Dragoon Punished at lvl 58 - What needs to be done with Wheeling Thrust

wow are you seriously complaining about one skill.

MCH has two completely useless skills post 50, not to mention the lowest dps in the game and is much harder to play then most dps.

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Originally Posted by TheKingSlayer

What if they gave you both Fang and Wheeling at the same time? Then you'd probably see it as a reward, right? Then what the hell is the difference?! Not all skills are a "reward," look at Feint :/

2.0 rotation was so easy it was mind nubbing and any one could do it. Dont look at Wheeling Thrust as a negative, look at it as a way to separate; the lancer (who will hit procs positionals never), the good (who will hit procs positionals some times), the great (who will hit procs positionals most times), and the amazing (who will hit procs positionals ALL the time)! The great/amazing can pull some insane numbers imo.

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Considering how much bosses move in HW dungeons I'm surprised MNKs haven't hung up their belts yet. Let alone our two random procing skills. I think the skills being random wouldn't be a problem if they just didn't have position requirements. Again the new skills are completely useless outside of a party senario. They do less damage than your lvl 1 weaponskill for crying out loud.

Leg sweep is a very handy skill, on a 20s cooldown, which allows you to stun your opponent into place, allowing you to hit the position you need for Wheeling Thrust/Fang & Claw. Same for SPD****.

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Originally Posted by Dervy

Leg sweep is a very handy skill, on a 20s cooldown, which allows you to stun your opponent into place, allowing you to hit the position you need for Wheeling Thrust/Fang & Claw. Same for DFD.

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I think you meant SSD.

OP is right: obtaining Wheeling Thrust at 58 breaks the expectation that you're getting stronger/learning new techniques/attuning with your job crystal soul. When you, the player, realize that the game just made your skill usage more complex but not more powerful, you feel slighted by the game and whoever designed the skill/quest.

Having both skills is manageable, or even fun to learn and execute, but the experience of receiving Wheeling Thrust at 58 is absolutely a punishing one for the player, as it's out of line with every other skill learned by not making you stronger.

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Originally Posted by Dervy

Leg sweep is a very handy skill, on a 20s cooldown, which allows you to stun your opponent into place, allowing you to hit the position you need for Wheeling Thrust/Fang & Claw. Same for DFD.

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Exactly - we have 2 stun skills (a real luxury that allows us to get those positions even during solo.

I would not mind them adding some differentiating traits to the attacks - just something that gives Wheeling Thrust and Fang and Claw some individuality form each other rather than just positional requirements. However I'm currently unsure what that would be.

The RNG factor of this makes balancing against two non-identical skills difficult, but I would rather not remove the RNG element of it. Perhaps a small HP refund on Wheeling Thrust or some sort of very minor buff that would be appreciated, but not bemoaned that it's random.

But over all I don't bemoan the desire to make these skills more individual. A low priority change to be sure.

How about changing the effect at level 56 such that you only have a 50% chance of getting the buff that unlocks the skill and if you don't get the buff, then BotD will just run out of time and fall off. Then at 58 you'll always get one buff or the other; you're now rewarded with always getting a means of extending BotD.

I haven't leveled drg, but I do find this mechanic pretty cool.

I think one of them should be a dot

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

I think one of them should be a dot

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That woulden't work as the proc on each attack is random. It means 50% of the time you're likely to clip your dot in hurt your DPS.

Unless that DoT lasted all of 12 seconds it really wouldn't be worthwhile.