Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

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Originally Posted by MintnHoney

If it was stated as such, those "major reworks" they're talking about are reserved for the DPS role. For Healers, this is just another roadblock they've added to further prolong their detour from having to tread through healer feedback and concerns, just like the promised healer "rework" was really just an excuse to push back the need to re-assess the role by using the sheen of a new job in order to sidestep the responsibility after sidelining it for 2 expansions. So while, yes, the thread will certainly be filled with exciting and renewed takes on the dev team's willful ignorance and the white-knighting that will happen because players are excited at getting another nugget of story to play through, it'll be just another Friday to the healer community.

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I see they've moved the goalposts even further.

The same thing that gets trotted out every new expansion:

1) Don't complain about what was shown pre-release until you try it yourself!

Followed by

2) Don't complain about it until you reach max level!

Followed by

3) Don't complain about it until the first raid tier is here!

Followed by

4) Gotta wait until the Savage Tier is released before we can change jobs!

NEW ITEM!!

5) Wait until Ultimate is released so we can really see how jobs play at the tippy top level! Despite the fact only a few percentage of the total player base actually plays or completes Ultimate content.

Followed by

6) You're just playing it wrong

7) Meanwhile, the thing that was complained about before the expansion drops, the developers acknowledge something is wrong and take 6 months to fix it (on top of the months we took to get to this point) instead of taking feedback early and fixing it then. To which the white knights will shout from the rooftops:

"Look at SE listening to our feedback!!"

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Originally Posted by Ixon

They stated that they weren't going to do major reworks till after the next Ultimate most likely because they don't want to break jobs or break the Ultimate that was already delayed so much. So this thread will be poppin off when 6.1 is just potencies and minor adjustments.

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It's almost endearing how people keep falling for these "Wait until...!" statements.
We've heard the "Wait until...!" statements for years now and the only thing that changed is that things got worse if they didn't get ignored altogether. If you honestly still believe that there's a mAjOr rEwOrK coming after Ultimate, you're naive. We're lucky if WHM gets fixed during this expansion because they sure weren't in a rush during SB or ShB to do it. Anything that actually changes the gameplay into something better?
Maybe next expansion... no, actually not. Because that, too, has been asked for years and if anything, they doubled down on it.
Sage is their vision of a "dps focused healer" - and plays exactly like the other 3.

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

It's almost endearing how people keep falling for these "Wait until...!" statements.
We've heard the "Wait until...!" statements for years now and the only thing that changed is that things got worse if they didn't get ignored altogether. If you honestly still believe that there's a mAjOr rEwOrK coming after Ultimate, you're naive. We're lucky if WHM gets fixed during this expansion because they sure weren't in a rush during SB or ShB to do it. Anything that actually changes the gameplay into something better?
Maybe next expansion... no, actually not. Because that, too, has been asked for years and if anything, they doubled down on it.
Sage is their vision of a "dps focused healer" - and plays exactly like the other 3.

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They literally could have made the Scholar ability Fey Union focus on a team member and heal when you casted and it would function literally exactly like Kardion.

Because Hydaelyn knows the fairy gauge is pointless now.

Just think, we lost the ability to manually apply Embrace on SCH, and then they essentially gave it to Sage.

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

It's almost endearing how people keep falling for these "Wait until...!" statements.
We've heard the "Wait until...!" statements for years now and the only thing that changed is that things got worse if they didn't get ignored altogether. If you honestly still believe that there's a mAjOr rEwOrK coming after Ultimate, you're naive. We're lucky if WHM gets fixed during this expansion because they sure weren't in a rush during SB or ShB to do it. Anything that actually changes the gameplay into something better?
Maybe next expansion... no, actually not. Because that, too, has been asked for years and if anything, they doubled down on it.
Sage is their vision of a "dps focused healer" - and plays exactly like the other 3.

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I was just stating what was said, what Yoshi said, in a previous live letter or interview or whatever. It appears that the "11111" echo chamber is so loud people are having issues just reading statements it seems.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

I see they've moved the goalposts even further.

The same thing that gets trotted out every new expansion:

1) Don't complain about what was shown pre-release until you try it yourself!

Followed by

2) Don't complain about it until you reach max level!

Followed by

3) Don't complain about it until the first raid tier is here!

Followed by

4) Gotta wait until the Savage Tier is released before we can change jobs!

NEW ITEM!!

5) Wait until Ultimate is released so we can really see how jobs play at the tippy top level! Despite the fact only a few percentage of the total player base actually plays or completes Ultimate content.

Followed by

6) You're just playing it wrong

7) Meanwhile, the thing that was complained about before the expansion drops, the developers acknowledge something is wrong and take 6 months to fix it (on top of the months we took to get to this point) instead of taking feedback early and fixing it then. To which the white knights will shout from the rooftops:

"Look at SE listening to our feedback!!"

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Let's add in

8) Wait until next expac, Ultimate is coming in X.1/Savage in X.2/Savage in X.4 and we refuse to do major balance patches to avoid upsetting balance.

Couldn't agree more. Healing is really, really boring now.

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Originally Posted by Ixon

I was just stating what was said, what Yoshi said, in a previous live letter or interview or whatever. It appears that the "11111" echo chamber is so loud people are having issues just reading statements it seems.

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Oh goodness gracious me, I wonder if the evil 11111 echo chamber hasn't heard "we're not making adjustments this patch so don't expect anything" over and over and over again for years. We know how to read. Yoshi's been telling us that we're not getting reworks or outright ignoring us for years. We're not surprised, we're just telling you that this is part of the normal "just wait until the expansion" -> "just wait until you level" -> "just wait until savage" -> "just wait until the balancing patch" -> "you just don't understand how good and engaging 1111111111111111 is until you've tried it" endless cycle.

"You're not going to get a rework next patch" isn't some sort of gotcha. Maybe the state of healers is so awful that it warrants a rework, even *gasp* during a patch that normally doesn't see them? Oh wait, they're not DPS, that's not going to happen. Only DPS get that.

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Originally Posted by Ixon

I was just stating what was said, what Yoshi said, in a previous live letter or interview or whatever. It appears that the "11111" echo chamber is so loud people are having issues just reading statements it seems.

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I'm not so sure about that given how they changed Ninja, Summoner and Samurai and Astro in 5.1 on the eve of TEA. Even then when was the last time healers ever got reworked to a huge extent outside of expansion releases? You may have how a move changes like Sleeve Draw or some mp reshuffling but nothing so drastic as what they did with NIN, SMN, and SAM in 5.1 or MNK in 5.4

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Originally Posted by Ixon

I was just stating what was said, what Yoshi said, in a previous live letter or interview or whatever. It appears that the "11111" echo chamber is so loud people are having issues just reading statements it seems.

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No. The issue is that Yoshida and the developers have been telling healers to “wait until [insert content/patch here]” since before Stormblood even launched. That was in mid-2017. It started with healers saying that the Stormblood Lily System on WHM was crap when the Media Tour tooltips were released. “Please wait until expansion launch to try it.” Expansion releases, Lilies still suck. “Please wait until Savage.” “Please wait until Ultimate.” “Please wait until 5.0, because we cannot do any major adjustments until then” (that was back around patch 4.4, iirc). For the ShB Media Tour when they revealed that DNC wasn’t going to be a healer, “Please wait until 5.0. We are going to work on healer balance and make adjustments to each job.”

Healers have been told to wait for a long time. We’ve been constantly pushed to the side. We’re always given excuse after excuse as to why our gameplay cannot be considered and/or adjusted. So pardon us if we’re just tired of hearing the same stuff for the last 4 to 6 years.

What I would personally love, is for WHM and SGE to have a 3 to 4 button combo with 1 or 2 ogcds. I would have SCH have dot management (akin to 2.0 SMN) and have AST have a 2 button combo with an expanded focus on the card system.
I would also have it, so that no healing skill (ogcd and gcd) would break the combo system; so there little punishment for healing when needed.