Ninja seems a bit broken

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Originally Posted by Marionette

Yeah but greased lightning isn't only the attack speed, it also gives 9% (27% for three stacks) worth of damage, with twin snakes up it's also an additional 10%, then another 5% for fist of fire. so even with the poison boost, mnk still has 12% higher damage than nin statistically. Counting out dancing edge with dragon kicks boost. As well as Trick attack, which is up 1/6th of the time at best, and affects everyone not just the nin. Mnk is still outdoing it for raw damage. Ergo nin has some higher potency

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Did none of you read the context in which I was replying? Please read the whole comment and what was said after before quoting. I was pointing out that ninja gets 15% increased attack speed just like monk so their GCD should be roughly equal. In case you can't be bothered to actually read:

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Originally Posted by Izsha

You can't just compare potency like that. Mnk has much lower gcd.you are really devaluing mnk

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I made no other comments that ninja is imbalanced one way or another. In fact, I said I have no opinion on it yet because it's so early. I merely pointed out that his comment was incorrect in that monks have much lower GCDs. We do not, we have roughly the same because of Huton. Don't think that just because I'm a monk that I'm all up in arms about ninja. I'm more up in arms that a couple of you just cherry picking a comment, but can't be bothered to actually read the context in which was made...which was all on the same page.

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Originally Posted by Ricdeau

I made no other comments that ninja is imbalanced one way or another. In fact, I said I have no opinion on it yet because it's so early. I merely pointed out that his comment was incorrect in that monks have much lower GCDs. We do not, we have roughly the same because of Huton. Don't think that just because I'm a monk that I'm all up in arms about ninja. I'm more up in arms that a couple of you just cherry picking a comment, but can't be bothered to actually read the context in which was made...which was all on the same page.

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i can confirm this, i have both at about the same ilevel (1-2 ilevel of difference) and under huton, my gcd is the same than monk.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

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You do know that most of this community whines a lot for changes right? A lot of people will have a hard time swallowing the possibility that anything would beat mnk in dps (or should) even when pointed out with math that nin won't, only that it will come close (in an actual combat situation) if both are played optimally. If it continues people will complain that nin has to much utility for the damage they do, similar to the whole brd situation.

It would be ideal if dps were all close in numbers, but it doesn't happen often. Also, your comment about monk being rogue and ninja being monk makes little sense to me. Whatever floats your boat though, play what you like.

You cannot break ninja. NINJA BREAKS YOU!

Carry on.

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Originally Posted by Leonus

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I really want to say that there needs to be more time to really determine ninja's potential. Just from personal experiences that any of my lvl 50 groups with a ninja(s) in it goes significantly faster... I just had a titan HM downed before LB2 (which was the norm for the rabid nexus farm groups). The parsers I've looked at are also ideal circumstances for dps (T8 for example) with ninja pulling ahead. Granted its a small sample size.

I'm just not convinced at people saying ninja is difficult to play when Mudras/Ninjitsu aren't all that convoluted as they make it out to be, or that they are incredibly restrained in the event of messing up a huton/suiton (which falls into player skill and not necessarily fight mechanics, such as a monk losing GL3 cause of phasing).

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

I really want to say that there needs to be more time to really determine ninja's potential. Just from personal experiences that any of my lvl 50 groups with a ninja(s) in it goes significantly faster... I just had a titan HM downed before LB2 (which was the norm for the rabid nexus farm groups). The parsers I've looked at are also ideal circumstances for dps (T8 for example) with ninja pulling ahead. Granted its a small sample size.

I'm just not convinced at people saying ninja is difficult to play when Mudras/Ninjitsu aren't all that convoluted as they make it out to be, or that they are incredibly restrained in the event of messing up a huton/suiton (which falls into player skill and not necessarily fight mechanics, such as a monk losing GL3 cause of phasing).

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All these people saying its not difficult need to play it.

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Originally Posted by Ephier

All these people saying its not difficult need to play it.

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Everyone I know who went from monk have no trouble with managing their upkeep on DoTs and debuff...the latter being a non-issue with a warrior tank. Ninjitsus aren't that complicated when you realize all you need to do is not double-tap and get the last mudra correct. I'm certainly not having difficulty maintaining my debuffs so far or managing mudras.

And even then, difficulty hardly justifies having more dps/capability (if this ends up being the case, like I said it's a bit too soon to solidify it) because it's relative.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

Everyone I know who went from monk have no trouble with managing their upkeep on DoTs and debuff...the latter being a non-issue with a warrior tank. Ninjitsus aren't that complicated when you realize all you need to do is not double-tap and get the last mudra correct. I'm certainly not having difficulty maintaining my debuffs so far or managing mudras.

And even then, difficulty hardly justifies having more dps/capability (if this ends up being the case, like I said it's a bit too soon to solidify it) because it's relative.

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Where did I say difficulty = dps? I just said don't say its easy til you try it.

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Originally Posted by Ephier

All these people saying its not difficult need to play it.

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After having ninja 50 "For a while" (since last Thursday is a while now to some people, which is funny) I'd have to say playing ninja is not hard, at least for me. It's just a little easier to loose your place in your "rotation". Mainly because the job is so new.

before anyone says "you're playing it poorly if you think it's easy" I have been doing very well as ninja in primals/coil farms and I'm only i101 and doing better than most ninja's I've come across with higher ilvls. It may just be me, not everyone picks up on stuff at the same rate, some are faster and some are a bit slower.

Then again I don't think drg or mnk are difficult either. If anything, I think the people who played drg and know that rotation well have an easier time transitioning to nin.

I just don't want nin nerfed due to bias and stacking of the job, I think nin is at a good place in between Drgs burst damage and mnks sustained.

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Originally Posted by Ephier

Where did I say difficulty = dps? I just said don't say its easy til you try it.

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Yeah that was my interpretation of your post. It was really implied though considering your reply was to my statement (which was in that context of people saying difficulty = dps). My bad.