The idea that we need to DPS must go.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Please refer to my original post where I said, very clearly, that I believe doing dps as a healer is good and right (you'll find I've maintained that sentiment is all my posts on the subject) but that no one should feel punished for deciding, for whatever given reason, to narrow their focus to just healing.

There are plenty of reasons for not doing dps: RP, bad nerves, unreliable party members trying to kill themselves constantly. In the end, the reason doesn't matter except to say that is their reason and they can play how they like. It's rarely the healer's fault if the dungeon fails due to not having enough dps. Can they help if they want? Sure! But it's also pretty w/e to most players.

Personally, I do dps as a healer (wut?! Shocking, right?) But I would never be so conceited as the badger other healers to do the same. Reeks of toxicity.

That's the honest truth that many of those on the forums fail to realize as they make note of how the forum veterans are always speaking the truth about dps vs no dps healers.

I can't help but laugh at these replies that constantly misinterpret what I say, taking a small part of what I write and running with it like a kid with scissors along the edge of a swimming pool. "Drkdays say healer dps bad!" *Raises pitchfork and torch."

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Your first two reasons (RP, bad nerves) can be handled via trusts. In the third case, it's up to you and your judgement - if you're in a new raid, or if those players are sprouts or have never done that raid, clearly that could impact on the amount of DPS that you output. If, however, they appear to be trolling, then there are other ways of reacting, including (but not necessarily) kicking them.

Therefore I don't see why, in most cases, that this should be used in order to not to expect healers to be able to DPS, especially by the time they hit endgame.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Please refer to my original post where I said, very clearly, that I believe doing dps as a healer is good and right (you'll find I've maintained that sentiment is all my posts on the subject) but that no one should feel punished for deciding, for whatever given reason, to narrow their focus to just healing.

There are plenty of reasons for not doing dps: RP, bad nerves, unreliable party members trying to kill themselves constantly. In the end, the reason doesn't matter except to say that is their reason and they can play how they like. It's rarely the healer's fault if the dungeon fails due to not having enough dps. Can they help if they want? Sure! But it's also pretty w/e to most players.

Personally, I do dps as a healer (wut?! Shocking, right?) But I would never be so conceited as the badger other healers to do the same. Reeks of toxicity.

That's the honest truth that many of those on the forums fail to realize as they make note of how the forum veterans are always speaking the truth about dps vs no dps healers.

I can't help but laugh at these replies that constantly misinterpret what I say, taking a small part of what I write and running with it like a kid with scissors along the edge of a swimming pool. "Drkdays say healer dps bad!" *Raises pitchfork and torch."

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You laugh at other people's replies while citing RP as a reason not to do DPS as a healer? Seriously?

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Please refer to my original post where I said, very clearly, that I believe doing dps as a healer is good and right (you'll find I've maintained that sentiment is all my posts on the subject) but that no one should feel punished for deciding, for whatever given reason, to narrow their focus to just healing.

There are plenty of reasons for not doing dps: RP, bad nerves, unreliable party members trying to kill themselves constantly. In the end, the reason doesn't matter except to say that is their reason and they can play how they like. It's rarely the healer's fault if the dungeon fails due to not having enough dps. Can they help if they want? Sure! But it's also pretty w/e to most players.

Personally, I do dps as a healer (wut?! Shocking, right?) But I would never be so conceited as the badger other healers to do the same. Reeks of toxicity.

That's the honest truth that many of those on the forums fail to realize as they make note of how the forum veterans are always speaking the truth about dps vs no dps healers.

I can't help but laugh at these replies that constantly misinterpret what I say, taking a small part of what I write and running with it like a kid with scissors along the edge of a swimming pool. "Drkdays say healer dps bad!" *Raises pitchfork and torch."

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yep you are right they are plenty of reasons to not do dps: laziness, "me heal only cause me healer", watching netflix cause its the afk role after all, party bad and getting hit left and right so i heal them(the only real good reason to not dps) wait... that last reason probably wasn't on your mind.

if a party fails to hit enrage where everyone except the healer done their job right and not get hit, you can believe the honest truth its the healer fault. what reeks of toxicity is if you comment a healer about not dps when everyone is fine, the tank says he is ok and the healer responded "not my job, not care i need to only heal" that is not the commenting player who is being toxic its the healer who want to be carried.
there is a reason why afk players get kicked from parties and automatically from dungeons.

bad nerves fine and parties accept and adjust to that like for first timers and beginners(including first time in a dungeon and not knowing mechanics), if you have to go afk you say in chat and party actually waits but people wont stand for is actual leachers and players refusing to help out especially if they got a job up to 90 ,freaking 90 levels, and simply not do their jobs or bother to read simple tooltips.

there is no excuse for that and no reason to even allow such behavior, sorry but you want to say that the party time mean less then a healer "pure healing" cause reasons, or a co-healer need to put much more of the work cause an afk healer want to be carried?

You do whatever you feel comfortable with and just report anyone who harasses you.
A tiny minuscule number of us tryhards are even aware of the amount of damage that other players do.
Just play the objective and get the clear however you see fit.
Forums thugs don’t pay your sub

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Originally Posted by DanielNegreanu_Adamantoise

You do whatever you feel comfortable with and just report anyone who harasses you.
A tiny minuscule number of us tryhards are even aware of the amount of damage that other players do.
Just play the objective and get the clear however you see fit.
Forums thugs don’t pay your sub

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Players are more then welcome to "play the objective and clear however [they] see fit" but parties are also more then welcome to vote-kick people for not playing as the group sees fit (in a civil manner, naturally).
Other's may not pay your sub but they also aren't required to drag you along either.

I dps and heal in balanced ways. What urks me is how 90% of players stomps and call people heal bots, yet the dps green bots are hardly or never called out. Dead people regardless of role do no damage and is thus not contributing at that point. Sure I am not saying healers must not dps again I do a balance of both Personally.

Now this is why I love rdm for if I see am at 10% hp via unavoidable big damage and green bot is still pressing 1 1 1 1 1 amma then result to drop dps and press vercure or use my gnb/pld cure regen spells. Thus overall I only play tank and dps with friends and never solo as the rare times I try tank or rdm in solo was disaster.

There is a small 10% of dps and tanks out there that actually appreciate a heal bot over a green dps one am sure. Though I do both in balanced ways I get thanks many times by a dps or a tank for keeping up their health while dpsing especially if they are new and do not know mechs.

Side note I much rather be ressing a dps eating oranges far more than my co healer who is busy on dps that they die, you res them and instead they heal themselves they topple over again. At that point I be like ok if rdm or smn in pt please res em at that point the healer who does heal and dps is doing more dps and dps. than the 100% dps green bot see the irony?

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Players are more then welcome to "play the objective and clear however [they] see fit" but parties are also more then welcome to vote-kick people for not playing as the group sees fit (in a civil manner, naturally).
Other's may not pay your sub but they also aren't required to drag you along either.

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Don't lose your time feeding trolls.

This guy labelled himself as a tryharder... a said tryharder who hasn't not downed any raid, even normal, at all (or hiding everything, which is even worse).

Trolls don't pay our sub either.

I will never understand why some players refuse to try their best in a team oriented game. If you don’t have the mindset of being a team player then why play a multiplayer game at all then? I can’t believe RP was given as an excuse to not dps.

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Originally Posted by Karni

I will never understand why some players refuse to try their best in a team oriented game.

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"I play this game for fun. I decide what is my fun"

People do not care if the game is marked as a team game. Those players see team as 'group of people that arent bots'. In some games its even worse (in team fortress some people just conga all round being essentialy an afk that boosts the enemy by giving them capabilities of triggering onhit/onkill bonusses). While in some games it just happens automaticly (l4d is a good one on that because not being a team member just causes you to spectate as you died, and often gets you kicked out).

Story based MMO's are on that just a toxic environment as some do not care about any other player. They only want to solo play anyway, so will do minimal effort whenever forced to play with others. Luckily the MSQ allows this, making the issue less extreme.

To the Original Poster.

Sure, as soon as they remove shielding, healing & mitigation from every other class in game and then rework our abilities to compensate for it.
But since that is not going to happen I would suggest learning that 1-1/2 button dps rotation we get.
Outside of wall to wall pulls, scripted damage and Prog groups. Healing from an actual healer is not needed for all content.

Perfect example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YutfHMT427k

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Players are more then welcome to "play the objective and clear however [they] see fit" but parties are also more then welcome to vote-kick people for not playing as the group sees fit (in a civil manner, naturally).
Other's may not pay your sub but they also aren't required to drag you along either.

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"Well, I said 'with all due respect."
"That doesn't mean you can say whatever you want, Bobby!"
"It sure as heck does! It's in the Geneva convention!"

If I were some evil voodoo witch, I'd place a curse on all "thou shall not DPS" healers to ALWAYS and ONLY get the most optimized WAR and PLD players who do everything in their power to heal and mitigate before the healer can.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

"Well, I said 'with all due respect."
"That doesn't mean you can say whatever you want, Bobby!"
"It sure as heck does! It's in the Geneva convention!"

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I don’t get it. :B

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

I don’t get it. :B

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Which is the point.

Which makes it even funnier.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Which is the point.

Which makes it even funnier.

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The point was I didn't get it or that you like quoting old cartoons?

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

The point was I didn't get it or that you like quoting old cartoons?

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Is Rick and Morty considered an old cartoon now? How old are you?

Or do you mean the Talladega Nights quote? That's not a cartoon.

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Originally Posted by IceBlueNinja

Now this is why I love rdm for if I see am at 10% hp via unavoidable big damage and green bot is still pressing 1 1 1 1 1 amma then result to drop dps and press vercure or use my gnb/pld cure regen spells. Thus overall I only play tank and dps with friends and never solo as the rare times I try tank or rdm in solo was disaster.

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The issue I take with Vercure RDMs and Clemency PLDs is that they waste their GCDs on this when I, as the healer, either have an ability literally about to come off CD to use to get their health back up OR I have HoTs running that will tick them back up in less than half a minute.

Assize isn’t used for healing, but AOE raidwides are so few and far between, I can easily leave people sitting at half health for 10 seconds until it’s off CD, and bam—Assize actually healed AND did damage versus just overhealing and dealing damage. Or I have HoTs going, and then I see the RDMs Vercuring themselves instead of allowing my HoTs to do what they’re supposed to do: heal over time.

It’s okay to sit at low health for a little bit in a fight because these fights are so scripted in nature, and most pieces of content do not do rapid succession raidwides that would require immediate healing after the damage goes out. People that sit there and heal themselves instead of allowing my toolkit to do its job I just leave to their own devices at this point.

It's because there's basically 3 types of healers:

A- the healbot, absolutely refuses to dps and overheals a lot

B- the fast queue jumper, occasionally forgets they're the healer

C- the actual decent healer that knows what they're doing

Only other healer players can discern who's who, so more often than not, it's not that they want to relieve stress on the healer, they just don't trust them lol. Sure, the other roles also have similar types of players, but their roles involve depleting an HP bar while ours is to refill it.

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Originally Posted by Allegor

It's because there's basically 3 types of healers:

A- the healbot, absolutely refuses to dps and overheals a lot

B- the fast queue jumper, occasionally forgets they're the healer

C- the actual decent healer that knows what they're doing

Only other healer players can discern who's who, so more often than not, it's not that they want to relieve stress on the healer, they just don't trust them lol. Sure, the other roles also have similar types of players, but their roles involve depleting an HP bar while ours is to refill it.

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You forgot D or some part of it = the 100% dps green bot that lets everyone or themselves tip over at 10% hp when waves of unavoidable damage is coming or know what what res is. Not at issue for me though since I time my ogcds well while dpsing.

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Originally Posted by IceBlueNinja

You forgot D or some part of it = the 100% dps green bot that lets everyone or themselves tip over at 10% hp when waves of unavoidable damage is coming or know what what res is. Not at issue for me though since I time my ogcds well while dpsing.

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pst! Your bias is showing. You may want to go take care of that.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

The issue I take with Vercure RDMs and Clemency PLDs is that they waste their GCDs on this when I, as the healer, either have an ability literally about to come off CD to use to get their health back up OR I have HoTs running that will tick them back up in less than half a minute.

Assize isn’t used for healing, but AOE raidwides are so few and far between, I can easily leave people sitting at half health for 10 seconds until it’s off CD, and bam—Assize actually healed AND did damage versus just overhealing and dealing damage. Or I have HoTs going, and then I see the RDMs Vercuring themselves instead of allowing my HoTs to do what they’re supposed to do: heal over time.

It’s okay to sit at low health for a little bit in a fight because these fights are so scripted in nature, and most pieces of content do not do rapid succession raidwides that would require immediate healing after the damage goes out. People that sit there and heal themselves instead of allowing my toolkit to do its job I just leave to their own devices at this point.

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Understood I think what it is too people dont trust hots. Ffxiv hots are so totally slow and you think the self proclaim spell speed let it ticks faster but it dont and that 15 seconds low number tic just dont let you feel it. one physis with a kera is all a sage need to top off people 80% of fights.

Healing In FFXIV Is Not Fun:
Misshapen Chair

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbWubxOTUWU&t=567s

Warning, Strong language.

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbWubxOTUWU&t=567s

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Entertaining with some good points. It's safe to click, people. Unless you're allergic to the F* word.