Connecting the DoTs: A Summoner Guide

Just got my Hive book. Deathflare hits for around 3k unbuffed now D:

Also, this fight and Bismark EX are a total nightmare for BLMs haha, SE really screwed over BLMs this patch.

The opener I've been doing is:

>precast on pull > bio 2 >obey >miasma > bio > Fester > ruin > shadowflare > ruin 2 > rouse > spur > ruin 1 > ruin 2 > fester > painflare > ruin 2 > Raging > enkindle > ruin 2 > dreadwyrm trance > ruin 2 > draconic potion > tri disaster > ruin 2 > fester > painflare > ruin 2 > swiftcast shadowflare > ruin 3 > ruin 2 > deathflare

or something like that. so hard toremember lol

Pre pull: Shadowflare + Rouse + Spur + Raging Strikes


On pull: Bio 2 > Miasma > Bio > Enkindle > Ruin2 > Fester > Painflare > Ruin 2 > Energydrain > Ruin 2 > Aetherflow > Ruin 2 > Dreadwyrm Trance > Draconic Potion > Tridisaster(Should cast this just as raging strikes is about to fall off to make sure your dots are buffed by DWT+RS+Pot) Fester(Should also buffed by RS, needs high Spell Speed) > Miasma 2 > Swiftcast > Shadowflare > Ruin 3 > Ruin 2 > Fester > Deathflare.

Bursts into 1750 with the Hive book. Parsed at around 1080 in 2:50 minutes. i168.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Pre pull: Shadowflare + Rouse + Spur + Raging Strikes


On pull: Bio 2 > Miasma > Bio > Enkindle > Ruin2 > Fester > Painflare > Ruin 2 > Energydrain > Ruin 2 > Aetherflow > Ruin 2 > Dreadwyrm Trance > Draconic Potion > Tridisaster(Should cast this just as raging strikes is about to fall off to make sure your dots are buffed by DWT+RS+Pot) Fester(Should also buffed by RS, needs high Spell Speed) > Miasma 2 > Swiftcast > Shadowflare > Ruin 3 > Ruin 2 > Fester > Deathflare.

Bursts into 1750 with the Hive book. Parsed at around 1080 in 2:50 minutes. i168.

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That's very close to BLM. I think BLM does do a bit more on dummy but yeeeeeeah about that in real fights ...

Hello everyone. I have a question for all of you about smn. I remember playing Smn for t6-9 and well it was a pretty meh class then. Currently I am in a group with some friends and well I was going to be mch but the class is all around not fun. My main is a mnk but in our group we already have a Drg+NIN. I must either go WAR or SMN so I'm hear to ask is Smn actually more interesting and a bit more viable than before? What is everyone's honest opinion about them right now? ( I heard WAR is amazing right now and mnk, but something is calling me to smn!)

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

That's very close to BLM. I think BLM does do a bit more on dummy but yeeeeeeah about that in real fights ...

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Done about 760 on Ravana Extreme and I messed up plenty. No bard too. What are BLMs usually pulling on that fight ? It seems that fight isn't as punishing to BLMs as Bismark EX.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Done about 760 on Ravana Extreme and I messed up plenty. No bard too. What are BLMs usually pulling on that fight ? It seems that fight isn't as punishing to BLMs as Bismark EX.

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Dunno, progressing on final phase still. Will get back to you on that.

Edit: 650 ... Didn't die. GG. Too much running around just doing mechanics, and lots of Enochian drops.

As I repeat it there's a lot of room for optimizing but yeah doing good sustain is a nightmare.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

Dunno, progressing on final phase still. Will get back to you on that.

Edit: 650 ... Didn't die. GG. Too much running around just doing mechanics, and lots of Enochian drops.

As I repeat it there's a lot of room for optimizing but yeah doing good sustain is a nightmare.

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That's really good for a first kill. It gets much better when you know when to use the buffs and stuff and get more comfortable with mechanics. I think Bismark is much worse to be honest.

How is the burst damage on SMN this patch? Are they really better than BLM?

With some more optimization it's more like 700-750, maybe I'll do better but that's what I'm settling around :/

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Originally Posted by Bklyn718

How is the burst damage on SMN this patch? Are they really better than BLM?

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the burst is insane although it's not whenever you feel like it, it has to be timed with cds, lots of cds...
seems like good summoners can pull awesome dps with much effort, job is being rewarded for one's skill for once.
i'm settling with 1k dps on single target with crappy gear for 2-3 mins, it's basically when raging is available that the damage peaks like crazy. Feels great to compete with melee on some boss fights!!

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Originally Posted by Minorinz

the burst is insane although it's not whenever you feel like it, it has to be timed with cds, lots of cds...
seems like good summoners can pull awesome dps with much effort, job is being rewarded for one's skill for once.
i'm settling with 1k dps on single target with crappy gear for 2-3 mins, it's basically when raging is available that the damage peaks like crazy. Feels great to compete with melee on some boss fights!!

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Wow summoner used to be my main but I switched to BLM since SMN wasn't that great before patch. Now 3.0 is here SMN seems to be better than BLM. I already have my BLM to lvl 57 but i'm thinking about switching back to summoner now.

I played with it some more after reading some suggested rotations. I'm kind of in love with SMN more than ever; it almost makes me want to DPS rather than heal!

I don't have exact parse numbers, but I definitely felt like I could keep up versus a BLM at least.

In a few DFs I've been healing, I noticed a big difference when a SMN who's doing it right is in the group; things melt so much faster.

And why you not use enkindle when you use Xpotion ? Now your pet take too buff (food and potion).

I'm not too sure about saving raging strikes for when you enter Dreadwyrm Trance as you're missing out on three buffed festers while you build stacks, PS4 pls.

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Originally Posted by Wisper

And why you not use enkindle when you use Xpotion ? Now your pet take too buff (food and potion).

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Not sure if anyone has tested if pets get Pot buffs as well, since only food was mentioned (probably need to summon pet after using food though)

It would be something neat to try though. X-Pot-> Spur (resets pet stats, not sure if you could just use a vit pot in this regard for instant verification)

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Originally Posted by Bhuni

I'm not too sure about saving raging strikes for when you enter Dreadwyrm Trance as you're missing out on three buffed festers while you build stacks, PS4 pls.

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In most cases it is ideal to save RS for DT. If you are holding Aetherflow in order to Fester (or Pain for AOE) during DT then you can fit in two during that time frame. You can never fit more than 2 X Fester into a RS.

Once someone finds the ideal opener, I'm sure we will see a bunch of variations of it as well. I do not see it being ideal to burn aetherflow stacks (on crap skills like Energy Drain, and single target Pain) without using a POT or having only certain buffs available for it.

Fester 300 Potency
Energy Drain - 150 Potency (requires 100% damage increase to equal an Unbuffed Fester)
Pain Flare - 200 Potency (Requires 50% damage increase to equal an Unbuffed Fester)

Raging Strkes - 20%
Foes - 10% or BV Foes 20%
Trick Attack - 10% (10s window)
best available HQ Pot - 15%? (15s)

Total best case 65% for a 10s window
EG -> 250
Pain -> 330
Less than 2 X Normal Festers.
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In most cases it may even be ideal to have a Post-Opener (30s into the fight).
Trick Attack, is not a huge loss in order to save the higher potency Festers for later, and there is no reason you can't delay the BV'd Foes for 30s into the fight. (since it could be ideal for the Bard to start in Minuet for an opener VS 10% mage damage)

Didn't even notice I put three festers instead of two I'm such a turd, thank you.

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Originally Posted by Judge_Xero

In most cases it is ideal to save RS for DT. If you are holding Aetherflow in order to Fester (or Pain for AOE) during DT then you can fit in two during that time frame. You can never fit more than 2 X Fester into a RS.

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If you precast it, RS comes up just after a DWT. It's almost not worth it to save RS for the next one, and I'd almost rather save it for the festers and the dots you put up before dwt.

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Originally Posted by Bklyn718

Wow summoner used to be my main but I switched to BLM since SMN wasn't that great before patch. Now 3.0 is here SMN seems to be better than BLM. I already have my BLM to lvl 57 but i'm thinking about switching back to summoner now.

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A lvl 60 BLM does insane damage. Leylines + AST speed buff + Raging strikes is quite possibly the most legit combination in the game right now. BLMs problem is not damage as on paper they should still outperform a SMN with raw damage. BLMs problem is moving, that will be the thing BLMs will have to accommodate with. For those who can't handle the new rotation while moving switching to SMN would probably be your best bet.

About Flare, I wasn't really upset about the nerf it's about balance. Deathflare has more potency because it can't be spammed.

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Originally Posted by Vallhallix

A lvl 60 BLM does insane damage. Leylines + AST speed buff + Raging strikes is quite possibly the most legit combination in the game right now. BLMs problem is not damage as on paper they should still outperform a SMN with raw damage. BLMs problem is moving, that will be the thing BLMs will have to accommodate with. For those who can't handle the new rotation while moving switching to SMN would probably be your best bet.

About Flare, I wasn't really upset about the nerf it's about balance. Deathflare has more potency because it can't be spammed.

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There is a ridiculous amount of moving in Ravana EX and Bismark EX. A ridiculous amount.

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Originally Posted by Meleoffs

There is a ridiculous amount of moving in Ravana EX and Bismark EX. A ridiculous amount.

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And still you see BLM clearing them in the first 2 days. Your point ?

So, wait... is Blm stronger than Smn still? Seems weird for a job with a comparatively simpler rotation to out dps one that is more complex, unless Smn is weaker because of Virus, E4E, Battle Rez, and now Ifrit's aoe reflect aura. I dunno, I still like the changes to Smn and after using Smn's LB3 in WoD yesterday, I don't think I could ever go back to having Meteor as my LB3.

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Originally Posted by Renryuu

So, wait... is Blm stronger than Smn still? Seems weird for a job with a comparatively simpler rotation to out dps one that is more complex, unless Smn is weaker because of Virus, E4E, Battle Rez, and now Ifrit's aoe reflect aura. I dunno, I still like the changes to Smn and after using Smn's LB3 in WoD yesterday, I don't think I could ever go back to having Meteor as my LB3.

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The measure of a classes DPS should never be its complexity. As for your question, things seem to point that, in a vacuum, both jobs perform similarly but when you throw in mechanics and movement, BLM can't keep up.

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Originally Posted by Shamirah

And still you see BLM clearing them in the first 2 days. Your point ?

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Clearing them and doing as much dps as smn in them are different things. SMN could clear t13 just fine, but people said they were shit.

I know what you mean but you were implying that BLM won't be viable in those high movements fights.. which is false. I'm pretty sure they're doing good.

Imo it's a good thing for them => it'll show when you are a skilled BLM that knows the fight and how to position.

how awesome is SMN now? i always liked the dot/slowly burn type of skills
gonna finish DRG soon and debating on leveling war or get a double lvl 60 class with smn/sch next

It's pretty good. They gave SMN what they lacked : stronger aoe/burst.

I really love healing speedrun with a SMN in the group... it's just... perfect. I guess it's mostly due to the fact that only summoners seems to aoe nowadays... BLM seems to think that they can't aoe anymore.

I find BLM harder to play than SMN.

SMN is still rote memory. BLM is much harder to react to stuff.

However, I still find SMN more fun.

Do anybody else have that kind of issue if you use 3D and contagion? Contagion do not have effect at all sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChpV...ature=youtu.be

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Originally Posted by Sunako

Do anybody else have that kind of issue if you use 3D and contagion? Contagion do not have effect at all sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChpV...ature=youtu.be

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Probably just a server thing. May need X amount of time before it's registered for Contagion. (saw that you used both immediately)

Try it again with Garuda already attacking the dummy, I bet the delay from her attacking to using Contagion will be enough.

Updated rotation with me saving last AF stack to ensure I enter every DWT with full stacks. And also fitting in 2 festers in DWT.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0kNMmyMEZ8

Parses at around 1120 in 3 minutes. Hive weapon, full I170 left side and right side.


p.s: playing summoner on a controller is the true endgame ;-;


Now to level BLM to see what all the complaints are about.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

p.s: playing summoner on a controller is the true endgame ;-;

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It's worse when you try to make hotkeys by adding a keyboard to the mix like I did lol.

I've actually been doing the same with delaying the last AF stack largely in dungeons to line up the DWT with full AF stacks both on boss fights and on general mob to mob pulls (holding onto DWT). I felt I was doing higher damage overall after having settled on this by the time I hit 60. If we are able to use AF stacks along side DWT, then I hardly seem the reason not to abuse that aspect.

@OneWingedSora
Could you post a written version of your rotation? I'd like to test it out. Oh and I also agree, controller SMN is the new Titan EX

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Originally Posted by waifugenerator

@OneWingedSora
Could you post a written version of your rotation? I'd like to test it out. Oh and I also agree, controller SMN is the new Titan EX

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re pull: Shadowflare + Rouse + Spur + Raging Strikes


On pull: Bio 2 > Miasma > Bio > Enkindle > Ruin2 > Fester > Painflare > Ruin 2 > Energydrain > Ruin 2 > Aetherflow > Ruin 2 > Dreadwyrm Trance > Draconic Potion > Tridisaster(Should cast this just as raging strikes is about to fall off to make sure your dots are buffed by DWT+RS+Pot) Fester(Should also buffed by RS, needs high Spell Speed) > Miasma 2 > Swiftcast > Shadowflare > Ruin 3 > Ruin 2 > Fester > Deathflare.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Updated rotation with me saving last AF stack to ensure I enter every DWT with full stacks. And also fitting in 2 festers in DWT.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0kNMmyMEZ8

Parses at around 1120 in 3 minutes. Hive weapon, full I170 left side and right side.


p.s: playing summoner on a controller is the true endgame ;-;


Now to level BLM to see what all the complaints are about.

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I noticed you let Shadow Flare fall off and stay off for a few GCDs more than once. Was this an execution error or is this intentional? I don't really know how SMN at 60 works.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

I noticed you let Shadow Flare fall off and stay off for a few GCDs more than once. Was this an execution error or is this intentional? I don't really know how SMN at 60 works.

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Yeah because there are other things that gets priority like not letting the main dots fall off, etc.

No offense intended whatsoever but I think you could have kept Shadow Flare at 0:51 and 1:37 with no damage to your rotation, those are the main times I was wondering if there was some deeper time frame or CD positioning at work.

Not trying to rag on you! Was just curious :)

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

No offense intended whatsoever but I think you could have kept Shadow Flare at 0:51 and 1:37 with no damage to your rotation, those are the main times I was wondering if there was some deeper time frame or CD positioning at work.

Not trying to rag on you! Was just curious :)

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Yea you are right , I just didn't see SF falling off for 2-3 secs a huge deal but it probably is ;-; I will keep that in mind, thanks !

When should I work in radiant shield? It looks like it's a huge dps increase for the tank at least

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Originally Posted by Judge_Xero

It would be something neat to try though. X-Pot-> Spur (resets pet stats, not sure if you could just use a vit pot in this regard for instant verification)

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hmm not sure anyone responded/tested, but used a vit pot and spur, and Garuda got extra vit and the pot buff. But I had to spur it.