Gathering in FFXIV is a slow process. If you want to farm some materials (either to use or to sell), the general design is that you can spend an hour or two in an area, zoned out, watching something on Netflix, or having a conversation with a good friend. It's generally a low-stress activity, with a slow pace (and this lines up with our GP rate, where it can take a full five minutes to restore your GP).
Until you get to level 50.
At level 50, we are introduced to timed nodes.
Now, they weren't bad in ARR. Timed nodes that are up long enough for you to be able to travel to them and still have time left over to fill up your GP without needing a Cordial are dandy. But that changed in Heavensward.
Non-folklore timed nodes are only up for 55 minutes every twelve hours, Eorzea time. That translates to 2:45 minutes every 36 minutes IRL. Most of them take a minute at least to fly to from the nearest aetheryte, and the window isn't even long enough to restore half of your GP. So in order to farm from or collect on these nodes, which is essential for progression both while leveling and in the endgame, you need to be in the area, waiting for them to spawn at very specific intervals. Unlike gathering 1-49 which allows you to do it at your own pace, at your own time, DoL players are forced to adhere to an extremely rigid schedule (and folklore items are even worse).
And what about favors? Favors are only slightly better. Favors give you a five IRL minute window to gather as many special nodes as you can. But it's only five minutes. It's the equivalent of doing a guildleve for max-level mats. You can start whenever you like, but your window of opportunity is incredibly small when compared to the slow pace of gathering in general.
What's my point?
It's backwards.
Collectible gathering and favors may work pretty well for DoH, but for DoL, they seem to run counter the model of gathering that was established in ARR. We can still farm materials at a leisurely pace, but unless we are extremely conscious of our time (which is another issue entirely), we had better not be using any of our abilities, and we had better be on our way to the nodes well in advance, or it's likely we won't have the time or the GP to get the collectible materials we so desire.
What I'd like to see is a redesign to collectible and favor gathering. I'd like to see a system that caters to or even encourages slow, steady gathering sessions. I'd like to see collectible gathering that has a lower barrier to entry, and that has a separate resource system (maybe using TP to increase collectability instead of GP?). I'd like to see nodes with 36-minute windows of time where they are available (make it Astral/Umbral), and make it like maps that spawn randomly on general nodes in the area and allow one collection, or ephemeral nodes that have a lower collect rate, but spawn all throughout a given period of time.
Ultimately, I'd like to see the DoL progression system make sense with itself, and not require people who want to progress to have to interrupt whatever they're doing every half hour when they hear the alarm from a third-party app go off.
</rant>
EDIT: At the very least, please make it so we won't be kicked out of a node once we've started gathering.
The Backwards State of Heavensward Endgame Gathering
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02-17-2016, 02:37 PMJpec07The Backwards State of Heavensward Endgame Gathering
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02-23-2016, 03:07 AMChadness'Nuff said. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Jpec07
I have also always felt that things were a little off, and especially that the 55 minute (in-game) time limit to gather from many end-game special nodes was a bit too strict. It didn't really mesh with everything we were "taught", so to speak, during the entirety of 2.x gathering.
A large reason I enjoy DoL classes so much is that they are generally more laid-back activities. It's a nice change of pace from the generally faster-paced combat-related activities in the game. Every since Heavensward launched and I got to end-game gathering though, it does seem like it's faster paced than I'd like with the small windows of time to gather from these nodes.
So, I guess I'm simply saying - I agree with you 100%. -
02-23-2016, 04:20 AMTaleraRistain
Agree 100% as well. I especially dislike that I have to go to third-party site to find out where a node is so I am there *right* at spawn time with the unspoiled nodes. With ARR you could be in the zone with Truth up, see the notification and reach the node before it was gone. Even if you didn't reach it to gather from it, you still knew where it was for the next spawn. This is impossible with HW nodes unless you happen to be close enough to their spawn point that you can get them on your mini-map before they disappear.
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02-23-2016, 04:32 AMZorlintaWell this is the only thing i agree with you really,Quote:
Originally Posted by Jpec07
But you know that are collectibles in some nodes that allows you go in slow peace, those don't give much scrips though but are there whole day (no timed), just you need to "refresh" nodes to make them appear again.
Folkore nodes (5am-7am miner and 5pm-7pm btn) and favor nodes are other whole diferent matter. Those for now are ok, since are top-end materials, and increasing their time will affect seriously the marketplace. -
02-23-2016, 04:34 AMRufalus
I don't like the timed stuff either, but I also don't think it should be so casual that you need to watch Netflix to prevent brain rot. A happy medium would be best. Maybe the worst thing about timed nodes is spending more time flying from location to location than actually gathering. How about instead of using timers to limit supply, they just use an allowance system, where you are only allowed to gather a certain amount of gems from some sacred location each day to prevent harming the environment, but you get to pick what time you do it. Or bring back repeatable daily quests like the Ixal ones.
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02-25-2016, 02:35 AMJpec07Camping timed nodes is substantially more efficient for gathering scrips - especially when many of these nodes are so far removed from the timed nodes that you can't get there with ample time or GP to ensure high enough collectibility to get scrips.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorlinta
Except you need to be there, waiting for them to spawn, or you won't have any opportunity to gather them (due to how far removed they are from the aetherytes). High end items in ARR still had 4- or 8-Eorzea-hour windows of time where you could gather them. Extending the duration of the HW nodes would not in any way negatively affect the market for them if they are still only available for gathering once every 24 Eorzea hours.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorlinta
I like these ideas. I agree that progression shouldn't be so mindless as to need Netflix; catching up on OitNB can wait for when I need to spend a couple hours on Titanium or Cloud Mica, but having to be in the right place at the right time like it is doesn't work. I like your ideas, though. Spending half an hour of consistent work to progress (instead of 45 seconds every 36 minutes for 8 hours) would be a much better, much more consistent way to do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufalus
I also wish we could use collectible DoL for collectible DoH items to greater effect than HQ resources, but that's a different thread. -
02-25-2016, 02:44 AMDuuude007
Favors used to last 15 minutes and the chance to collect per node was 1/3 of what it is now.
Think about that for a second.
450 red scrips takes 4 to 8 hours of farming a week, depending on RNG luck. This is after they added large boosts for turnins.
450 scrips = 9 tokens =45 favors.
45 favors take 5 mins each, so counting node prep and farm time, 4 hours of work.
I haven't even touched on crafting red scrips...
So thats 8-12 hours of EXPLICITLY farming favor mats. Today. And you want it to be effectively tripled, like it was before?
Really. Think about that for a second. -
02-25-2016, 08:45 AMZorlintaSo what you want slow peace or efficiency? you cant have both.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jpec07
So i dunno how you been gathering the timed nodes because you not need sit next to the node until it spawns. You have a 40 minutes (effective time) in game time to can gather them.
Also there is a 2hours game time spawn node separation so you can and is possible go from one time node to other in time to collect.
my current gathering route (on the 3 dol's):
5am astral moraine gathering
fly to 7am violet quartz
fly to 9am cryshal green
fly to 11am adamantite ore
fly to morel node for 12am
fly to cuprite for 2pm
fish some illuminati perch until 4pm
so going then for hunt caiman or
well going to gather seven heaven at 5pm
then some rest or keep fishing perch
until 9pm for more cryshal green
fly to 11pm adamantite
fly to morel node for 12am
fly to cuprite for 2pm
fish perch or rest unil 4am
so it give me plenty scrips red & blue, also i spent some cordial, and fill red scrips weekly quote in couple travels. -
02-29-2016, 09:38 AMShadygrove
Its a minigame.
And the game is timing. The game's fuel is cordials.
When I was gathering collectables I was at some node or another every two game hours. And as I gather for my gil this had me bouncing between Hevansward ans ARR areas.
The reason why I gather for my gil is because, for me, gathering in 3.xx became more chalenging and more fun while crafting in 3.xx became more chalenging but less fun.
I wear the Grandmaster of the Hand title BTW. I mostly earned it with GC turnins. Purchased GC turnins. -
03-03-2016, 01:44 PMpapichulo123
favors i dont mind. but the 55 mins should be raised a bit to at least 60.