M4S has officially been beaten without healers in week 2

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Originally Posted by Wyti

Healer are useless in a group who makes none. If you haven't played one you don't know how useless you fell in week8+ when kills are clear.

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Healer for 10 years, never had that problem. And I have been in with some HC groups on the way.

If the people in your group make you feel useless for being a healer, sound like you played with the wrong group.

If you just feel useless yourself just because your group doesn't make mistake, then I think you have a self-esteem problem.

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Originally Posted by Isala

You're completely missing the point. We were told that healers had "engaging" gameplay in Savage/Ultimate. To do this without actual healers means that there's so little "engaging gameplay" for healers, that you can complete the fights without even needing one. Which means that the heal checks are so damned low that we're still pushing the same god damned boring one button spam as we are in content since the level 10 guildhest. Why the hell are you defending healers having the same damn gameplay for 90 levels?!

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Where exactly am I saying that?
I am simply saying that until this is meta, healers do have a job in 99% of parties.
By all means, go into PF with another healer, and only use your DOT and Glare/Dosis/Broil/Malefic and see how far your party will actually go in savage and ultimate content. Pretty sure you will be kicked in no-time for not healing.
How many statics do you see without any healers in it right now? How many parties for savage in PF have 1 or 0 healers?
Try to base your stance on realism, not on the exceptions to the standard.


I can understand wanting harsher heal checks, or a significant potency reduction on healing by other jobs. I'm all for that, and I never said I wasn't.
But I'm not freaking out because some cracked raiders do something exceptional.

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Originally Posted by Wyti

The only 2 reason people are still bringing healers is
1) raid targeting mechanic and guide being adapted to it.
2) making up for mistakes.

Healer are useless in a group who makes none. If you haven't played one you don't know how useless you fell in week8+ when kills are clear.
Well this patch its even worse than usual and we're tired of 6+years of neglect. To all those spewing excuse like its only elite player, please play healer and come back if you still think the same.

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"healer are useless" said the one who glare 260 times lmao.

It doesn't matter how good these players are, it still exemplifies that there's way too much healing coming from tank/DPS jobs.

I don't get what's so hard to understand. Yeah not everyone can do it but the fact that it's doable AT ALL and an entire role is not needed is a problem. You can't have a trinity role game and then not need 1 of the three roles.

Here's the thing people aren't realizing, this is just the first one. Now that's it's been proven to be possibly people are gonna start pushing this as far as it can go. We already know we can do it With 7 people (I think 6 might be possible), now we're gonna see them try and lower the number of tanks needed from 4 to 2, and maybe even do 7 man teams for it.

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Originally Posted by Lak14

"healer are useless" said the one who glare 260 times lmao.

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That's my point...

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

Maybe it's time for Healers to be able to deal more damage than tanks to compensate for their frailty.

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The more damage healers do the bigger punishment it will be to heal so healers won't heal, definitely not with GCD spells. This isn't the best approach to solving the problem.

I don't see problems with the healers, because there aren't healers.
I see a problem with the survivability of certain classes.
More -esuna- mechanics and reduce the autohealing/damage reduction of tanks and dps, because this is the brother thread of the lonely tank doing dungeon and trial bosses.

Sometime the carrot is the right choice, but in this case is an hard, knotty stick.

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

More -esuna- mechanics and reduce the autohealing/damage reduction of tanks and DPS, because this is the brother thread of the lonely tank doing dungeon and trial bosses.

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Esuna isn't a good solution. You would be there just because of one button that is 1/0. The healer can't be the master of life and death in parties or suddenly bad healers will fail to complete a run and either get kicked or the group disbands. Then if it repeats people will go to Party Finder instead of using DF directly. The game doesn't even require job stones. Rapid healing would also be limited by slower GCD and then it would need to push more and more off-GCD. There is no singular fix for healers to have fun in this game. It would have to be big and redefining roles and what the holy trinity is and if it's still needed.