Unpopular opinion

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

I agree that WAR should have higher dmg than PLD and it currently does have higher DPS than PLD. The threads I've seen which show parses and actual data all show that WAR has 100-200 higher DPS than PLD and DRK. I don't anyone has argued that they should be the same.

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Oh come now. I don't think you actually believe that's enough. Not only does WAR have a much harder time achieving optimal DPS that difference is still pathetic when it does.

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Originally Posted by TheCount

Oh come now. I don't think you actually believe that's enough. Not only does WAR have a much harder time achieving optimal DPS that difference is still pathetic when it does.

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How much do you think would be reasonable, keep in mind that the utility which your balancing this against becomes less useful the more parties learn mechanics and gear up, while DPS becomes more useful.

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

I agree that WAR should have higher dmg than PLD and it currently does have higher DPS than PLD. The threads I've seen which show parses and actual data all show that WAR has 100-200 higher DPS than PLD and DRK. I don't anyone has argued that they should be the same.

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Oh come on. Once you throw a slashing, nin or Sam, it evens out. So no there is no real divergence in DPS.

In V1S, Warriors have a decent chance at keeping up with Paladins in damage. In V2S it becomes a bit trickier. In V3S though it's impossible to match Paladins or Dark Knights, unless they are extremely bad. You're forced to save your Inner Release combo until after Spellblade Holy, because if you happen to get marked, it's over.

And then regardless of whether you decide to hold your Inner Release or not, it'll either be up right before Mindjack, or just before the giant dragon spawns. Neither of these two situations allows the execution of the mess that is the Warrior's optimal damage rotation.

So you're forced to hold onto your combo until after you've picked up the dragon, or the dragon is dead, leading to a massive DPS loss.

And then throughout several parts of the fight, you rarely get 20 seconds where you're able to do your full combo. And when you do, chances are it's probably still on cooldown.

So yeah, take that into account next time you say Warriors do more damage than the other tanks.

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Originally Posted by BluexBird

In V1S, Warriors have a decent chance at keeping up with Paladins in damage. In V2S it becomes a bit trickier. In V3S though it's impossible to match Paladins or Dark Knights, unless they are extremely bad.

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So yeah, take that into account next time you say Warriors do more damage than the other tanks.

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http://i.imgur.com/U7kOUZYl.png

If you're having difficulty keeping up, the PLD or DRK in question is probably an entire quartile range higher in performance, either through gear and/or skill.

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

I agree that WAR should have higher dmg than PLD and it currently does have higher DPS than PLD. The threads I've seen which show parses and actual data all show that WAR has 100-200 higher DPS than PLD and DRK. I don't anyone has argued that they should be the same.

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If you've played a warrior at 70, you know where most of their DPS is coming from, and should also know that their parses are largely based on dummies. Warrior has higher DPS in a vacuum under ideal conditions, a large part of this is his built-in slashing debuff, which both DRK and PLD can take full advantage of because there's usually either a SAM or a NIN in the party if not both. Improving WAR DPS isn't just a matter of buffing potencies, it requires a whole rework of inner release; which in my opinion is a very poorly designed ability after the initial hype the prospect of six fell cleaves brings.

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

How much do you think would be reasonable, keep in mind that the utility which your balancing this against becomes less useful the more parties learn mechanics and gear up, while DPS becomes more useful.

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That's the million dollar question. I hear buff this and buff that, but by how much really?

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Originally Posted by Capn_Goggles

it requires a whole rework of inner release; which in my opinion is a very poorly designed ability after the initial hype the prospect of six fell cleaves brings.

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Instead of halving the cost of all beast skill, it could drastically increase their potency...or make them all criticals.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Instead of halving the cost of all beast skill, it could drastically increase their potency...or make them all criticals.

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That's more of a band-aid solution to a tourniquet problem. WAR is defined by his IR burst rotation, and is put in a bizarre situation where he doesn't want to use his abilities as often as he'd want because it's mandatory that they line up with his burst rotation in order to actually out-DPS other tanks. It's a poorly designed ability in my opinion because it centers the entire job around one ability on a 2 minute cooldown timer. Coincidentally, DRK is also defined by his capstone ability, and I think suffers greatly for it because of the way it is designed.

Paladin wins out again in this regard because his 70 ability is really awesome and flavorful, but it doesn't completely flip the job on it's butt and change the way it plays completely.

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Originally Posted by Capn_Goggles

WAR is defined by his IR burst rotation, and is put in a bizarre situation where he doesn't want to use his abilities as often as he'd want because it's mandatory that they line up with his burst rotation in order to actually out-DPS other tanks.

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But I feel like it was the same during HW, only with a Berzerk window. To the point when, unless it's an absolute necessity, you'd also save some of your defensive CD to line up to berzerk and allow a triple Fell Cleave. And I'm not sure that without the triple Fell Cleave, WAR was able to do much more than DRK or even PLD. The problem of the actual window it's that it's so long that you'll have a hard time pulling it completely, because you might need to move out of an AoE, or the boss will become untargetable for a little time, etc...