Astro in savage

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Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Eh. I ran a1 savage for two nights with my static, and I agree that SCH\AST combo is horrible in this fight. Our ast is leveling WHM, will see if that makes the split phase more manageable - currently, keeping everyone alive is a serious problem. As a SCH I don't feel safe dpsing for any relevant amount of time, and the enrage at 8 mins currently REQUIRES healer dps.

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Yeah I imagine running two Hybrid Healing class together is never a good idea.
AST = Heal/Party Support
SCH = Heal/DPS

I would try WHM + AST and swap out a bard/mcn before I'd try SCH +AST

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Originally Posted by Kiriacou

Your DPS is under geared if you require healer DPS to make the DPS check.
Yoshi has stated that healer DPS is not taken into account when tunning the fights.

As for sch being heal/DPS that goes to show me you have no understanding of what a sch does or is.
Sch is ultimately in the end heal/damage reduction, if you can't see that go back to whm or dps

It is threads like these where I wish she made cleric's stance like last stances can't use in battle.

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What the hell are you talking about.

We are discussing progression content, of course we are "undergeared" - that is the whole point of progression.

Also no, it appears it is you who has no understanding of how to optimize SCH if you ignore the dps it can dish out.

Also no, Yoshida never said that in regards to Savage progression.

Also your last sentence makes no logical sense whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Kiriacou

Your DPS is under geared if you require healer DPS to make the DPS check.
Yoshi has stated that healer DPS is not taken into account when tunning the fights.

As for sch being heal/DPS that goes to show me you have no understanding of what a sch does or is.
Sch is ultimately in the end heal/damage reduction, if you can't see that go back to whm or dps

It is threads like these where I wish she made cleric's stance like last stances can't use in battle.

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This has nothing to do with design philosophy, more of the information that SE will look at to finish balances. Fact one- SCH/WHM can clear savage, yes they are dpsing in phases that need it, yes they are mainly healing in phases that need it. Fact two- AST is still way under picked and many people find AST/WHM to be possible, but many still find WHM/SCH to be overwhelmingly easier to handle the fights. At this point we need to look at why and SCH ability to deal constant dps over an encounter with a WHM partner is an advantage period. AST has cards that are there to make up for lack of healing (and in turn now dps with a SCH or AST itself) which it is not. Regardless of if Yoshi is taking the dps number into account when "making" the raids (aka he is fine with healers dpsing he simply stated that he will not take healer dps into account when his team makes raids) he certainly cares that a job is not taken because of lack of dps.The only stance that is not changed in battle is AST sects. Sorry that people want to play and push the game to beat savage now and not in three weeks.

Sorry about seeming tough on it, but not having healers dps regardless of stance is a fantasy in high skill progression groups. As well as this for the most part (some people like to diverge a bit) is about looking at how ASTs are progressing and what problems they are hitting.

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Originally Posted by Parawill

Hi Staris! Thank you for dropping in and providing some insight. Would you mind answering some questions?

1. Does your Scholar change his playstyle from instead just DPS'ing and single-target healing and shielding, apply Succor and AoE heal when required? In addition, does s/he use Eos/Selene and rotate cooldowns to help you AoE heal?

2. For double preys & tank busters, do your tanks use two CDs as opposed to one? In addition, does your SCH apply Adlo on at least 2 or 3 targets?

3. If possible, could you provide raid DPS information as well? I don't care so much about individual numbers, but overall group DPS & tank/healer DPS would be nice.

Thank ^_^ I'm super excited to go in again for another attempt! And kudos and all the praise for clearing (or getting close to) A:S1!

P.S: (I do see lost of room for recovery. I know one main issue even on WHM is my entire raid isn't getting hit by AoE heals x.x)

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First off (From Yesterday)
\\http://i.imgur.com/9cB2Qkj.png

I used Diurnal Stance. Eos was out for the SCH.

1. I did significant amount of the aoe healing using only aspect-ed Helios. Remember people don't have to be topped off immediately the aoe damage is predictable, and you know who the prety targets are long enough ahead to top them off. Also i used synastry on a tank every double prey/ tank buster. (it lines up so perfectly that I would cast it early on the first 1 or 2) Should note that the range of synsatry effects the bonus heal and you have to be within 30 meters of the buffed target, but they dont have to be 30 meters from the heal target.

2. The paladin did Sentinel 1 and 3, HG 2, and was going to rampart 4 (which is risky he dies sometimes there but its secoonds before the enrage and he can survive it if topped off and disable/virus ect).
The Warrior does Holmgang for 1 and 3 and every other buff 2 and 4.
It is important to know you could and should virus and disable the tank buster on the tank who does not currently using HG or Holmgang.
Which means you could virus the prey cast on the HG/Holmgang target if you have a second super virus.

3. The SCH did About 400? DPS. I did about 20 (only dotted on pull) (Plus lots of dps cards on the summoner).


We had a 4 % wipe a 2 % wipe and a 1 % wipe. and than killed it like 10 seconds before enrage.
Very frustrating that we would have had it the first day minus a single dps death to big laser.

We did 3 lockouts on day one, and it only took 1/2 a lockout on the second day and nearly every attempt was to the end. So i feel it is a very viable comp. Very few wipes were to healing issues.

So, uh, nice first post.. @_@

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Originally Posted by Kiriacou

Your DPS is under geared if you require healer DPS to make the DPS check.
Yoshi has stated that healer DPS is not taken into account when tunning the fights.

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FYI, we ARE under geared for Alex Savage and thus, yes, healing DPS is definitely most helpful to meet these DPS checks.

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Originally Posted by Kiriacou

As for sch being heal/DPS that goes to show me you have no understanding of what a sch does or is.
Sch is ultimately in the end heal/damage reduction, if you can't see that go back to whm or dps

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Badgering people on how to play their job on your very first post..

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Originally Posted by Kiriacou

It is threads like these where I wish she made cleric's stance like last stances can't use in battle.

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I hope not because I enjoy having OPTIONS in my playstyle - not punished because I can play better than most other healers thanks to Cleric Stance. I am actually a bit sad they renagged on AST being able to sect change in combat, but I can live with it.

So, in the end..

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/c7/c718...dc7d8fbd01.jpg

If they ignored healer DPS when balancing the raids, they didn't expect people to clear A1 this week.

Congratulations, Staris and your raid group! That's an awesome feat to accomplish, and thank you so much for answering my questions--I really appreciate it (and I'm sure many others do too!) I'm guessing the "healing" issues I'm encountering is just a combination of both tanks and healers not expecting damage (and not popping CDs), and one (that I had to point out yesterday) was Blood for Blood being used when targets have. Aside from players eating mechanics, like you said, I did notice the few areas where you could just let HoTs top everyone off while you focus on healing prey targets & tanks.

Guess we just need to go in for a full lockout (and not have ISP issues) for some more experience. And totally going off tangent, but my goodness. I was so saddened and frustrated yesterday that we had to skip raid day and play "carry the D/C'ing Astrologian" on A2 Story Mode so I could get my weekly drop.

Oh oh oh! And on a side note, how are you liking the changes to Lightspeed?

@Staris
Congratz and thanks for the feedback! I'm interesed in your opinion about how well AST performs as opposed to WHM. If possible, try with WHM next week and let us know. Good luck for AS2!

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Originally Posted by Aurorarose51

I tried.. i really tried... just attempted with ast/sch, and we just could not get off enough aoe healing and topping people off for the double preys.. faust was a pain healing through as well. tanks died so much for us at 6% with ast healing and mild sch dps.. Switched back to sch/whm, one shot faust, i didn't even have to cast a single heal with me back on sch. boss himself went a lot better as well to heal through. i... really tried... and i'm so upset i'm going back to sch </3

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I had this exact same experience :( The double prey was so hard to heal through and then preparing for tank busters...

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Originally Posted by Staris

We did 3 lockouts on day one, and it only took 1/2 a lockout on the second day and nearly every attempt was to the end. So i feel it is a very viable comp. Very few wipes were to healing issues.

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The problem is that if you're wiping to DPS checks, a WHM/SCH duo allows the SCH to do a hell of a lot more DPS and, as people have been saying in the thread, that's what their experience has been and the content becomes dramatically easier once they switched to this combo.

And that's actually BACKWARDS: the whole point of AST is that you should be making DPS checks faster because of the buffs, and if we're not, then there's NO point to AST at all. :\

I'm guessing that if you had a WHM/SCH combo you'd have just rolled right through it...