What can the dev team do to satisfy the critics of 1.18?

I've made a few reaction threads and it's taken me a couple days to get my head together about this patch. People are asking, what can be done? or saying to be constructive. So here we go. It's a long read.

Without doubt, many good things came with patch 1.18. Healing gameplay is spectacular, battles are very challenging, "easy mode" as it were is over, and great new music has been added.

I want people to understand what's behind the changes in this patch. In design, there are trade-offs. For instance, when a developer changes one thing, but creates a bug somewhere else, this is an instance of a trade off. The new thing works in the build, but the trade-off is that the old thing doesn't. So when we consider the changes in this patch that are unpopular with some.. what was the trade off for these changes?

Let's take a look at the anecdotal evidence here on the boards.. people are praising the first dungeon, and praising the gameplay inside there. People are saying hate is messed up on world NMs and guildleves. People are praising the healing gameplay inside Darkhold, but complaining about exping having slowed down too much because of resting for MP, or running out of MP in the middle of a guildleve. It should be obvious to people putting the facts together: all of these changes were based on making Darkhold the best it could be. In the attempt to do that was any of the rest of the game set off balance?

Let's take a look at some of the (unintended) consequences of patch 1.18:

-Looking for members Darkhold GLA/CON/CON/CON/CON/ARC/ARC/ARC, leaving out other classes
-Leveled Thaumaturge for months just for healing, but now have to set the whole class aside and level the healer class du jour
-Running out of MP while soloing guildleves
-Baffling hate spikes throughout the game - need a R30 Lancer ability for tanking?
-Offensive build Conjurers in low demand
-Hybrid Conjurers with less abilities to contribute in battle because resources shifted toward healing
-Archers upset with their recast times

So we've seen that the trade-off for the above issues is the rewarding gameplay in Darkhold. Now ask yourself, is 1 dungeon's gameplay significant enough to throw the balance of the entire remaining game off? I'd say: the dev team got carried away in the rush to make a competent dungeon. They forgot about the rest of the game because they had too much riding on it. They were already nervous about releasing it before the battle changes were finished but they were embarrassed by releasing nothing for over 3 months straight. They were backed into a corner and they panicked. They balanced recast timers and ability changes around Darkhold - but the question is: is this arbitrary fact enough to justify going further down this path? Should the dev team reverse course on some of the unpopular changes and find another way to balance gameplay in Darkhold? Yes.

What are the dev team's options?

-Continue down the same path of balancing classes around dungeons
-Or balance battle in all situations, including dungeons

The dev team should take into account all battle situations: solo, party, guildleve, low-tier NM, world NM, dungeon, enthusiast soloing

MP costs should be balanced to take into account soloing, or it should be left as is and MP regen food should be added and MP restoring mana drinks between fights

Enmity needs to be tested thoroughly in all situations before being patched.

The dev team also has a profound choice to make about healing. One of their goals is role identity. If there's a healer role it must be all-consuming to give it a strong identity. On the other hand, the original design of FFXIV is that every class is back-up healer. That path avoids the kind of micromanagement gameplay of FFXI that became tiring to some healers, and a more rewarding type of gameplay where everyone shares responsibility. The two paths are mutually exclusive. The dev team should make a White Mage job, and it should have micromanagement gameplay. MP costs should be lowered from what they are now to allow for backup healers. Access to the White Mage job should be through Thaumaturge and Conjurer until the game is relaunched.

Curaga spells should be White Mage specific, and aoe heals should be reinstated to Thaumaturge and Conjurer with lowered effectiveness, to allow for all classes access to Darkhold and not just GLA/CON/ARC.

Auto-attack range should be increased for Thaumaturge and Conjurer, or Spirit Dart / Nature's Fury should have 3-5 second recast.

I've done my best to suggest changes that will keep the game hard and players happy. Feel free to add to it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neptune

What can the dev team do to satisfy the critics of 1.18?

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Absolutely nothing. When you have a thread complaining Archers are ruined and another complaining that people only want archers for the rank 45 dungeon there is nothing to be done. I can give other examples, but as with most major patches in computer games there are complaints in both directions.

Only going to reply about MP issues with casters since the only class I play is THM and I'm not 50 to discuss dungeon parties. :( First, I have been soloing R44-49 beastmen around the world nonstop with absolutely zero downtime whatsoever. I never run out of MP, so either CON is entirely different or people just aren't adjusting. Use Stygian Spikes, Siphon MP on cool down, maximize Tranquility usage by using it as soon as you dip low enough as to not waste any of it, and use your spells sparingly.

Look at the MP cost of your spells and weigh their usefulness in situations and use spells from other classes if you have them available. I use Rampart a lot, as well as Profundity and Spiritbind. In addition, use all of your free attacks (Spirit Dart, Elemental Shroud, Nature's Fury) to built TP to regen even more MP. Also, don't run long distances in active mode, switch into passive mode between battles, the small regen helps. I usually use Profundity with my Dart to generate the extra TP, and I try to use it when a mob is around 20-25% so the TP attack will kill it and cool down will be back up by the time I engage the next mob.

You can check my post history, I was having one hell of a time trying to solo the first couple days of the patch, and I won't lie it is significantly harder now, but I honestly feel the current MP costs are OK. They seem wtf high because they were so low before, but once you adjust, they aren't that bad. Just make sure you're not overhealing or pulling multiple mobs. And Stygian Spikes gives you constant MP regen in combat.

The only thing I would really like to see changed for casters is a lower cool down on Dart. Archer has a short cool down for their attack, mages should have similar treatment. With a shorter cool down the people having MP issues should have an easier time because mobs die faster and more Radiance/Damnation = more MP.

Frankly, it may be a little more work on the mods part, but they need to sort through the posts and weed out the constructive ones. There's always going to be people who complain, but the devs just need to ignore the whiney whiners.

Reward those of you who actually care enough to post helpful suggestions instead of wha wha blah blah blah.

Good to hear some good info about soloing Ava. I didn't know Profundity had any effect on Spirit Dart. I'll try it out. Recast needs to be lowered for sure for that and Nature's Fury. Also, you're R46 - Darkhold is R45. Try it out!

What do they need to do? "Keep up the good work" would be a fine start. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ava

Only going to reply about MP issues with casters since the only class I play is THM and I'm not 50 to discuss dungeon parties. :( First, I have been soloing R44-49 beastmen around the world nonstop with absolutely zero downtime whatsoever. I never run out of MP, so either CON is entirely different or people just aren't adjusting. Use Stygian Spikes, Siphon MP on cool down, maximize Tranquility usage by using it as soon as you dip low enough as to not waste any of it, and use your spells sparingly.

Look at the MP cost of your spells and weigh their usefulness in situations and use spells from other classes if you have them available. I use Rampart a lot, as well as Profundity and Spiritbind. In addition, use all of your free attacks (Spirit Dart, Elemental Shroud, Nature's Fury) to built TP to regen even more MP. Also, don't run long distances in active mode, switch into passive mode between battles, the small regen helps. I usually use Profundity with my Dart to generate the extra TP, and I try to use it when a mob is around 20-25% so the TP attack will kill it and cool down will be back up by the time I engage the next mob.

You can check my post history, I was having one hell of a time trying to solo the first couple days of the patch, and I won't lie it is significantly harder now, but I honestly feel the current MP costs are OK. They seem wtf high because they were so low before, but once you adjust, they aren't that bad. Just make sure you're not overhealing or pulling multiple mobs. And Stygian Spikes gives you constant MP regen in combat.

The only thing I would really like to see changed for casters is a lower cool down on Dart. Archer has a short cool down for their attack, mages should have similar treatment. With a shorter cool down the people having MP issues should have an easier time because mobs die faster and more Radiance/Damnation = more MP.

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Well written... you saved me a post ... kinda o.< hehe I've never run outta mp since patch and have only had to use exaltation twice cause of silly mistakes, not cause I REALLY needed to. So much you can do now due to stamina no longer restricting your actions. Good to hear someone else having np with mp management. FYI, conj is just as easy/if not easier. Being in pt chances are mp spikes won't help you much but it's still extremely easy to manage mp still regardless. Weighing the mp cost of your spells and using a variety of skills is the path to success now which is a great thing! Skills now properly awarded on mages :) (Paralyze and blind still uber powerful and will save you from alot of hits, costs half that of a cure 2 and most mobs will hit you more than the 200-250 heals worth you'd spend it on otherwise^^ Plus you can aoe it :P Don't forget about spiritbind either people! Half mp cures Hehe)

They should stop bothering with class balancing and focus on usability of the current content. They have an interface to rework, quests to make something less of a boring walk, a R25 dungeon to cap or something, to add a way to level other than grinding or leves, and the crafting system to remake.

All of this on top of adding content.

But please, don't waste time balancing classes. It's not an urgent problem if a rank 50 class is made useless for 5 months, in the current game state: focus on the ranks < 25.

They can do nothing.. look if someone does not like the update then they do not. Everyone knew the mp usages for mage would be balanced, I was shocked when I first started and still had my mp, it is balanced now. But still leave it be, you can not satisfy everyone and SE knows this. You guys are coming off egotistical, so what if someone does not agree with your stance, it is what being human is all about, people have different opinions and thoughts that will never change.

Look how upset the jp player's are, maybe it was thm nerf that got to them, and it was largely nerfed. Maybe it was not supposed to solo stuff like dodore, and other nms?

Remember they7 have no even implemented jobs yet, just wait for everyone to get used to stuff, you guys post the same threads over and over, which antagonizes the people whether they are complainers or not, then you get trolls, and other stupid posters.

I think the forum revs are not allow to answer these kind of question (game balancing related)