Required Class/Rank failed - Can we have Optimal Rank and Favoured Class back?

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

Even Yoshida said it would be easier to balance with the Required system.

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He said that because he knew everyone would lap it up despite it making no sense as a reason. I already enumerated the reasons why this point is invalid a million times over in this thread.

An optimal system that scales down according to class is by definition self-balancing anyway. So even if materia didn't screw balance all to hell by itself, there wouldn't be validity to the claim anyway.

It's a facile conclusion to say optimal was imbalanced, and by extension, that required is more balanced.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

While I think these sorts of restrictions are silly, I would be mostly okay with it if we had some sort of appearance system to counteract the loss of character appearance customizability (is that a word?).

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But then that's basically just the Optimal system without any of the intelligent design involved... lol

But, yeah, I agree, at least it satisfies the RP community, which solves one of the numerous problems with restrictive rank and level system.

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Originally Posted by ellohwell

Wow. If they have to resort to slapping restrictions on everything to create goals for people, they need to try harder. I don't mean this like "oh SE sucks" I mean this like "wearing gear isn't a worthwhile goal".

There are more important things you could be doing than fussing over gear which is basically all just the same anyway. Besides, I could have all R50s and completed every quest and beat every boss and still change weapons and end up naked.

As for the balance issue, I can put one materia on a robe and make it better than full plate so maybe "balance" isn't such a good soap box to use to convey your message.



"too bad"

That's exactly right. It's just plain bad.

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I totally agree with ellohwell on this issue.
Keep your goal-oriented content for things really prestigious, not everyday gear.

We do! You still have your dated gear, amirite?

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Originally Posted by ellohwell

An optimal system that scales down according to class is by definition self-balancing anyway.

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I just wanted to point that out, it really important to understand this point in order to understand why we support optimal level (and favoured class by extension).

Also, people's main reason for not liking the optimal is to stop looking at other players wearing gear above their level... well, we could say the same about players wearing gears BELOW their level.
In that case, you why aren't you fighting for having and upper level cap too? It wouldn't make sense right? Because the lower level gear balances itself by not being optimal in stats for the higher level player. Well, that's EXACTLY what the optimal level did with gear above your level, it was balancing it out.
For example, with the optimal level, I was able to wear my new armours 2 level sooner and it gave me the SAME stats as the gear I'd been wearing for 5 levels already. So, why stick with that old gear when my new one would get better by itself when leveling up the two remaining levels?

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Originally Posted by Nakiamiie

I just wanted to point that out, it really important to understand this point in order to understand why we support optimal level (and favoured class by extension).

Also, people's main reason for not liking the optimal is to stop looking at other players wearing gear above their level...

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I've never seen this as a main argument against it -- What I have seen as an argument against it is because it is actually silly being able to wear absolutely anything at anytime, the main people who were absolutely for this system are RPers because they could make their character look how they wanted, stats aside -- On a game level, Yoshida even agreed it would be too hard to balance that and content, especially dropped gear.

Required Level - Easier to balance.

Optimal Level - You need to create an algorithm to scale every single stat accordingly, including make it give "zero" stats, which makes it more complicated than it needs to be, which is also why they did the color change system the way they did for now. Remember, he took over a mess of a game and has to fix it, he even stated the calculations for Protect and Shell for example were needlessly complex.

In order to fix things in game development, it's not a crime to simplify the foundation.

Here's another point for the whiners like gifthorse to ponder. Why has thread, or the last thread on this, managed to last as long as it has? It's a null point because the system as it was is not coming back. Period. It has already been declared and decided as a fixed point by Yoshi. Crying about it won't change it now. He's stated his position on this. I'm done with this thread because you're never gonna get it through your QQing brains that Tanaka's game is dead and the remnants are carefully being cut away with every update. The game is better for it. Either suck it up, or quit. Good day.

Elohwell is just butthurt he can't wear red cobalt on his level 1 woodworking class.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

I've never seen this as a main argument against it -- What I have seen as an argument against it is because it is actually silly being able to wear absolutely anything at anytime, the main people who were absolutely for this system are RPers because they could make their character look how they wanted, stats aside -- On a game level, Yoshida even agreed it would be too hard to balance that and content, especially dropped gear.

Required Level - Easier to balance.

Optimal Level - You need to create an algorithm to scale every single stat accordingly, including make it give "zero" stats, which makes it more complicated than it needs to be, which is also why they did the color change system the way they did for now. Remember, he took over a mess of a game and has to fix it, he even stated the calculations for Protect and Shell for example were needlessly complex.

In order to fix things in game development, it's not a crime to simplify the foundation.

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You sound like Blizzard making everything out to be way more overcomplicated than it is in reality. All new gear is already following a scale that has already been established to make it in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Alerith

Elohwell is just butthurt he can't wear red cobalt on his level 1 woodworking class.

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If you took a moment to stop trolling you would see the problems with lower level gear and the gaps if you want to keep using the same type. There's absolutely nothing to fill in the 10 level gaps without using an entirely different type of gear which is really bad game design.

The entire system feels like we only have a small fraction of items that should be there.

It doesn't have to be complicated.

More than three levels below, you receive 0 stat benefit from the item.
3 levels below: 25% stat benefit.
2 levels below: 50% stat benefit.
1 level below: 75% stat benefit.
At level and above: 100% stat benefit.

If an item doesn't favor your class, there's an additional 25% penalty added on top of the above. I can't imagine this would be that hard to implement, and it shouldn't mess up balance. If the itemization is done right, At three levels below you're better off wearing another item, while at one level below the new item is better.

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Originally Posted by Tiraelina

You sound like Blizzard making everything out to be way more overcomplicated than it is in reality.

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Uh, Yoshida himself said a lot of calculations and algorithms in FFXIV were overly complex. So if anything, you should be saying SE is making out their game to be more complicated than it is, since you know their code better than they do apparently.

Btw:

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On the topic of monster attribute changes and possibly player attribute changes, can you go more into detail on this? A lot of players feel everything is still a bit out of whack when it comes to the current attributes like dex barely affecting Accuracy or Shell barely reducing an Imps Blizzard damage.

Our Lead Battle Director, Matsui-san, is currently undergoing--they're basically going to change the equations for how stuff is calculated, all of these attributes. As they balance each of the classes with the new balance system, they're going to go through and check each action. And then see how that needs to be adjusted, and reassign each attribute as they go along.

Since it's going to be such a huge undertaking, it's going to happen in steps--it's not all going to change in the next patch, but over the next few patches we hope to change it. But we want to reassess everything, so it's not like we're going to be looking at one broken thing, we're going to be changing pretty much everything.

One of the reasons that you have some of the things not affecting something at all--like Shell not working on a lot of spells--is because right now a lot of the calculations for that stuff is too complex. Because it's so complex, it's difficult to balance. They want to make it simpler, not just so the players know what's going on--having to have some super program going on in the background to understand the calculations--but also so when the devs do balancing, it's easier for them to balance.

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March 2011 Interview

So no, it's not making it out to be "overcomplicated", because in order to properly scale attributes in games it does require an algorithm, which is nothing more than math, versus just setting a set value which no one can argue isn't much easier to balance than having to make sure something is balanced in almost every instance at every level.

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The entire system feels like we only have a small fraction of items that should be there.

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Aside Materia, this is exactly it. Remember, this is a game going under an overhaul and still pretty much in development.

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Originally Posted by Tiraelina

You sound like Blizzard making everything out to be way more overcomplicated than it is in reality.

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Blizzard makes complicated products?

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

It doesn't have to be complicated.

More than three levels below, you receive 0 stat benefit from the item.
3 levels below: 25% stat benefit.
2 levels below: 50% stat benefit.
1 level below: 75% stat benefit.
At level and above: 100% stat benefit.

If an item doesn't favor your class, there's an additional 25% penalty added on top of the above. I can't imagine this would be that hard to implement, and it shouldn't mess up balance. If the itemization is done right, At three levels below you're better off wearing another item, while at one level below the new item is better.

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Or, current option, no algorithm and just straight-up play your game.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

Uh, Yoshida himself said a lot of calculations and algorithms in FFXIV were overly complex. So if anything, you should be saying SE is making out their game to be more complicated than it is, since you know their code better than they do apparently.

Btw:


March 2011 Interview

So no, it's not making it out to be "overcomplicated", because in order to properly scale attributes in games it does require an algorithm, which is nothing more than math, versus just setting a set value which no one can argue isn't much easier to balance than having to make sure something is balanced in almost every instance at every level.



Aside Materia, this is exactly it. Remember, this is a game going under an overhaul and still pretty much in development.

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Optimal already did/does what you are stating would be hard to implement, how hard is that to understand? 1.19 made optimal gear worse than everything 5 levels below you if you are 1 level off.

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Originally Posted by Tiraelina

Optimal already did/does what you are stating would be hard to implement, how hard is that to understand? 1.19 made optimal gear worse than everything 5 levels below you if you are 1 level off.

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Hard to balance, not implement -- Even yoshida said it would pose a problem in terms of balancing. (Also it created confusion, but it's more regarding the game balance.)

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Originally Posted by Answa

Or, current option, no algorithm and just straight-up play your game.

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Do you realize that optimal rank/class gear still exists? Do you realize that a similar algorithm is exactly what optimal rank/class gear already did and currently does? The only difference is that the game now tells you how much the attack/defense is lowered.

I can wear optimal rank-39 steel armor right now, but due to the level difference, it would actually be worse than what I have on now. The stat-dropping algorithm is alive and well in the game.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

Hard to balance, not implement -- Even yoshida said it would pose a problem in terms of balancing. (Also it created confusion, but it's more regarding the game balance.)

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As I've said, you make everything out to be more complicated than it is in reality to reinforce your own arguments. Do you think they just made every item willy nilly or something? They already have your hard to balance to algorithm. Where do you think the stats came from on the current gear?

Do tell where these balance problems are going to crop up from. In a system where below top tier gear actually has some give in it's required level. Mixing optimal and required would have been a better system than the one you can't seem to let go or accept there being better alternatives. What the dev team says isn't law nor are they perfect.

I have to wonder who the troll is in these threads sometimes when you decide to selectively quote a post and ignore everything else.

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Originally Posted by Schubalts

Do you realize that optimal rank/class gear still exists? Do you realize that a similar algorithm is exactly what optimal rank/class gear already did and currently does? The only difference is that the game now tells you how much the attack/defense is lowered.

I can wear optimal rank-39 steel armor right now, but due to the level difference, it would actually be worse than what I have on now. The stat-dropping algorithm is alive and well in the game.

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Yep, they're just trying to move us to Materia slotted gear, which can't be done on older gear (which is where the majority of the optimal gear lie) which is why they mentioned balancing, since they'd have to rebalance pretty much everything with the inclusion of Materia which would also have to be balance on optimal gear.

The thing is, it's just much easier to balance a set value and add to it (materia for example) than it is to augment scaling gear, which is why other MMOs haven't really done it in mass and used what works in terms of gear systems, not because they didn't think of doing something new, but because it's actually a lot of hassle to get proper balance on it, even though Unreal and Havok can do it 'out of the box', but for MMOs it's always a finicky beast.

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Originally Posted by Tiraelina

As I've said, you make everything out to be more complicated than it is

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I'll show it again:

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One of the reasons that you have some of the things not affecting something at all--like Shell not working on a lot of spells--is because right now a lot of the calculations for that stuff is too complex. Because it's so complex, it's difficult to balance. They want to make it simpler, not just so the players know what's going on--having to have some super program going on in the background to understand the calculations--but also so when the devs do balancing, it's easier for them to balance.

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It was already stated things were needlessly complex in terms of calculations, which means making things simpler, would make it easier to balance.

That's not at all hard to understand.

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I have to wonder who the troll is in these threads sometimes when you decide to selectively quote a post and ignore everything else.

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Kind of like you ignored what yoshida stated?

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Originally Posted by Schubalts

Do you realize that optimal rank/class gear still exists? Do you realize that a similar algorithm is exactly what optimal rank/class gear already did and currently does? The only difference is that the game now tells you how much the attack/defense is lowered.

I can wear optimal rank-39 steel armor right now, but due to the level difference, it would actually be worse than what I have on now. The stat-dropping algorithm is alive and well in the game.

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Do you realize that my post before what you just quoted says that there's still the dated gear out there? Wear that. Stop QQing.

BTW, get with the times. It's level, not rank. ALSO, the gear doesn't tell you how it's affected by using it below the optimal level/favored class. It tells you the difference between what you're wearing now and that piece you want to wear.

Do you realize how old and meaningless what you keep quoting is at this point going forward to 2.0?

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

I'll show it again:



It was already stated things were needlessly complex in terms of calculations, which means making things simpler, would make it easier to balance.

That's not at all hard to understand.

Kind of like you ignored what yoshida stated?

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The devs say a lot of things. And yes, they said everything was needlessly complicated.

However, why you think an Optimal Rank System needs to be "overly complicated" is beyond me. It's a huge stretch to go from the devs saying something to then assuming it must be true about everything in the game.

Just using your common sense, it should be pretty apparent that an optimal rank and favoured class system for gear can be simplified to the point of being easy to balance. A restrictive system is merely "the easiest" thing to balance, and you are therefore saying that the dev team are lazy if you think this is all they are competent enough to implement.

And do you honestly believe everything Yoshi states? The developers are often stating specious and dubious claims about certain things, and it pays to be a bit sceptical or cynnical about such statements, especially as it pertains to the Optimal and favoured class system.

I mean, haven't we already explained how simple it can be? It needn't take a Fourier Analysis or Complex Lapacian or whatever to scale down stats according to rank and class. It needn't be that complex.

So I don't know why you (and Yoshi apparently) are arguing that it need be.

It needn't be!

Also, materia just imbalances EVERYTHING anyway, so even if the Optimal rank and Favoured Class system was imbalanced (which it wouldn't be if SE put their skilled mathmeticians to work), then it wouldn't matter compared to the Materia System. Next to the imbalance caused by the materia system, the optimal rank system would look balanced by comparison.

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Originally Posted by ellohwell

And do you honestly believe everything Yoshi states?

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As someone with actual experience in this industry, I'd have no reason to not believe him -- I've seen things get overcomplicated for absolutely no reasons at times, be it due to bad programming or bad design decisions, which people like to say SE is the king of. (You yourself said you played XI before, you should know very well how people thought this.)

Nothing to needs to be more complex than it needs to be, that's the problem and that's exactly why it's being simplified. If I had zero knowledge and experience in this industry, I would indeed be very skeptical about a lot what is said, however I know first hand how messy source code can be, which can make anything needlessly complex, when there's a lot of better (and easier ways to handle it) -- However, 9/10 you have to work with what you got, there's no escaping it; Yoshida was given a broken mess of a game and he has to work with it, he even said FFXIV 2.0 will be a 'new game', but it will still be the same game.

Like I said before, even look at the colored system:

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Hey everyone! Sorry for the delay in getting this to you all, but I hope that the response from Yoshida on this very hot topic will help to alleviate your concerns going forward. Take a look -

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Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

This is Yoshida, the producer/director.

I’m sorry that this post is late and I apologize for writing another long post.

First of all, I would like to apologize for the inconvenience caused by an item’s color affecting its stats in the new recipes. I have read all of your feedback and I would like to speak about the future of colors and their effect on stats.

The fundamental idea behind colors in FFXIV was to create differences in stats for gear. We wanted to separate gear, which was limited in number, into higher and lower tiers. However, we would like to alter this foundation of gear to:

・Color is for individuality
・Shape represents strength

However, we were unable to bring our data up to speed with this new model, which is the reason for our problems now.

Although I informed the team about the new specs earlier, I am the one who gave the go ahead, so I am responsible for the error in planning.
I apologize for my mistake.
(Also, I have come across some posts that suggest that certain developers have been responsible for specific developments, but this is false, and the developers aren’t even correct. Please keep this in mind.)

We would like to adjust the specs based on everybody’s feedback, but please take a look at the following first.

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The reason that I have avoided speaking in detail about colors is because the spec for creating color variations has been performed simply through texture changes. I have mentioned this in a different thread, but I would like to have 24 or 32 colors available for use on any gear item. I would like to accommodate the demands of all players; players who would like to wear all red, players who would like to wear all black, and players who want to have a different color for each piece of gear equipped.

However, if we create all of these colors using texture only, whether on the PS3 version or on a low spec PC, we would face some serious technical problems. Thus, we would like to make adjustments to the item data files themselves.

This is a bit technical, but we will perform color changes by changing the material color and separating the dyed colors from memory. We were able to confirm this with QA recently. Once this has been finished, players will be able to dye their gear in any color. Using the recipe “finished product + dye,” players will be able to freely change color variations as many times as they want.
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The reasons that we have encountered our current problems are:

・The color variations currently set up for each gear item are not uniform
・The colors have been prepared using textures, so more colors cannot be prepared
・In terms of data, the same items with different colors are treated as different items, so it is difficult to add additional colors
・Eventually, gear stats and color will be re-implemented as unrelated entities (data will be eased through a Color ID system)
・We wanted to allow crafters to create items with different stats by altering similar recipes

Our biggest mistakes were implementing colored items although the colors were not uniform and mixing colors with the concept of allowing crafters to create similar items with different stats. We should have spent more time developing these specs, and I apologize for the mistakes.


There are 2 ways we can fix our mistakes.

1. Add recipes for “Finished product + Dye” and add items for each additional color
⇒This is a temporary solution, but color and stats will be clearly separated
⇒The only problem is that it will take a long time to add all of the items

2. Remove class restrictions for colored gear until the Color ID system is ready
⇒The number of items will not increase greatly, so this could be implemented more quickly
⇒Stats will have to be sacrificed for color choices (this can be balanced by Materia)


We are considering the costs of the above two solutions.

Personally, I prefer the 1st solution, but it would be implemented with patch 1.20 in this best case scenario, so at least until then, the current situation will continue.
(This will also negatively affect our ability to add other content and recipes)
The 2nd solution cannot be implemented in time for patch 1.19a, but it can be implemented soon after.
(We are looking into the cost of this solution as well)

We are sorry that we will continue to inconvenience you, but we will do our best to handle this issue as quickly as possible. Information will be posted as soon as decisions are made.

Please continue to submit your feedback!

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Things fundamentally are just more complex than it needs to be and it's what he has to work with. This is why he's just simplifying everything, because it's much easier to balance overall.

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Originally Posted by Answa

Do you realize that my post before what you just quoted says that there's still the dated gear out there? Wear that. Stop QQing.

BTW, get with the times. It's level, not rank. ALSO, the gear doesn't tell you how it's affected by using it below the optimal level/favored class. It tells you the difference between what you're wearing now and that piece you want to wear.

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Dated gear that will literally vanish from the game after SE finishes their crafting overhauls and lacks materia slots? Wear that dated gear?And the steel armor I'm talking about is not dated, it is new recipe armor. And stop telling people not to complain about unnessecary changes that they do not agree with. That's one of the things that forums are for.

Rank, level, age, it means the same damn thing; get over my word choice there. And not-in-your-inventory gear already tells you the stat difference between it and what you have equipped, so it can be adjusted to show the stat decrease from not being optimal, too. Just like how SE added the decreases to equipped gear descriptions.

SE already added NPCs that explain what Optimal means, anyway, getting rid of that dumb reason for being against the optimal rank/class system.

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Originally Posted by Schubalts

Dated gear that will literally vanish from the game after SE finishes their crafting overhauls and lacks materia slots? Wear that dated gear?And the steel armor I'm talking about is not dated, it is new recipe armor. And stop telling people not to complain about unnessecary changes that they do not agree with. That's one of the things that forums are for.

Rank, level, age, it means the same damn thing; get over my word choice there. And not-in-your-inventory gear already tells you the stat difference between it and what you have equipped, so it can be adjusted to show the stat decrease from not being optimal, too. Just like how SE added the decreases to equipped gear descriptions.

SE already added NPCs that explain what Optimal means, anyway, getting rid of that dumb reason for being against the optimal rank/class system.

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Yes, those. They never said they were going to delete them, just make them pointless.

And yes, I'm done with this subject. It's boring and already someone in my LS bitched to me about how detrimental it is to his RPing. *rolls eyes*

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Originally Posted by ellohwell

Why shouldnt you be wearing Lvl 50 gear at Lvl 1? If it scaled appropriately, there would be no reason to wear it at lvl 1, but you would still have the option.

Im allowed to wear the gear on all my R50 classes, so ive earnt the right, and yet as soon as I equip a fry-pan I can't wear my gear anymore? You telling me everytime I cook dinner I have to strip naked? Everytime I pick up a knife, I have to strip naked?

You're crazy.

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I agree, also just because "req level" exists as a standard in other MMORPGs does not mean it should be that way in FFXIV. The game does not have enough content to hold us between level 18 gear and level 28 gear.

Maybe they should keep the required level and class stuff on the higher level gear, and keep things, say 30 and below with optimal? Maybe there's a lot of Optimal gear below 30 that's not dated, I haven't really gone over all of the lower level gear yet, but In any case, while I see the uses of Required, I also see where the OP is coming from in a sense as well. Should totally be able to use a rank 18 weapon as a rank 15.

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Originally Posted by Answa

Yes, those. They never said they were going to delete them, just make them pointless.

And yes, I'm done with this subject. It's boring and already someone in my LS bitched to me about how detrimental it is to his RPing. *rolls eyes*

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They won't be deleting the existing dated gear, but once crafting overhauls are complete those recipes are going away for good so you won't be able to make anymore. Get it now if you want it :D

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Originally Posted by Answa

Yes, those. They never said they were going to delete them, just make them pointless.

And yes, I'm done with this subject. It's boring and already someone in my LS bitched to me about how detrimental it is to his RPing. *rolls eyes*

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Girlfriend, you were always done with this subject, before you even began trying to argue your non-existent point. (Emphasis on trying).

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Originally Posted by Answa

It's boring and already someone in my LS bitched to me about how detrimental it is to his RPing. *rolls eyes*

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Complaining about the clear, negative impact a change had on a type of gameplay they engage in and enjoy? That bastard.

Seriously, people need to get over themselves and stop arbitrarily deciding the opinions of people who roleplay (or engage in any other particular sort of gameplay) are somehow irrelevant by default. Sure, it shouldn't be prioritised to the detriment of the rest of the game, and that's perhaps even more true given the inherent flexibility of roleplaying as an in-game pastime, but that should bloody well work both ways.

It's why an aesthetic mode or favoured gear-model conversions are such good ideas, and I find it amazing that anyone can treat someone who likes one particular aspect of the game as some sort of lesser being and not expect to be seen as a discriminative jerk.

How'd you feel if every time you tried to point out how annoying it is when the server's latent position tracking lets enemies land hits they oughtn't, half the thread dropped snide remarks?

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It's boring and already someone in my LS bitched to me about how detrimental it is to his NMing. *rolls eyes*

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So can we have Optimal Rank and Favoured system back already?

Restricted Rank is just a nonsenseical response to complainers who wanted to lord their almighty R50 status over everyone else, despite the fact that you can be R50 in every class and still not be able to wear what you want under this new system. It didnt make the game better, it just made it worse.

People quote economy, balance, and goal-oriented gameplay as reasons for restrictive rank gear but all these reasons are pitiful attempts to rationalise an unreasonable and illogical system. After all:

-Economy is none the better for restrictive gear, and most likely it's worse because Im sure I buy less stuff now that I cant even wear it.
-Materia was supposed to stimulate the economy enough on its own, so why stimulate it twice anyway? Especially at the cost of ruining the game in other ways.
-Materia overshadows any imbalance caused by wearing something outside of favoured class
-Favoured class and optimal sysstem are self-balancing anyway
-Being able to wear specific gearsets is not even a worthy goal, annd not being able to wear them is a frustration. Overcoming a frustration is hardly the best way to go about implementing goals.

So in conclusion, just give us the old system back and reserve restrictions for R50 AF gear.

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Originally Posted by ellohwell

So in conclusion, just give us the old system back and reserve restrictions for R50 AF gear.

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I keep seeing people say this. Could someone enlighten me as to what AF gear is supposed to be? I can't think of anything in the game that it would stand for.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

I keep seeing people say this. Could someone enlighten me as to what AF gear is supposed to be? I can't think of anything in the game that it would stand for.

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Job specific equipment, like paladin armor or black mage robes.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

I keep seeing people say this. Could someone enlighten me as to what AF gear is supposed to be? I can't think of anything in the game that it would stand for.

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Artifact Gear -

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Gallant_Armor_Set
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Valor_Armor_Set
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Creed_Armor_%2B2_Set

Gear designed specifically for the job(s) in question.

Which they already stated would also be coming.

Artifact gear is to satisfy the latent cosplayer within 99% of the FF audience, and so that's why such gear should be reserved especially to remedy the lack of - what's that stupid terminology called again? - oh that's right "class distinctiveness".

That's basically the only valid reason (and i say the word "valid" with inverted commas) to undermine the optimal rank system, as outlined previously in my other posts (bulletpointed for your convenience).

The optimal rank / favored class system felt very bland to me. I ended up keeping the same gear on with each class, I didn't really feel like I was changing classes, just abilities.

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Originally Posted by Answa

Restrictions are fine. You're being whiny.

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They're being more than whiny. They need to be banned.

I think it would be nice if they could at least revise the restrictions on crafting clothing. Some of the restricted classes for crafting gear are absolutely nonsensical. I buy something only to find out that I can't equip it on the most logical crafting class, and yet meanwhile can wear it as a Pugilist etc.

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Originally Posted by bobbygunz

I think it would be nice if they could at least revise the restrictions on crafting clothing. Some of the restricted classes for crafting gear are absolutely nonsensical. I buy something only to find out that I can't equip it on the most logical crafting class, and yet meanwhile can wear it as a Pugilist etc.

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This I agree with, they definitely need to revise DoH gear. The problem stems with SE trying to give players the ability to do whatever the hell they want before and it failed.

Why are we necrobumping threads?

And by we I mean bobbygunz.