Simple Fix to PLD

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

WAR
has higher base HP
5 threat generation skills: (Voke, collusion, weaponskill, Flash, Dps)
3 Damage reduction skills: (Rampart Sentnel and foresight)
1 heal: Second Wind (
Thats it... Thats all it can do.

---

Hmm so bloodbath doesn't count as healing now ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

...

Edit: I am in NO way saying, PLD should be your main tank in CC or AV or whatever, I am saying that it IS ALREADY a very strong class, people just don't know how to play. It doesn't need a "buff" it needs you to "Learn2play" before suggesting revisions to already well balanced features.

---

Others covered the rest of that post in spades, but really isn't this the problem, PLD is a tank and the answer is don't use pld as a tank for things?
Does that not seem horribly broken?
Does that not need some work?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

I'm sorry, when did we switch to magic resistance? I recall the conversation to be on physical defense.

Anyway...

If your entire basis for PLD needing a buff is magic resistance, then you should have said that.

Everywhere else, PLD is a better, and more versatile tank.

WAR is a better DPS/Tank hybrid.

---

It was on dmg mitigation in general.
WAR should not be the definitive answer to tanking, it should be a secondary at most, PLDs traditionally tank and tank well, this is not the case in just FFs but all RPGs that have PLD or a PLD like class. How can anyone say that another job is a better tank and not feel instantly like something is wrong.

Shield your eyes here's some FFXI stuff:
Are there other classes that tank? Hell yea, gods know I loved tanking on thf, nin, dnc, mnk all in XI, but at the end of the day a pld could tank all the same things and if they were decent they'd do it well, the -m/pdt gear more than making them a match for those AoE spells/attks that ate shadows and put down my eva tanks.
You can safely unshield your eyes now.

Really to say, wear more def, your a bad pld, or any of that other crap is just that, it's crap. PLD is broken, we all know it, stop trying to say it isn't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinko

Hmm so bloodbath doesn't count as healing now ?

---

I'm more worried about him forgetting Vengeance and Antagonize. Maybe that's why he thinks PLD is good, he knows absolutely nothing about WAR and thinks cover is a "damage reduction" ability.

Featherfoot too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Enfarious

Dmg reduction has an impact on enmity reduction:
dmg dealt == +enmity while dmg recieved == -enmity
Therefore a dmg reduction trait would help a pld hold hate

---

lol I'm sure glad knowledgeable people post on these forums to help shape the future of this game.

I fully support traits for jobs. :) I like this idea, and I only wonder if traits would be quested for, or learned automatically. My hope is that they would be quested for. :)

Edit:
Thinking about it more, I would like one of the traits that PLD gets is a damage buff against undead.

I don't want to go too crazy speculating, so I'll leave it at that. :)

Second Wind and Bloodbath are "instant heal", it's easy to use them without being interrupt by a... for exemple... 100T Swing ?

If you want 20% or more damage reduction, then lower their enmity generation, make it more harder to keep it if you just going to straight tank.

If i only count on Coincutter (and mob similar to him), 20% reduction will make the 3700~ 100T Swing reduce to 3000~ (it's fair i think, and wont one shot you if you're not double melded HP+ materia to reach 4k HP) you can then use now more often your healing spell that will make you generate more enmity, and your AF with all its MP+ will make more sense.

If you're going to reduce damage overall it's would also be better to reduce damage reduction from shield block, and more you're increasing the shield block rate, the less you're getting reduction damage. Perhaps if the mitigation isn't enough you could get some materia damage reduction to socket on a shield or having this effect on an rare/ex shield.
Revamp Aegis Boon, so instead of blocking the next hit with 100% dmg reduction, your block rate and damage mitigation are enhanced (by 20% each ?).


I think the overheal from whm is what make warrior tank far superior, whm hardly fall out of mana, warrior can handle 4~5k damage (he avoid the "one shot" move from boss), paladin have some healing spell, but can hardly use them, either he is silenced or he must move to avoid the boss TPmove, if paladin can straight tank and avoid being one shot from a TPmove he'll be more able to heal himself more often. The other problem with whm is the enmity generation, you have to bring 2 whm if you want to spare some hate. Also give BRD Cure II... (so he can choose between dmg support or healing support).



With all that, the dev's team can also change some mechanics from mobs/boss, like a debuff on you that'll give (magic) defense down, etc... so it doesn't make anyone to overpowered.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nexxus

Second Wind and Bloodbath are "instant heal", it's easy to use them without being interrupt by a... for exemple... 100T Swing ?

If you want 20% or more damage reduction, then lower their enmity generation, make it more harder to keep it if you just going to straight tank.

If i only count on Coincutter (and mob similar to him), 20% reduction will make the 3700~ 100T Swing reduce to 3000~ (it's fair i think, and wont one shot you if you're not double melded HP+ materia to reach 4k HP) you can then use now more often your healing spell that will make you generate more enmity, and your AF with all its MP+ will make more sense.

If you're going to reduce damage overall it's would also be better to reduce damage reduction from shield block, and more you're increasing the shield block rate, the less you're getting reduction damage. Perhaps if the mitigation isn't enough you could get some materia damage reduction to socket on a shield or having this effect on an rare/ex shield.
Revamp Aegis Boon, so instead of blocking the next hit with 100% dmg reduction, your block rate and damage mitigation are enhanced (by 20% each ?).


I think the overheal from whm is what make warrior tank far superior, whm hardly fall out of mana, warrior can handle 4~5k damage (he avoid the "one shot" move from boss), paladin have some healing spell, but can hardly use them, either he is silenced or he must move to avoid the boss TPmove, if paladin can straight tank and avoid being one shot from a TPmove he'll be more able to heal himself more often. The other problem with whm is the enmity generation, you have to bring 2 whm if you want to spare some hate. Also give BRD Cure II... (so he can choose between dmg support or healing support).



With all that, the dev's team can also change some mechanics from mobs/boss, like a debuff on you that'll give (magic) defense down, etc... so it doesn't make anyone to overpowered.

---

Don't agree with this pld shouldn't loose enmity cause they take less dmg the class is built for nothing but doing that, that would be silly to do. That's like saying PLD's in XI should have had less hate gaining skill cause the took the least dmg out of any job in the game...

I mean, if you're just straight tanking so your principal job is to deal atleast with enmity generation, or you won't get fun at all playing with it standing right there. Actually the enmity is not so good, but that's because you can not use all your skills if you have to avoid some TPmove.

You can:

- Reduce enmity generation from cure spells (for whm).
- Give bard cure II, so it'll help a bit with enmity from whm.
- Give an enmity skills that'll last 30s and recast is 30s and enhance enmity generation from some skills.
- reduce enmity generation from some skills (generate less enmity overall, but use a skill to keep it up as it was before)

Note: some skills = Sames skills

People just plain dont know how to play PLD now is all. I come across this almost every random AF nm shout group I join. They have no clue how to kite without taking dmg, they cant hold hate "but im spamming every hate ability I got" youd be suprised how many times that line is used by alot of you PLD out there xP & their PLDs are geared to deal dmg like they ever gona compete with actual dd's. How many of you plds stacking STR/MND, VIT/STR or VIT/MND? or even worse stacking HP?

DEX/VIT xP give it a try cause if you not @300+ DEX why bother carrying your shield around?

860+ DEF
+71 Enmity
325 VIT
310 DEX
470 Magic Evasion
after buff/food no meds & none of its darklight gear

Theres my main stats on PLD and I have 0 problem with tanking and dd's arent asked to hold back. As for someone saying PLD takes same dmg as WAR lol this is not true by a long shot when your partially blocking nearly ever attack and full blocking + much higher DEF. For example last night 5 maned Great Buffalo for fun with my PLD and just 1 WHM. You partially block Onrush 1200 dmg Onrush deals 2500 dmg. At a rough glance Id say I partially blocked or full blocked 60-70% of all his attacks? Very rough guess after going through my log after the fight, but my partials happen alot. I know great buffalo is old news but it still hits like a truck & its what I most recently did checking my log after the fight.

Hope it helps some of you out there who are having trouble with your PLD ^^ obviously your shield is key, but also takes skill with timing/spacing out your abilities.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LadySaeko

People just plain dont know how to play PLD now is all. I come across this almost every random AF nm shout group I join. They have no clue how to kite without taking dmg, they cant hold hate "but im spamming every hate ability I got" youd be suprised how many times that line is used by alot of you PLD out there xP & their PLDs are geared to deal dmg like they ever gona compete with actual dd's. How many of you plds stacking STR/MND, VIT/STR or VIT/MND? or even worse stacking HP?

DEX/VIT xP give it a try cause if you not @300+ DEX why bother carrying your shield around?

860+ DEF
+71 Enmity
325 VIT
310 DEX
470 Magic Evasion
after buff/food no meds & none of its darklight gear

Theres my main stats on PLD and I have 0 problem with tanking and dd's arent asked to hold back. As for someone saying PLD takes same dmg as WAR lol this is not true by a long shot when your partially blocking nearly ever attack and full blocking + much higher DEF. For example last night 5 maned Great Buffalo for fun with my PLD and just 1 WHM. You partially block Onrush 1200 dmg Onrush deals 2500 dmg. At a rough glance Id say I partially blocked or full blocked 60-70% of all his attacks? Very rough guess after going through my log after the fight, but my partials happen alot. I know great buffalo is old news but it still hits like a truck & its what I most recently did checking my log after the fight.

Hope it helps some of you out there who are having trouble with your PLD ^^ obviously your shield is key, but also takes skill with timing/spacing out your abilities.

---

I don't think you get it. A WAR can do better in a shorter time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LadySaeko

At a rough glance Id say I partially blocked or full blocked 60-70% of all his attacks? Very rough guess after going through my log after the fight, but my partials happen alot.

---

Would you please elaborate on the difference between a partial block and a full block? Thanks in advance.

Also, why block Onrush (and care about the mitigation you can get on it) when you can dodge it, or even better, completely eliminate it from the fight? I hope you see how this is relevant to the current dungeons and bosses, and the situation the two tanks are in.