SE, the concept of "Limited Jobs" is a really bad idea, turn back now

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

So basically you never want them to do anything new?

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I do want them to do something new: I want the FFXIV flavor of the old designs. The things they're doing with Blue Mage's unique leveling style, skill acquisition and solo content are great, but they also should make it capable of doing the normal group content because that's what 90% of the game content is about. I don't want them to force archaic traditions in a mold where it doesn't fit. I want to see interesting revisions on the old ideas. Red Mage is a good example of a well adjusted job, in my opinion. They managed to capture the nature of double casting and sword skills quite well, without making it a broken mash-up of black and white magic. Summoner is a less successful example, personal taste though, but I'm still glad that it exists as a complete battle class instead of being shoved into some random mini-game role.

If a job is literally so unfit for MMOs that they can't be properly adjusted, I'd just rather not have them at all or allocate any resources for their development, because even the current jobs have issues that haven't been fixed for over a year.

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Originally Posted by SDaemon

You know when that was mentioned specifically? Playing back videos now and didn't see it on the live reddit update. Seems contradictory to his interview answer.

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https://clips.twitch.tv/SnappyFlirtyPepperTBTacoRight

It's from the keynote. While they don't mention it being added to older content as well, I do imagine they will do so... eventually.

I actually LOVE the leveling and skill acquisition system. I think it's a great new addition and is exactly how I would have wanted Blue Mage to become more powerful. Traveling across the game world to hunt down your spells sounds fantastic to me.

But I want to be able to use those skills in content that matters. That's where the problem arises, and it's a huge one. Why should every single job in the game except for Blue Mage be allowed to experience all content?

As to the argument of casual players wanting solo content, I agree that this is a good addition. But don't exclude it from non-casual content. We could still have had a new and exciting leveling process for Blue Mage that ultimately ended with a complete job ready for endgame content. We don't need to have it be one or the other.

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

I do want them to do something new: I want the FFXIV flavor of the old designs. I don't want them to force archaic traditions in a mold where it doesn't fit. I want to see interesting revisions on the old ideas. Red Mage is a good example of a well adjusted job, in my opinion. They managed to capture the nature of double casting and sword skills quite well, without making it a broken mash-up of black and white magic. Summoner is a less successful example, personal taste though, but I'm still glad that it exists as a complete battle class instead of being shoved into some random mini-game role.

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I guess that's where we differ, as I see RDM as a near failure. Sure it looks like a RDM if you squint hard enough, but it's 93% a DPS class with zero interactivity between its damage abilities and its (essentially) tacked-on healing spell and raise... a real Red Mage should be much more 50/50, and have an array of support abilities besides, but FFXIV's rigid role system and high-end encounter design doesn't allow for that, so instead we get a more different BLM with (names aside) only 2 real WHM abilities and 1 very limited (and DPS based) support ability.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

In a similar vein, the things they're doing with Blue Mage's unique leveling style, skill acquisition and solo content are great, but they also should make it capable of doing the normal group content because that's what 90% of the game content is about.

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This I can agree on, but I cannot agree that this means the whole concept should be scrapped as per the OP. Yes it needs refinement, but it also needs time for both the players and developers to get used to the system (this is new for them too) so that it can best be determined what that refinement should look like...

For example:
- Should players be allowed into Duty Finder once they’ve 'proven' they than can handle Blue Mage by passing a set of solo challenges?
- Or should Blue Mage be forced to use a 'Duty' set of abilities?
- What level of duties should Blue Mage be allowed in to? Only dungeons? Normal raid? 24-player raid? (for all of which you could argue that 'balance' doesn't matter overly much)
- Or should Blue Mages be allowed into ALL content, 'balance' be damned? And is the community at large mature (and responsible) enough to handle that?

None of these questions I feel we can answer right now, as we don't know what abilities Blue Mage will have or how powerful they will be, and obviously the developers are (somewhat understandably) playing it safe, and you know what, that's fine, it's an MMO and the developers do (occasionally) listen to feedback...

All of this 'cancel blue mage' stuff though, it isn't feedback, it's whining, whining about wanting to be being able to raid or queue up for duties with randoms on a class called 'Blue Mage' (that's not actually Blue Mage), and for all the calls of 'give us something new' around here it's actually kind of sickening to see.

I actually like this concept of a limited job.
It allows for the implementation of jobs we wouldnt typically get. Something like Beastmaster would fit it quite well.
I've always been of the opinion that we'd never get Beastmaster, or Puppeteer, or Mime in XIV, and ive been dreading a Blue Mage that was little more tgan a RDM clone.

So long as it's in addition to main expansion jobs and not instead of, its fine, its in the same vein as new crafter/gatherer jobs, but far more interesting.

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Originally Posted by Gleipni

I already knew before it would be announce that it would never be viable,why ? his gameplay is not suited for MMO,
1000needle from pampa,when you're level 10 ? its great,when you're lvl 70 ? 1000dmg ? totaly useless,morbol breath ? boss are immune to 90% of abnormal status,so everything that make Blue Mage great if other FF can't be implemented,so yeah,good idea in solo game,bad in MMO because it wont scale good enough.

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I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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The poison DoT effect at the very least should affect her if none of the other debuffs do.

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Originally Posted by Igneel_DB

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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What *exactly* is Blue Mage? Not being able to be in the main party and only doing solo stuff? Uh... no. Being immensely overpowered compared to other characters/classes? Urm... not really? The essence of a blue mage is hunting around for enemy attacks and learning and using them. FFXI did the concept quite well without making the class too overpowered. Was it a strong class? Sure, but I don't really think it was overpowered and it worked with other classes in the game quite well. Could they have implemented a similar system in FFXIV? Probably, but they chose not to. They chose this option instead.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

We don't know that it starts with absolutely nothing. And even if it did, it wouldn't take long to smack around some Cactuars for 100 Needles.

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Possibly if RNG favors the blue mage and if its true that blue mage does indeed have access to caster dps role skills and so would have access to drain. To add to that, since blue mage gets more exp fighting in the overworld they would also likely have a decent time getting access to their quest gained abilities that would enable better overworld farming for exp and skills at least.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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or they could make the exception and allow what bosses get the full effect from bad breath, i mean, on the blue mage trailer we see shiva getting stunned, when she is inmune to it