Objection to the new adjustment for PGL, they gonna make this class useless in PT.

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Originally Posted by Wevlum

What is this...I don't even.

All classes currently have debuff skills according to this class redesign so lets knock that one on the head (p.s. they all have debuffs currently too).

There are other DD jobs with tanking skills as well (MRD) that doesnt make them a second rate DD now does it?

My actual point was, compared to what we have currently *anything* would have been an improvement but if you read the rest of my post I actually described what I liked about the new PGL. PGL appears to be a frontline elemental attacker that can change stance depending on the situation, that appears to be its role. Kick+haste+fire = punch the jesus out of the enemy, oh I pulled too much hate, switch to earth or wind stance.

It looks great and I can't wait to try it out. If the MP restore skills and the MP consumed are both reasonable then the MP element will just add more strategy/skill in how we play our class.

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im not a tank but your actually wrong.
THM/BLM does not have any debuffs and yes MRD is a second rate DD lol i can vouch for those two at least

if your not top DD then your second rate... no?

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Originally Posted by Dreadnought

im not a tank but your actually wrong.
THM/BLM does not have any debuffs and yes MRD is a second rate DD lol i can vouch for those two at least

if your not top DD then your second rate... no?

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. . . THM has Sleep, Bind, Heavy, and Stun, as well as a few dots. How are those not debuffs?

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Originally Posted by Viridiana

. . . THM has Sleep, Bind, Heavy, and Stun, as well as a few dots. How are those not debuffs?

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are we talking about right now or after 1.20? sorry if i didnt read far back enough.
once 1.20 hits the only Dot will be a by chance, the only stun will also be a by chance through a combo, and other than that we have sleep.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnought

are we talking about right now or after 1.20? sorry if i didnt read far back enough.
once 1.20 hits the only Dot will be a by chance, the only stun will also be a by chance through a combo, and other than that we have sleep.

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That's 1.20. My bad on not being clearer.

When it come to MMO, and PT recruitment, people only ask for the best in certain role.

MRD and GLA is likely to steal their spot for safety tank or speed run tank as I posted in first post. it is same as what happen currently.

I can't see any best role for PGL yet. if compare as DD, people will fill as many LNC as they could.

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Originally Posted by Alise

When it come to MMO, and PT recruitment, people only ask for the best in certain role.

MRD and GLA is likely to steal their spot for safety tank or speed run tank as I posted in first post. it is same as what happen currently.

I can't see any best role for PGL yet. if compare as DD, people will fill as many LNC as they could.

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In response to this, I shall simply quote what I posted earlier that you didn't seem to read.

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Originally Posted by Alerith

Everyone is talking about them in one mob fight scenarios. This delves into the tanking argument as well. People are trying to say "Is GLA better than MRD for tanking? Will PLD be better than WAR for tanking?"

The argument is irrelevant as they are designed for two different types of tanking. MRD/WAR for multiple mobs, GLA/PLD for single mobs. The argument is similar for PGL.

In a single, one target fight, you may want a LNC over a PGL because chances are the PGL may not have a chance to use it's heavy evasion required abilties.

But if you're fighting multiple targets, the PGL could easliy take the attention of one and tank it while DD'ing the main mob (in an EXP party) or simple fighting it one on one (like trash mobs in a boss fight.).

The PGL/MNK could then use the evasion from the mob that it's tanking in order to use the evasion abilities it has on the main target, even if the main target isn't attacking the PGL/MNK.

This opens up ideal set ups, which I know people don't particularly like, but it does make most classes useful.

I'm Pro-PLD but even I will admit that MRD/WAR will most likely be best for multiple target situations. Just as I'm sure many LNC/DRG would admit that their survivability doesn't really allow them to perform as well in multi-target situations compared to single target engagments, making PGL more ideal.

TL;DR version:

One Target:
GLA/PLD
LNC/DRG

Multiple Targets:
MRD/WAR
PGL/MNK

Use the best job suited to how many mobs you plan on fighting.

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I OBJECT TO CONCEPTS I HAVE NOT SEEN IN PRACTICE.

I realize you're concerned, but there is a LOT of time for tweaking and balancing. The class now has an identity. Try it out, it may be fun.

As far as parties go, not everyone is an elitist. And just because a player is playing Class X doesn't mean they know the class well enough to outdo a person of Class Y who DOES know what they are doing.

I know this is dumb to say on these boards, but lets give things a chance before we get all huffy. Seriously.

didn't read the whole thread, and I have PGL lv20. I'm pretty sure PGL will excel in solo play while MNK will excel in party.

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Originally Posted by Alerith

In response to this, I shall simply quote what I posted earlier that you didn't seem to read.

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How much do you actually play this game? Since last year Oct 2010, PGL never once be needed. No matter in small content or big content.

"Hey, BUffalo hunting PT, one spot for GLA please" (back in December)
"Dodore small hunting group, we need THM" (could even solo, back in March)
"Into the Dark, we still need 3-4 more ARC please" (back in June)
"Ifrit PT, any LNC wanna join? 4-5 spots" (now)
"Stronghold key farming PT, please MRD and CNJ only" (now)

Yes, every classes except PGL..

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Originally Posted by Alise

How much do you actually play this game? Since last year Oct 2010, PGL never once be needed. No matter in small content or big content.

"Hey, BUffalo hunting PT, one spot for GLA please" (back in December)
"Dodore small hunting group, we need THM" (could even solo, back in March)
"Into the Dark, we still need 3-4 more ARC please" (back in June)
"Ifrit PT, any LNC wanna join? 4-5 spots" (now)
"Stronghold key farming PT, please MRD and CNJ only" (now)

Yes, every classes except PGL..

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You didn't need GLA for Buffalo (tanked him on my PGL)
You didn't need THM for Dodore (tanked him on my PGL)
You didn't need even 3 ARCs for Batraal (none of my groups went above 3, and that's when I changed over to ARC)
You don't need more than 3 LNCs for Ifrit (none of my groups have gone above 3, and I'm running PGL again)
You don't need a full party of MRD and CNJ to farm keys, either (every group I've seen has had other classes)

No single class was ever "needed" until CNJ became the only real healer.