#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

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Originally Posted by Rehayem

So you believe we should just sit back and accept things as they are? I mean, are you even reading what you're typing out? Back in ARR it may have been a challenge, but healers were absolutely in need at all times, not to mention the different kits they had back then compared to now. Did you even bother reading this thread regarding healer issues?

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It was merely more a challenge, in fact. WAR already had enough self healing to heal between pulls, and three dps could burst through each pack. Now, more tanks can do it, but nothing changed, really. If you want to complain, complain about the gameplay, not the fact people are running healer-less dungeons. That's all Zell's saying.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

And you know that in ARR no healer runs of dungeons required crowd control on the part of the DPS, the WAR to sit basically perpetually in tank stance and do next to no DPS while functionally single mob pulling while the BLM refreshed sleep constantly. n,

The problem is the immense creep. No healer runs have gone from literal meme challenges that took kit understanding from all 4 players and took 3 times as long as a healer run to “if your WAR knows where BW is your run will probably go faster without a healer”

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lol, if I dare say so myself.

You complain about ultimates being made with no healers ? Sad news : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gi05HqdMSs

Back in ShB, you were already able to do 8-tank UCOB. Yes, tanks are the only irreplaceable part of a team (I'm not even sure of that, pretty sure you could run 4 DPS dungeons, there already have been 24-BLM alliance raids, should we nerf BLM ?), but that doesn't mean the trinity is dead. Most people can't do that. That's all there is to it.

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Originally Posted by Banriikku

First, yes this is needed. Yoshida can't be seriously thinking we wait again 3 years for a "maybe".

Second the whole argument around Ultimate is not the skill involved but the dismissive attitude from the "FACE of the FRANCHISE" towards a whole group of players of a job from the "HOLY TRRINITY" the game is PROMOTING.

They are tonedeaf and in need of a weak up call or they need to patch out the trinity. Decide but please stop with the "everybody needs to play everything".
NO, not all jobs or content is for everybody.
I cant or want to play NIN, does this mean the job needs patching? No, not from this perspective.
So stop patching healers towards and for people that don't even want to heal in the first place or would you make NIN for me ? No you would not, because it's stupid.

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I also try to tell everyone to stop eating pineapple pizza, even if I would never order it myself. Just stop with it. Know your damn place already. Please. :rolleyes:

Considering that Healerless TOP was also cleared on the same patch it was implemented, that becomes an even more egregious example, lol.

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Originally Posted by ArcaviusGreyashe

You complain about ultimates being made with no healers ? Sad news : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gi05HqdMSs

Back in ShB, you were already able to do 8-tank UCOB. Yes, tanks are the only irreplaceable part of a team (I'm not even sure of that, pretty sure you could run 4 DPS dungeons, there already have been 24-BLM alliance raids, should we nerf BLM ?), but that doesn't mean the trinity is dead. Most people can't do that. That's all there is to it.

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You know that for that clear to happen the fight had to go through a whole expansion worth of powercreep right? Powercreep so hard that right now that fight has been cleared with only 6 people.

Meanwhile we had a no healer clear of TOP on the same patch it was released without need of any kind of powercreep. We also had solo healer clear of DSR on the same pacth it was released.

That's the big difference, for those no dps, solo tanks, etc, to happen the fight had to go through powercreep to the point its current difficulty is not representative of what its original intended design was, meanwhile with healers we are seeing those kind of clears without any kind of powercreep involved, those fights are at their historical peak of difficulty and still don't demand the tools that only 2 healers can bring.

Question: Cheese or pineapple first ? Ham or peperoni?
Personally i think pineapple then dough and then cheese.

I don't like BLU or MNK, can we please remove them or make them like SMN already?
Also male roegadyn are a sin and can be removed, female are fine.... fine indeed.
After that we should includes in all rotastions QTE because i think they are neat.

Back to topic:
Are healers more stress then DPS, depending but normally yes. Can you prevent that ? No, not with "holy trinity". That is not an opinion that is a fact resulting from the design.
And it is well known. Do we need the same amount of healers as we need dps? NO, basic math. Also it will be in most cases DPS -> Tank -> Healer for amount of players. Give incentives to fill the role. Done.

Making everybody a healer is not an answer, it is more like you dont understood the assignment or making healing so potent you need a heal every 180 seconds or disconecting the job altogether from encounter or take way any form of rotation and make it 1-butto. All these are design sins you should not commit and SE did almost all of them but has the audacity to we focus on the encounter. What did you do in SHB or EW? What is it that you learned from both xpacs? Do you review aka play the game AT ALL (or any other games for that matter)?

On as sidenote, i think HW healers weren't that good but compared to what we have now: GIMME, i take that without batting an eye.

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Originally Posted by WaxSw

You know that for that clear to happen the fight had to go through a whole expansion worth of powercreep right? Powercreep so hard that right now that fight has been cleared with only 6 people.

Meanwhile we had a no healer clear of TOP on the same patch it was released without need of any kind of powercreep. We also had solo healer clear of DSR on the same pacth it was released.

That's the big difference, for those no dps, solo tanks, etc, to happen the fight had to go through powercreep to the point its current difficulty is not representative of what its original intended design was, meanwhile with healers we are seeing those kind of clears without any kind of powercreep involved, those fights are at their historical peak of difficulty and still don't demand the tools that only 2 healers can bring.

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Let's see that clear then.

https://imgur.com/EhY2npN.png

Three tanks, including two that act as sub-healers, and can't DPS as much (both are lower than 10% paladins), all DPS classes chosen because they have some heal/shield that's better than others, total healing being less than 10% of the clears, meaning they took less damage than pretty much every other clear, in a fight that's mechanically the most demanding, but is less hard for healers. And do you know why I can make that assumption ? The same static that cleared TOP without healers didn't clear DSR without healers. And they still needed to play perfectly, have perfect mitigation down to the second, and so on.

You make it seem like every ultimate can and will be done healerless. That's not true. This is not a powercreep situation, it is a fight design situation. And I'm not sure you can argue "I want more complex dps rotation and not being a healbot" at the same time as "I want to have more to heal".

Lol if anything, part of the reason why DSR is also taxing to do without healer because they come with the infamous "invisible healer stacks". IIRC they were saying it took them 17(?) pulls to have RNG favoring them in their solo healer attempt.

That is of course, another can of worm to unpack.

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Originally Posted by ArcaviusGreyashe

Let's see that clear then.

https://imgur.com/EhY2npN

Three tanks, including two that act as sub-healers, and can't DPS as much (both are lower than 10% paladins), total healing being less than 10% of the clears, meaning they took less damage than pretty much every other clear, in a fight that's mechanically the most demanding, but is less hard for healers. And do you know why I can't make that assumption ? The same static that cleared TOP without healers didn't clear DSR without healers. And they still needed to play perfectly, have perfect mitigation down to the second, and so on.

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And don't you see a problem when tanks and dps can cover the healing needs of a healer? Don't you see a problem in the fact that the hps need is that low in the hardest content of the game?

We don't see a no tank clear there, you know why? Because the incoming damage to tanks is so high that only they can survive with their unique tools. We don't see a no dps clear there, you know why? Because the dps checks are designed so you need the extra damage coming for those roles to clear.

Why only healers can be replaced?

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You make it seem like every ultimate can and will be done healerless. That's not true.

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Are you sure about that?

At least solo healers happen to literally every piece of content, ironically enough, is mechanics targeting healers that put the biggest wall because they become rng otherwise they would be even more spread.

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And I'm not sure you can argue "I want more complex dps rotation and not being a healbot" at the same time as "I want to have more to heal".

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Points to Sb where we werent healbots, had better rotations and more to heal

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Originally Posted by ArcaviusGreyashe

And I'm not sure you can argue "I want more complex dps rotation and not being a healbot" at the same time as "I want to have more to heal".

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Explain to me why those two things are mutually exclusive.
Because that used to be the case. Game worked fine. There was clunk yes, but it didn't come from the friction between the two, especially after the removal of the awkwardness of clicking Cleric Stance off.
Intelligence/Mind split was also fixed rendering Cleric stance moot.

Why did we need our dps kits pruned? There are no good arguments for it. We were promised a "rebuild" of our kits from the ground up. We have yet to see our filler time kit improved beyond our basic nuke and dot.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Then the the strike would pointless as they would be replacing all the healers that drop the role. So SE would not have to bother fixing healers cause all those complaining would no longer matter cause their dps now.

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It's not pointless if it ends up with strikers having fun as dps and tanks and those who have enjoyed all the engaging rotations for years doing the one-button chores for all of Dawntrail. That's still a win. Although I fully expect them to join the strike after some first hand healing experiences, which will further escalate the amount of feedback.