#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

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Originally Posted by Lorika

I wouldn't be surprised if the healer role disapear and the current healer become either DPS or Support job.

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This is more or less what I expect of them, it feels like when a government wants to get rid of something people like - They make it terrible, people complain that they made it terrible, "we understand that this is terrible so we're getting rid of it".

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

I doubt they'll erase the healer role completely.

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When you look at the 7.0 Monk and at the Picto (Earth Reply and Starry Muse), it smell like the GW2 Route (Add War Shake It off and some of the dancer skill, and it smell the GW2 route even more)

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

We'll have to wait until the big reveal of the next expansion

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Ah yes - wait and see how they're going to keep healers in the status quo and not change a damn thing; or break SCH(Stormblood), or make AST a monster like has been for the past 6 years every expac, or keep WHM boring and heavily uninteresting.

While I haven't been as vocal, I have been watching - and I'm in the boat along with a few others that nothing will change so long as they never listen. The 'wait and see' crowd is already smokescreen for 'we're going to give you more heal bloat!' next expansion since that's what they've always done - even though they've tacked on a button to the 2m window here. And when the Healer community figures out that they've been had again after waiting and seeing, they'll get angry again while SE doesn't listen for the next 10 years.

6 years of waiting and seeing, only to see that the waiting is basically SE stonewalling us in every aspect while Tanks and DPS are the only jobs that matter.

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Originally Posted by HyperiusUltima

Ah yes - wait and see how they're going to keep healers in the status quo and not change a damn thing; or break SCH(Stormblood), or make AST a monster like has been for the past 6 years every expac, or keep WHM boring and heavily uninteresting.

While I haven't been as vocal, I have been watching - and I'm in the boat along with a few others that nothing will change so long as they never listen. The 'wait and see' crowd is already smokescreen for 'we're going to give you more heal bloat!' next expansion since that's what they've always done - even though they've tacked on a button to the 2m window here. And when the Healer community figures out that they've been had again after waiting and seeing, they'll get angry again while SE doesn't listen for the next 10 years.

6 years of waiting and seeing, only to see that the waiting is basically SE stonewalling us in every aspect while Tanks and DPS are the only jobs that matter.

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The part of this that I disagree with, is 'the next 10 years'. I can't see the game living that long, if SE continues to ignore Healer design issues as they have for several years now. We're already reaching a critical juncture, where content creators are making videos outright bashing the current Healing paradigm in the game, and threads on here, Reddit etc. are popping up more frequently, from veterans saying 'I'm tired of pressing 1' to new players asking 'is there more to healing at higher level than just pressing 1?'

If SE doesn't change course, and soon, then the role's population will wither to the point where it needs an ARR style 'big promotional event' to say 'hey we've completely revamped it please give it another go'. A Role Reborn, as it were. But maybe that's the real reason they're adding all the Duty Support, and Trusts, so that the population problem of Healers will remain obfuscated, and they can keep Healers designed as... whatever you'd call this.

Both sides are equally right here: we have to keep expressing our dissatisfaction (if we are dissatisfied, players who enjoy current healers should say so too) to show SE that (if we're the dissatisfied ones) something needs to change, but also, it's basically going to be a waiting game of 'does 8.0 actually take any of what we've been saying to heart'. And if it doesn't, I expect there will be a sudden dip in Healer population, roughly around the same time as the Media Tour Embargo being lifted, where players either move Role to Tank or DPS, or outright quit the game

Sticking heads in the sand is not a solution, SE

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Originally Posted by Lorika

When you look at the 7.0 Monk and at the Picto (Earth Reply and Starry Muse), it smell like the GW2 Route (Add War Shake It off and some of the dancer skill, and it smell the GW2 route even more)

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There is no doubt that Guild Wars 2 influenced the job developers at Creative Studio III. However, I don't see Square Enix throwing out the trinity. It'd be too much work to rebuild every job in the game to make it happen. It'd be much easier to leave the role in the game and fix healers.

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Originally Posted by HyperiusUltima

Ah yes - wait and see how they're going to keep healers in the status quo and not change a damn thing; or break SCH(Stormblood), or make AST a monster like has been for the past 6 years every expac, or keep WHM boring and heavily uninteresting.

While I haven't been as vocal, I have been watching - and I'm in the boat along with a few others that nothing will change so long as they never listen. The 'wait and see' crowd is already smokescreen for 'we're going to give you more heal bloat!' next expansion since that's what they've always done - even though they've tacked on a button to the 2m window here. And when the Healer community figures out that they've been had again after waiting and seeing, they'll get angry again while SE doesn't listen for the next 10 years.

6 years of waiting and seeing, only to see that the waiting is basically SE stonewalling us in every aspect while Tanks and DPS are the only jobs that matter.

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You misunderstand. I was not saying "wait and see." I'm saying "wait until they give us some inkling what they're going to do." We cannot provide any feedback on something on which we're completely in the dark.

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

The part of this that I disagree with, is 'the next 10 years'. I can't see the game living that long, if SE continues to ignore Healer design issues as they have for several years now. We're already reaching a critical juncture, where content creators are making videos outright bashing the current Healing paradigm in the game, and threads on here, Reddit etc. are popping up more frequently, from veterans saying 'I'm tired of pressing 1' to new players asking 'is there more to healing at higher level than just pressing 1?'

If SE doesn't change course, and soon, then the role's population will wither to the point where it needs an ARR style 'big promotional event' to say 'hey we've completely revamped it please give it another go'. A Role Reborn, as it were. But maybe that's the real reason they're adding all the Duty Support, and Trusts, so that the population problem of Healers will remain obfuscated, and they can keep Healers designed as... whatever you'd call this.

Both sides are equally right here: we have to keep expressing our dissatisfaction (if we are dissatisfied, players who enjoy current healers should say so too) to show SE that (if we're the dissatisfied ones) something needs to change, but also, it's basically going to be a waiting game of 'does 8.0 actually take any of what we've been saying to heart'. And if it doesn't, I expect there will be a sudden dip in Healer population, roughly around the same time as the Media Tour Embargo being lifted, where players either move Role to Tank or DPS, or outright quit the game

Sticking heads in the sand is not a solution, SE

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/em points up

This! A thousand times, this!

Ignoring us isn't going to make us go away, Square Enix. If you think this all will blow over, you are sadly mistaken. Your bottom line is at risk.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

There is no doubt that Guild Wars 2 influenced the job developers at Creative Studio III. However, I don't see Square Enix throwing out the trinity. It'd be too much work to rebuild every job in the game to make it happen. It'd be much easier to leave the role in the game and fix healers.

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Would that I shared your optimism. When I look at the game I see an environment where all the work is done already to remove healers from 60+ content, shifting some tank skills around and giving a few potency buffs to make ARR/HW reliably doable is all that's left.

Also, ignoring us WILL make us go away, it just takes a while.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

You misunderstand. I was not saying "wait and see." I'm saying "wait until they give us some inkling what they're going to do." We cannot provide any feedback on something on which we're completely in the dark.

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Yeah, and if you rollback to pre-Stormblood, Healers were extremely unhappy with WHM because the Lily System was heavily criticized before it was even released from the Media Tour. They've been VERY radio silent ever since about any job changes to prevent their team from actually taking criticism before the work is done instead of course correcting in stride, but I can understand how it would affect morale if you had an angry gamer criticizing you over XYZ feature or something minute. That's what the Forums originally were for - feedback.

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

The part of this that I disagree with, is 'the next 10 years'.

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It was an over-exaggeration on my part since I've been a bit jaded for a while starting back in Shadowbringers after we figured out SE has WHM-ified AST/SCH. Still, I agree with your points. Tanks were kinda dead for a good chunk of early early ARR because of the fact that nobody wanted to really play it(and they were sparse, just like Healers were with ARR's old systems). This is why we had the Tank Mounts added - to get people to do it for the mount. It's part of why you see at least every tank once usually, but with Healers they seriously need to provide an incentive to do so, if not in the same vein. I feel they're partially afraid to do so because of development resources being diverted from other projects within XIV's team to create these mounts would take some time(though to be honest, they could do without adding anything to the Mog Station for a while...)

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

Hey! I apologized!

/em sticks out tongue

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I wasn't trying to dig at you for that again. I was pointing out the general state of the community discussion.

Some raiders blame RPers, some casuals blame raiders, some RPers blame the hidden modders.

It would be nice if people just admitted that we're just not being given enough content longevity rather than tearing into each other for scraps.

Anyway, as for the healer situation, I'm apathetic to it. I've already basically quit healing anyway. If they manage to surprise us in 8.0, great, if not, then it is what it is.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

Either that or ignore all the complainers and let Astrologians be Astrologians. It's individuals excessively obsessed with job balance who bent the job designer's ear and led us to where we are now.

It's also important to note, given the sheer amount of odd or unasked for changes in our jobs, these individuals were highly likely to have been family members or co-workers of the job designers than anyone from outside of Square Enix's workforce.

We're in a classic ivory tower situation all around.

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Can't wait for the day we find out all the job changes in FFXIV are because some clueless exec is telling them to do stuff based on their kid's awful ideas or something like that.