Dev Request for 4.0: Get rid of cast bars on phy range

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Originally Posted by vp_cmc

He has a lot of procs, that he can use for movement. Brd uses his proc (only straighter shot) mainly for casting empyreal arrow without clipping to next gcd, and he can't move after that, since animation of proc-ed straight shot+empyrial arrow takes about whole gcd.
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Every 15 seconds, and if BRD doesn't have straighter shot proc, he casts heavy shot (1.5s), then empyreal arrow right after that (1.5s) and then other heavy shot right after that (1.5s). So, what we have here? Bard has to stand still for 4.5 seconds, he can't stutter step in this case, because it will cancel his next cast.

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Just a side note, if you're using Empyreal Arrow there is no such thing as truly "clipping your next gcd". Treating Empyreal Arrow like an off-GCD ability you absolutely MUST mash between two GCDs is misguided, what you should really be doing is treated Empyreal Arrow as starting your next GCD early, because that's what it's supposed to be (it could be argued that you're starting actually two GCDs early, as using Empyreal Arrow between two "ordinary" GCD abilities means that your GCD is up as soon as Empyreal Arrow finishes).

And the solution here isn't to walk everything back just because of River of Blood. The solution is to alter River of Blood to a function more conducive of the way Bard plays now, very likely shifting to a system of storing a certain quantity of the procs for individual use at your leisure OR storing up procs to use a boosted version of Bloodletter/Rain of Death based on how many times the trait activated before using it. The goal here is to move away from the "g-gotta hit Bloodletter every single moment it flashes!!" gameplay of 2.x and bring it more in line with how the job is now, a more deliberate, thoughtful playstyle.

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Originally Posted by GMERC

They should, though. What's next, are you going to try and justify playing DRK with Darkside turned off?

Wanderer's Minuet is a lot more fun than Bard was prior, it doesn't need to go anywhere.

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I see DRKs playing without dark side on all the time and they do their job just fine. Doesn't bother me at all as long as the baddies stay on them so I can do my thing.

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Originally Posted by DaikiKiyoshi

I see DRKs playing without dark side on all the time and they do their job just fine. Doesn't bother me at all as long as the baddies stay on them so I can do my thing.

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You should really be teaching them to play their jobs correctly, not encouraging it because it's "not affecting you". Darkside isn't optional, and neither is Wanderer's Minuet. Choosing not to use either out of some kind of (stupid) principle is choosing to be a waste of a party slot.

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Originally Posted by GMERC

You should really be teaching them to play their jobs correctly.

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i will tell people how they should be playing the moment we start getting paid to play this game.

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Originally Posted by Ardour

I'd like to add that apart from cast times hampering mobility and oGCD usage, some people just don't like the way they *feel.* I would rather have instant casts than cast times even if I'm standing totally still and using no oGCDs, simply because instant casts feel quicker and more responsive to me. There are already enough jobs with cast times that I feel the game ought to have at least one cast-free rDPS for sake of fun and playstyle diversity.

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Yes! This. Maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to have WM drain MP, I don't know. But how about this: WM increases damage by 10% (or something that makes it equal to MCH) and prevents the bard from using autoattacks while moving. There, mobility penalty without cast times.

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Originally Posted by Brian_

Except BRDs aren't on the lower end of the stick in terms of DPS. They weren't in 2.X. They aren't in 3.X. Aside from a few lulls (where it wasn't so much that BRD was bad, MCH was just better), BRD has always been one of the best jobs in terms of DPS.

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If you talk to SMNs they will say SMN has good DPS, if you talk to MCHs they will say MCH has good DPS, if you talk to NINs they will say NIN has good dps, and so goes the list.

Then who is the lowest DPS? Could you rank all the DPS classes?

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Originally Posted by GMERC

You should really be teaching them to play their jobs correctly, not encouraging it because it's "not affecting you". Darkside isn't optional, and neither is Wanderer's Minuet. Choosing not to use either out of some kind of (stupid) principle is choosing to be a waste of a party slot.

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As long as they are holding hate they are doing their job in my book. Opinions and standards differ greatly apparently. May I suggest that yours are perhaps a little too high? Regarding DF content anyway. On topic I agree completely with the OP.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

Yes! This. Maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to have WM drain MP, I don't know. But how about this: WM, increases damage by 10% (or something that makes it equal to MCH) and prevents the bard from using autoattacks while moving. There, mobility penalty without cast times.

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That's not much of a penalty considering you don't really need to move much at all (unless dealing with mechanics or getting out of AoE's). WM would have to become a one minute CD (Enochian, Blood of the Dragon) and the WM buff will need to last 30 seconds... and as an added penalty, you can't sing other songs (and you can't sing WM if you're already singing other songs) nor use auto-attacks.

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Originally Posted by DaikiKiyoshi

As long as they are holding hate they are doing their job in my book. Opinions and standards differ greatly apparently. May I suggest that yours are perhaps a little too high? Regarding DF content anyway. On topic I agree completely with the OP.

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Not using Darkside is like playing Ice Mage. You can break 1000 dps without casting a single Fire spell, but it doesn't mean it's remotely acceptable to do so. Even you must be able to understand that such a thing is unacceptable. Unless you've been confused this whole time and are mixing up Darkside with Grit?

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Originally Posted by GMERC

Not using Darkside is like playing Ice Mage. You can break 1000 dps without casting a single Fire spell, but it doesn't mean it's remotely acceptable to do so. Even you must be able to understand that such a thing is unacceptable. Unless you've been confused this whole time and are mixing up Darkside with Grit?

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Nah I'm not confusing the two stance at all. I also don't agree with the your comparison to an Ice Mage as DD's (Damage Dealers) main role is to kill the things. The tanks main role is to hold hate. Also while I'm at it the healers main role is to keep people alive. Anything beyond that is secondary and completely optional. It's great to have those players who go above and beyond but not doing so hardly makes them a waste of a party slot.