask for help when they need it

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No not at all rambling Frizze, it's all clear and useful. In fact most players I have come across in FF14 dungeons have been pretty cool/patient, and decently skilled (cf. swtor where you still have clueless people dying in pubs after all these years - prolly cos its an FTP game). But by the same token I rarely see people in FF14 stating they are new or explaining mechanics in DF.

Have been practicising on the dummies at Dravania Forelands (I am the only one there usually). I need more practice.

I also just posted a question on Form Shift in the Monk thread so yea, thanks! ;)

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Originally Posted by Teiren

At Level 50+, it's literally just Dragon Kick+Twin Snakes together (both flank weaponskills) and then Bootshine+True Strike together (both rear weaponskills) and alternating those two pairs forever.

And really, what contributes MOST to ANY Job's DPS is knowing the fight.

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Oh my Teiren, you have explained the rotation more clearly than any monk guide has done so far! Thanks!

You are absolutely right about knowing the fight. The mechanics often confuse my rotation. And there are fights I know much better than others (the levelling ones > the bunch at levels 50/60, and those necessary for gear grinding).