Revelations from Keynote II

The more I read theories about it, the more I am keen to think it's not about whose voice it is, but the call itself. It could pretty much end up being a brand new 5.0 character calling us wherever they deem fit and that's it.
There's no consistency in voice acting, it could be meant to be confusing in that respect. Maybe it is just a call, but the voice is constructed by the Scion's conscience or something. In 4.4, there's no discussion of the Scions trying to identify that voice based on how it sounds.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

The more I read theories about it, the more I am keen to think it's not about whose voice it is, but the call itself. It could pretty much end up being a brand new 5.0 character calling us wherever they deem fit and that's it.
There's no consistency in voice acting, it could be meant to be confusing in that respect. Maybe it is just a call, but the voice is constructed by the Scion's conscience or something. In 4.4, there's no discussion of the Scions trying to identify that voice based on how it sounds.

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The others aren't able to identify any of the words from what I remember. The WoL's unique in that regard, and the question is why.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

In 4.4, there's no discussion of the Scions trying to identify that voice based on how it sounds.

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That's mostly because the other Scions couldn't really hear the voice much, if at all.

It was only the WoL that was able to hear it clearly enough to actually note that there WAS a voice and what it said.

Honestly, what I've been most curious about with the call, is Alisae.

When the final call was happening, Alisae ends up talking about how she can feel it taking her. This is different to all the other Scions who were merely incapacitated by the call and then seemingly randomly selected to have their souls taken.

While, Alisae was for some reason, able to feel her soul being taken.

Why? Why was it different for her?

Oh ok. I did not realise lol. Thanks for clarifying

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Originally Posted by Kalise

When the final call was happening, Alisae ends up talking about how she can feel it taking her. This is different to all the other Scions who were merely incapacitated by the call and then seemingly randomly selected to have their souls taken.

While, Alisae was for some reason, able to feel her soul being taken.

Why? Why was it different for her?

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Well, she just says "No, not now... not like..."

Urianger mentions it too. And Y'Sthola says something like she can hear it. I don't precisely see much more for Alisaie. Other than the fact that contrary to the other ones when it appeared to them, she knows that the Call is getting more and more dangerous.
I'm wondering if the order matters too. First Thancred, and he appears in the first Shadowbringer trailer. Then Y'Sthola and Urianger, and they appear in the second trailer. So... a third trailer would show the twins ?

I'm ready red hot and wet for this MSQ / Fan Fest.

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Originally Posted by Kalise

That's mostly because the other Scions couldn't really hear the voice much, if at all.

It was only the WoL that was able to hear it clearly enough to actually note that there WAS a voice and what it said.

Honestly, what I've been most curious about with the call, is Alisae.

When the final call was happening, Alisae ends up talking about how she can feel it taking her. This is different to all the other Scions who were merely incapacitated by the call and then seemingly randomly selected to have their souls taken.

While, Alisae was for some reason, able to feel her soul being taken.

Why? Why was it different for her?

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She has a twin. :rolleyes:

I hope that's not going to end up being the answer to it all. :p

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Well, she just says "No, not now... not like..."

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Literally, yes.

But if you complete her sentence it's most likely that she's trying to say "Not like this!"

She then reaches out to the WoL as if she's trying to anchor herself to the person with plot armour Hydaelin's Blessing (Granted, that's also because WoL's a friend and a huge pillar of support for her)

Others mention hearing the call/whatever these things are and then poof they're gone. Alisae is acting as though she knows this means it's her turn and that she's going with it this time.

Bearing in mind, that all the Scions that have been affected, have all heard every call. So she can't be working on the assumption that calls = being taken, since it has been selective up to that point.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

She has a twin. :rolleyes:

I hope that's not going to end up being the answer to it all. :p

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If it is, then it would seem strange. You'd think that if it was being a twin that caused the effect, then wouldn't both twins be taken at the same time? Rather than Alphinaud being taken first and then Alisae.

But I guess we'll see in time. Also, why the twins were curiously absent from the ShB trailer and pictures released at the Fanfest...

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Originally Posted by Kalise

But I guess we'll see in time. Also, why the twins were curiously absent from the ShB trailer and pictures released at the Fanfest...

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They were in the main poster with all the other characters. And we didn't see Y'shtola and Urianger in the first trailer either, but that doesn't indicate anything.

It's likely we'll see them in the final trailer or other information at Japan Fanfest. They might just not want to show off their new costumes yet, or something.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

They might just not want to show off their new costumes yet, or something.

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Tataru's still working on them I guess...

Perhaps they're wanting to keep their new classes on the DL.

Inb4 Alphinaud is Dancer.

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Originally Posted by Kalise

Literally, yes.

But if you complete her sentence it's most likely that she's trying to say "Not like this!"

She then reaches out to the WoL as if she's trying to anchor herself to the person with plot armour Hydaelin's Blessing (Granted, that's also because WoL's a friend and a huge pillar of support for her)

Others mention hearing the call/whatever these things are and then poof they're gone. Alisae is acting as though she knows this means it's her turn and that she's going with it this time.

Bearing in mind, that all the Scions that have been affected, have all heard every call. So she can't be working on the assumption that calls = being taken, since it has been selective up to that point.



If it is, then it would seem strange. You'd think that if it was being a twin that caused the effect, then wouldn't both twins be taken at the same time? Rather than Alphinaud being taken first and then Alisae.

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There's not too much else that distinguishes her... of which we know. She faced the Warriors of Darkness with the WoL, but then Urianger was also present at that encounter. The only thing I can think of distinguishing her is her bond to Alphinaud, which is a common trope in fantasy, and would tie into hypotheses that the mystery voice is him, which is why it occurred to me. However, I remain doubtful that it's him. On the other hand, maybe the girl is just more receptive/sensitive to such things than the other Scions. Both her and Alphinaud are exceptional in many ways, after all.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

On the other hand, maybe the girl is just more receptive/sensitive to such things than the other Scions. Both her and Alphinaud are exceptional in many ways, after all.

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True...

I mean, that's why she mentions she never quite had the knack for casting spells, which is why she manipulates her aether into that sword of hers, or well, she did until she got her current bubblegum one to reduce the strain of creating and maintaining a physical blade made of aether.

Which brings up another possibility, since during the fight with the WoD's, she charged up her ultimate attack by having the WoL give her some aether. Perhaps there's a side effect to being given magical WoL aether?

Perhaps! In the absence of any other explanations as to why she'd intuit such a calling, it makes sense, some manner of special bond with the WoL.

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Originally Posted by Kalise

Bearing in mind, that all the Scions that have been affected, have all heard every call. So she can't be working on the assumption that calls = being taken, since it has been selective up to that point.

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Yet there's no more Scions at this point (apart from Krile, but she seems to be kept out of it, right? and Tataru has kind of left too. Maybe it just discriminated lallas).
Anyway, I actually think she's working on that assumption, knowing that each Call is potentially the one that will be taking her. And with only the WoL and herself remaining, she must have known. The "Not like [this]" is more situational in my opinion. She is enthusiast of our recent victory in Ghymlit, she wants to push forward and win the battle so that when the other Scions wake up, that matter would have been resolved. Yet she is being taken out, and I th sheink's merely expressing frustration to be taken while she knows she could do more. Because she regained some kind of "hope" and support in the presence of the WoL by her side in these rough times.

Yet it works fine with the first two, the Call happens each time the Scions express some kind of objective / plan of action to solve the current situation. That's also why I don't really think it's physically someone that Calls at given times, but more some kind of automatic reaction to behaviours.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Yet there's no more Scions at this point (apart from Krile, but she seems to be kept out of it, right? and Tataru has kind of left too. Maybe it just discriminated lallas).

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Not so. There's plenty of Scions left. Such as Hoary Boulder, Coultenet, Arenvald, Riol, F'lhaminn, Yugiri, Noraxia and a plethora of other people whom we don't interact with in a significant way during MSQ's that hang around both the Rising Stones and the Walking Sands.

I mean, technically, Krile and Alisae are not actually Scions. They're merely honorary members while their goals align with those of the Scions (Some what amplified by both of them having an interest in Alphinaud's safety).

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Originally Posted by Kalise

Not so. There's plenty of Scions left. Such as Hoary Boulder, Coultenet, Arenvald, Riol, F'lhaminn, Yugiri, Noraxia and a plethora of other people whom we don't interact with in a significant way during MSQ's that hang around both the Rising Stones and the Walking Sands.

I mean, technically, Krile and Alisae are not actually Scions. They're merely honorary members while their goals align with those of the Scions (Some what amplified by both of them having an interest in Alphinaud's safety).

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So the guy preparing cocktails in the waking stones is a Scion too ? ;p
Ok I did look at the wikia page and indeed their listing is a lot more than I counted, sorry :D

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Originally Posted by Mansion

So the guy preparing cocktails in the waking stones is a Scion too ? ;p

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I guess so.

In as much as how Tataru is a Scion, yet mostly is just a Secretary/Administrator within the group.

There's more to the Scions than going around punching Primals and Ascians in the face ;)

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Originally Posted by Kalise

Not so. There's plenty of Scions left. Such as Hoary Boulder, Coultenet, Arenvald, Riol, F'lhaminn, Yugiri, Noraxia and a plethora of other people whom we don't interact with in a significant way during MSQ's that hang around both the Rising Stones and the Walking Sands.

I mean, technically, Krile and Alisae are not actually Scions. They're merely honorary members while their goals align with those of the Scions (Some what amplified by both of them having an interest in Alphinaud's safety).

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Not Noraxia. She died at the Waking Sands.

Another minor Scion we haven't heard from in a while is Dariustel, the Duskwight who was around during the later part of ARR and (as far as I'm aware) hasn't been seen since the start of Heavensward. The first lorebook just says he's "working to counter the actions of the beast tribes", so presumably he's fine, but we don't ever see him at the Rising Stones.

And there's also V'mah Tia and J'moldva who are (along with Arenvald) working with the Gyr Abanians during Stormblood, and are currently hanging around in Rhalgr's Reach rather than the Scions' base.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

So the guy preparing cocktails in the waking stones is a Scion too ? ;p

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Her name is Ephemie Giphelmont, and she joined with the Crystal Braves, but remained loyal to Alphinaud, and later got folded in with the Scions after the Crystal Braves disbanded.

She actually has a minor part in the MSQ, back when you were tracking down the Ivy.

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Originally Posted by YianKutku

Her name is Ephemie Giphelmont, and she joined with the Crystal Braves, but remained loyal to Alphinaud, and later got folded in with the Scions after the Crystal Braves disbanded.

She actually has a minor part in the MSQ, back when you were tracking down the Ivy.

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Well, thanks for the info.
Wherever we might end up being called, I wish we could bring our barmaid then.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Yet there's no more Scions at this point (apart from Krile, but she seems to be kept out of it, right? and Tataru has kind of left too. Maybe it just discriminated lallas).

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As others have stated, there are far more members of the Scions than just the 'Archons' that you're thinking of. The Scions are actually an amalgamation of members from two different (and originally seperate) groups that existed prior to the Calamity. The first group, that the Archons belong to, was the Circle of Knowing, a group founded by Louisoix of renegade Sharlayan scholars who no longer wanted to stand idly by hoarding knowledge while the Empire invaded Eorzea and the world went off to hell in a handbasket around them. It's members ended up being associated with the legendary 'Archons', and can easily be identified by their destinctive Sharlayan neck tattoos (although wether they actually are the real Archons is a matter of debate).

The second group, that Minfilia originally ran and which Tataru also belonged to, was the Path of the Twelve, a research guild set up to study the Echo and it's effects, as well as providing a place of sanctuary for those 'awoken' to it (this is the organization the player actually joined back in 1.0, the Archons only showed up in a few story quests and actually had little interaction with the player). It was retconned that it was Louisoix who originally founded the Path, but this fact was never mentioned back in 1.0, it was only stated in one of the 'Tales From the Calamity' stories after 1.0 was long shutdown. Many of the Path's members were killed or injured in the Calamity, and the Circle lost their leader in the same event, so the remaining Archons approached Minfilia to pool their resources and thus they both disbanded as seperate entities, amalgamating into the new organization the Scions of the Seventh Dawn. Many of the Scions' trappings are actually holdovers from the Path - their headquarters being called 'The Waking Sands' for one (the original pre-Calamity Waking Sands was located in the centre of Ul'dah, where the Hall of Flames is now located. Minfilia being enshrined as 'antecendent' is another (in the Path Minfilia's position was stated as being 'acting antecedent').

Hence there are far more Scions than just the Archons you're thinking of - there are many regular adventurers who have joined up, many with the Echo, just like in the Path of the Twelve five years previously. The only real difference is since Minfilia's.... apotheosis.... the position of antecendent has been left vacant and the Archons, aided by the Leveilluer twins and the ever resourceful Tataru, have instead picked up the slack running the day to day requirements of the organization. This thus allows the player's character the freedom to go out and do what they do best: slaying Primals, beating up Imperials, saving the world and generally being pretty damn awesome. ;)