"Fun comes first"

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Originally Posted by Imoen

With the content itself or just hanging out and socializing? There is a difference. (Not picking you apart, I am just curious.)

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Both honestly, still got classes to level, new relic stuff, gearing my Dragoon. Socializing side I level my classes with my buds now and again, I also sit around and chat now and again, not gonna lie on that lol.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Doesn't change the fact that tons are doing relic. Check your party finder as well. Get over it already. People fussed like crazy with ATMA and guess what just about everyone has a Zeta.

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Because there is nothing else to do? Because it gives the BiS weapon for several classes? There's a few more reasons, and I can say in game that every one of my LS's and my FC, and the shout chat in multiple zones are filled with nothing but complaints. It's poorly done content, stop white knighting a company that doesn't care about you.

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Originally Posted by Croweyes

Both honestly, still got classes to level, new relic stuff, gearing my Dragoon. Socializing side I level my classes with my buds now and again, I also sit around and chat now and again, not gonna lie on that lol.

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Ah ok, as I said I was just curious because even the most boring tasks in the world can be entertaining with friends.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

I play solo a lot and I personally am starting to find it hard to log in. Maybe I'm just burnt out. I have taken 2 longer breaks from HW since it came out.

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Originally Posted by Renault

Because there is nothing else to do? Because it gives the BiS weapon for several classes? There's a few more reasons, and I can say in game that every one of my LS's and my FC, and the shout chat in multiple zones are filled with nothing but complaints. It's poorly done content, stop white knighting a company that doesn't care about you.

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K, when you use terms like "White Knight" it just means you have very weak legs to stand on for an argument. Now lets get to the brass tacks of it. Before today people were running daily dungeons, Alex for alts, Beast Tribes, Primals, and VA/A:S/Dia. Today people are running FATEs, dungeons, Alex, and Beast Tribes. The only real difference is SE added a long term grind to the content we're already running. So the real question isn't whether relic grind is fun, it's are you having fun actually playing the core game?

Now I"ll be the first to say Anima Weapon is a missed opportunity in both horizontal progress design and limited amount of game content to use. CT, Coil, Treasure Maps, and Hunts are some of the chances they had to get players involved in more aspects of the game. They also should released it with a big patch and add new systems for relics like Diadem.

what about? it's not fun, don't do it!

the whole game is not fun? don't pay them, look somewhere else.

Fun should come first with any game. But it's not as simple as just putting in fun things for players to do, especially in an MMO. All games need some challenge to overcome so you get a sense of reward as well. The challenge can come from many things like completing a difficult dungeon, solving a puzzle, or just grinding endlessly. But the end prize should always feel worth the effort. If you put content in that has a skewed reward to challenge ratio then players are gonna complain no matter what. Too easy for reward, players complain. Too hard to get reward, players complain. You need balance and that is something these new Relic Weapons lack. Since FFXIV pretty much only has vertical progression this weapon will always be getting outclassed and everybody knows that. The way progression works really kills the chance of the relic holding the title of best weapon for very long, and it only takes away from the sense of reward.

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Originally Posted by Renault

https://i.imgur.com/pDrXDGe.jpg

What happened to this philosophy, SE? You've created content that:

1) Should have been released the same time as Alexander normal
2) Has us grinding the same crap we've been grinding for the past 6 months
3) Re-uses the same ideas which had a massive negative influence on the game as a whole (FATE grinding, atmas)
4) Yoshi-P himself even said he would not want to do this content. If that's the case, WHY MAKE IT?

I believe SE should worry more about making a game that's FUN, not just a game that has boring, thoughtless grinds to keep us subscribed.

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Where does that fear come that players would leave when they can not grind?
I wonder how the game would look like when SE just stops worrying about artificial delaying progress?
I believe it could be a great game that makes fun, but SE have to get rid of their money milking the playerbase!

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

It was like this with atmas, and nexus, and zodiak too, and the game didnt decline or lose subs, even though the forums were just as ragey as now.

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I think the issue was that there was always a bit more substantial content released at the same time. A new raid tier, a new crystal tower, dungeons, a primal, etc. You'd get people who do a variety of content all talking about the content that interests them most. You had threads in one hour ranging from weapon drops on primals, to thoughts about 24 man content, to complaints about the current relic phase.

At the moment, it's just an echo chamber of people complaining about relics. From a feedback perspective, it would have been MUCH wiser for them to have released this content at the same time as Diadem and Void Ark.

SE has literally insulted their players with this questline. Not only is the grind ridiculous the worst part of the quest is called "Soul with no Life."

At least the testimonial grind in FFXI that insulted you for earning it still gave you the best fishing rod in the game for many years:
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/...20080206162532

All we get for the current grind is a weapon that is the same exact item level as 2 other weapons that would end up taking you FAR LESS TIME TO EARN.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

The low standars some gamers have today is really something that is painfull to watch, read and see its effects kick in... This absurdly white knighting is what keeps developers from worrying and caring about what they do... Which translates in low quality inexcusable content like what we have seen today.

Reminder to all: This content was delayed cause it wasn`t ready 6 months ago at HW launch. Aparently, the copypasting process had a small trouble, someone was confusing control+c with control+v so they were not copying anything for 6 months, yesterday they found out, just in time for the patch.

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The truth has been spoken