P1N Warrior solo kill

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

It's precisely isn't the job issue having self heals, it's the normal raid having no threat of damage, no threat of enrage. .

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Hah? I have seen Eden 10 go enrage when only me and another tank were alive for a while, we could have killed it with no problem though.

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Originally Posted by RobynDaBank

Honestly I blame it on this being moved to the Tank forums. This turned from a "content needs no healer" to a balance issue.

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Yeah, the moderators don't seem inclined to read the thread any more than the "CHECKMATE WARRIOR'S NOT OP BECAUSE PALADIN AND GUNBREAKER CAN DO IT TOO" crowd :(

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Originally Posted by eagledorf

Yeah I hate that Paladin can do this too. It's very slightly less offensive than WAR in that PLD had to sacrifice their tanking and damage-dealing to go healer mode, but it's still terrible.

If the game were like an old-school MMO where roles weren't locked in in the duty finder and healers could go DPS mode equal to tanks it wouldn't bother me that a Paladin could go healer mode at the cost of DPS and enmity, but forcing people into a pure healer role and then making content where that's not even necessary is disastrous regardless of what tank (or summoner, back when Titan was a tank) is doing it and regardless of how hardcore the content is. Is SE going to force healers into one role of the trinity while tanks get to occupy three, or will SE give healers the same flexibility and importance as tanks?

I know SE crushed healer flexibility because healers themselves complained about the pressure of DPS and healing, but that was when healers were forced to meld accuracy and vitality and got screamed at for literally everything because they had sole responsibility for party survival. With substantial reforms to the game including buffs to tank utility and a greater focus on gimmicks, it's now a negative to continue to lock healers into just one thing and then make that one thing largely unnecessary.

Either healers need to be absolutely indispensable, or they need something else to do. Either of these is fine (though the former is more pressure on healers).

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Having played other games where healers COULD roll a DPS spec, I think this is exactly my frustration, I I am not really required to go full-bore healing spec it is SO frustrating to go 2111111111111111111111111112, with the occasional heals. I would SO much rather be able to have that flexibility , which I had in other games (sadly I even miss cleric stance), to have a DPS spec, which would still give me some heals and utility such as raises.

Love the warriors gaslighting everyone saying that whaver a warrior solos "doesn't matter"

Well as a GLD in 1.0 and PLD on 1.X and in ARR 2.0-2.X, HW 3.0 -3.X. People forgot that we have CROSS CLASS SKILLS in which Paladin had access to Cure which later on was replaced by Clemency. And basically they take Bloodbath from Warriors... ANY person who have played the old FF games and some others MMORPG (not only DPS brain-dead discussion ones) knows tanks have a healing skills even in FFXI PLD have access to Cure IV.

Basically, talking trash about sustainability is not helping at this point.

This ONLY happen when u take out little things like Stone Skin, Protect. Alternate status effectiveness (for example, u still have sleep but what do you sleep in dungeon normally). And focus only the tools on DPS, DPS, DPS…

Do not misunderstand me, the DPS is important, sustainability is important, and as a (old tank type) my mind is being the defensive tank out there. Help party with the DPS and already been good mitigation helping healer to not only focus on me, but not as much that do not need the healer or that I am dependent on it because in the end… I am not DPSer, I am not a paper, I am TANK defensive is for something. Of course, I need boss or enemies to do less DMG on me.

HOWEVER! Game Devs need to address that ANY CURRENT CONTENT that needs 8 party members and is SOLO-ABLE for 1 person needs to take into consideration because is a flawless on the design. Do it on dungeon it is not the same that doing it on Raid (24, normal or savage). Raids are expected to be more challenging, at least the 80% to use and know your skills.

With these as I have mention to my old mates that play with me since 1.0 or 2.0, this downscale and (some jobs if u read the player guide reference are nerfed since the beginning due to the DS). We are returning to HW times… Where I can even solo Diablo in Dun Scaith as a PLD.

It's not gaslighting when the devs agree.

Been soloing things better than most jobs since ARR. Sorry.

I actually didn't even know they have no enrage lol.

But yeah anyone defending this.
Just why?
It's so clearly not okay doesn't matter if it's WAR or PLD, the whole '' it's meant to be easy '' is just dumb it's group content it's not meant to be THAT easy that you can literally solo it.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

I actually didn't even know they have no enrage lol.

But yeah anyone defending this.
Just why?
It's so clearly not okay doesn't matter if it's WAR or PLD, the whole '' it's meant to be easy '' is just dumb it's group content it's not meant to be THAT easy that you can literally solo it.

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Because being able to solo easy content in the slowest way possible confers zero advantage, especially because there's no struggle in clearing it normally in the first place.

What would you rather do, take over an hour to clear something solo, or just queue in DF and clear it 5 times as fast (even including wipes)

People can clear dungeons with no tank. People can clear dungeons as all healers, all DPS, all tanks. People regularly clear current alliance raids with meme comps all the time. No one cares. Just because you CAN doesn't mean it's GOOD or worth doing.
This game is not hard, the majority of content can be cleared in incredibly meme ways. There's a clear of P1 normal with only auto attacks. It took 9 hours.

As long as the "correct" way continues to be the most efficient then there is no issue at all that certain jobs can do things in different ways. I don't see warriors regularly clearing P1 normal solo, because no one wants to put in the time and effort to do it just for a slooooooooooooooow clear of something that's way faster to do normally.

I think the crucial part here is whether Warrior being able to solo something like P1N reduces or increases available content.

A solo run of P1N isn't going to replace a normal, far faster run that Warrior could still get instant queues for almost any time of night. As such, it merely adds a form of side-content. Nor is Warrior so advantaged in that core/real content as to bar other tanks from it, reducing available content for those who want to tank but do not want to play Warrior.

It's a bit odd that said side-content is limited to a single tank, with no other tank having their answer to it or similar advantage in other turns, but that's still more just-for-fun side-content than we had before with no loss to real content or job choice therein.

To consider an opposite example, though, Bloodwhetting's scaling procedure could outright destroy Savage dungeons or the like, if they were a thing, making them (especially, their trash) very difficult to balance for both Warrior and the non-Warrior tanks; if merely challenging for non-Warriors, trash would be pitiful to Warriors, while if trash were challenging even to Warriors, it'd likely wall off many non-Warrior tank players. That'd be something that, contextually (i.e., if SE ever wanted to add content variety beyond GS mini-games), would require fixing. (Even now, Bloodwhetting's AoE scaling is beyond ridiculous -- rather than merely mildly OP, as it was in ShB -- and probably should be reeled back to merely relatively overpowered.)

Thing to consider is once they stop gating token drops you can just take a Warrior to claim every token and it might be a more effective way to either gear up other classes or farm GC seals or get desynths rather easily. Instead of 10 minute runs and competing for tokens.