Been running Ridorana Lighthouse the whole week and...

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Originally Posted by Awha

It is not fair, but it is acceptable since they were part of the party.

I do understand your position

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If you think it's acceptable then you do not understand my position.

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Like, the problem with the weekly lockout without "need" is that players who actually want it, will lose a roll to players who maybe don't even play that job. On all other raids that do not have the lockout, you can no reason not to greed everything you want, because someone will certainly want it, even for seals/desynth. The developers should have removed being able to turn in for seals/desynth from the alliance raid gear along with the greed-only change so that players only greed on gear they want to wear or use for glamour. Or alternatively, allow like-for-like trades of gear via a NPC so that you only need to win any gear for that slot to exchange it for the gear you want.

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As I mentioned before it is not a perfect system and SE could have gone about it better, but I do understand the intention behind the change and I appreciate the effort, as you mentioned they could have done about it differently and personally I have suggested a gear trade npc in another thread, that would be my perfect ideal system. I will take the good with the bad when it comes to the change, I would like adjustments to be made and I am sure with time adjustments will be made to the system. Way I see both systems screw over a group of players I am simply in favor of this system since in this system everyone has a equal shot at walking away with something.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

If you think it's acceptable then you do not understand my position.

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My English is not that great, but I was under the impression that fair and acceptable do not necessarily mean the same thing. I do agree that it is unfair that someone who does next to nothing has the chance to roll on something, but can we really say that within the current system it is not acceptable for them to roll being as they were part of the group and were given a chance to roll by the system?

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Trolls are going to pretend to be gracious enough to pass if certain loot drops that someone else nicely asked for...and then roll on it because they'll think it's funny to make someone else panic or become angry.

Saying you won't roll on something in an alliance raid and doing the opposite is not likely to be a reportable offense.

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It is, though. Once you agree to it in /party, you're bound to it. You are of course free not to say anything at all, or to say that you're going to roll on things anyway. But people can be (and have been) punished for agreeing to particular loot distribution requests and then reneging later when the loot drops.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

I'll let you in on a secret. Some people don't know how to play their mains.

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This greed only system has not made runs smoother. I've had more stupid people in Ridorana than ever before because now people are just doing whatever they want because they can roll on whatever they want. I've eaten tank busters as a RDM WITH Diversion on in a couple of those bosses because people who just want fast queue as tanks go in and sit on their thumbs the whole time.

Also, I have seen an influx of people sitting on loot come last boss, refusing to roll until the timer runs out. They want people to get frustrated and leave so they have a better chance of winning. I am guilty of this as well - I did Void Ark on NIN for the top and it dropped and I rolled a 98. At least 5 other people made me wait out the timer (hey, I can do homework while I wait) because THEY wanted it too. It's all and all a super obnoxious system that is just causing vitriol in parties.

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Originally Posted by Awha

but can we really say that within the current system it is not acceptable for them to roll being as they were part of the group and were given a chance to roll by the system?

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I'm not saying it is unacceptable for them to roll. I am saying it is unacceptable for loot to be equal priority for everyone including people who aren't playing that role. It rewards laziness and dumb luck. It doesn't reward a player for actually trying to play the role they want gear for.

Furthermore without being able to roll need I can't even be nice about gear unless someone alerts me in chat that they need it. When need was still around I could roll greed on something not for my role or for glam without taking away loot from someone who actually needs it for their current role. Now I can't. Now I have to potentially be the ***hole who took someone else's gear because we can only roll greed or pass.

Whomp whomp.

Saw a post on Reddit I thought it would be useful here as well. Coverage of yesterday's Primal stream mentions that Yoshi-P said they are monitoring reactions to Greed Only for another week before making a decision.


http://nekokuma.com/post-85095/

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名無しのスノーマン 2018/06/01(金) 21:25:06 ID：b5dd39228
なんで待つ必要があるんですかねぇ？

フォーラム見てもほぼ反対しかされてないだろ！

Nameless snowman 2018/06/01 (Fri) 21: 25: 06 ID: b5dd39228
Why do I have to wait?

Even if you look at the forum it is almost nothing but opposition!

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名無しのスノーマン 2018/06/02(土) 11:15:40 ID：cb31ff484
1週間経てば意見が変わると思ってんのか？
諦めてロット率上がるの待ってるんだじぇねーよ卑怯者が

Nameless snowman 2018/06/02 (Sat) 11: 15: 40 ID: cb31ff484
Do you think that opinion will change over a week?
I give up and wait for the lot rate to rise. Janey, a coward

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And a bunch of other people talking about how "the voice of the forum is the voice of the minority" despite seeing many, MANY instances in game where people were complaining.

Google Translation is not perfect, but dang... they don't seem happy with the Greed Only raids. If I'm interpreting it right.

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Originally Posted by Seniade

The argument of giving priority back to the players that can equip it is personal spite for the player who won gear when not on a class that could currently equip it.

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It really isn't, though?

You: I don't want that person to win that item. (though that can still happen even under the new system!)
me: I want to win that item (because it is an upgrade for me).

Can you still lose the item on Need rolls? Yes, but at least then we have gotten to where they can't logically limit it more. Your argument is fueled by your feelings for other people while most people who want the Need button back want it for practicality's sake cuz they keep losing gear that's an immediate upgrade for them.

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

The developers should have removed being able to turn in for seals/desynth from the alliance raid gear along with the greed-only change so that players only greed on gear they want to wear or use for glamour.

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I know glamour is the "true endgame" but I fail to see why it should take precedence over desynth. It's hard enough to level it up in some tiers without taking away raid gear. It's already locked for the next couple of weeks, no need to make that restriction harder.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

I know glamour is the "true endgame" but I fail to see why it should take precedence over desynth. It's hard enough to level it up in some tiers without taking away raid gear. It's already locked for the next couple of weeks, no need to make that restriction harder.

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because any desynth skill up that conflicts with glamour should have other options. glamour only has one maybe two options usually.

i don't really mine Greed only on Ridorana (or whatever has the weekly lockout), i think it's really dumb that it's on the ones without lockout and you can free roll everything.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

I'm not saying it is unacceptable for them to roll. I am saying it is unacceptable for loot to be equal priority for everyone including people who aren't playing that role. It rewards laziness and dumb luck. It doesn't reward a player for actually trying to play the role they want gear for.

Furthermore without being able to roll need I can't even be nice about gear unless someone alerts me in chat that they need it. When need was still around I could roll greed on something not for my role or for glam without taking away loot from someone who actually needs it for their current role. Now I can't. Now I have to potentially be the ***hole who took someone else's gear because we can only roll greed or pass.

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In my eyes everyone in group should have equal priority since it is the effort of the group that allows for the gear to be obtained. Sure you could feel that your efforts on the job inherently holds more value simply because the piece of gear that dropped aligns with the role you choose. For me that simply does not make sense, and seems highly unfair since that gear that dropped would not have been up for grabs without the group. Sure in some extreme cases you have players that want to be carried, but it inherently does not promote laziness, just a byproduct of treating the group more fairly on a larger level. Hope that makes sense.