Been running Ridorana Lighthouse the whole week and...

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

I understand the different substats, however, the worst ilevel 360 gear (in terms of secondary stats) is good enough for you to clear savage content and get 370 gear. New and casual players were clearing savage (at lesat 5 and 6, dunno about 7) wearing 345-350 gear.

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This doesn't really change that some alliance loot is better than 370 pieces. If you're doing savage then you know yourself that in that environment you try to squeeze out as much as possible so min-maxing becomes the norm.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

This doesn't really change that some alliance loot is better than 370 pieces. If you're doing savage then you know yourself that in that environment you try to squeeze out as much as possible so min-maxing becomes the norm.

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Which alliance pieces are better than 370 piece? I know tanks like crafted accessories but not aware of any BiS pieces from Lighthouse. I could be wrong though, I'm very casual. I don't think the savage content in this game is tuned to players needing min-max. That has not been my experience.

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

I don't think the savage content in this game is tuned to players needing min-max.

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No it's not but if you can get better gear why wouldn't you? It makes it easier to kill bosses and if you're a speed running team you need as much as you can get.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

No it's not but if you can get better gear why wouldn't you? It makes it easier to kill bosses and if you're a speed running team you need as much as you can get.

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That's true but you mentioned that some alliance pieces are better than 370 pieces. I looked through various BiS worksheets and asked some good players who have cleared o8s and I have not been able to find anything or anyone that can tell me one alliances piece that is better than 370. Could you tell me what this gear is? I would be very curious to know, if this can help me out in clearing some content.

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

That's true but you mentioned that some alliance pieces are better than 370 pieces. I looked through various BiS worksheets and asked some good players who have cleared o8s and I have not been able to find anything or anyone that can tell me one alliances piece that is better than 370. Could you tell me what this gear is? I would be very curious to know, if this can help me out in clearing some content.

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I can only speak for myself. The alliance boots are better for me than the 370 omega boots. Marginally so I admit, but still better. I'm not at the stage in which I need all the extra hp you can get, but that may happen in the future so I have kept the 370 boots just in case. Right now I'm trying to get as much crit and det as possible.

edit: bear in mind there isn't a single way to gear any healer because this heavily depends on whether you're speed running or not, if you're the off-healer in a speed running team, if you're essentially a dps and act as a back-up healer, or if both healers on the team heal together. So in short, BiS isn't the same for everyone.

The way I see it folks, the crap gear will be outdated once the new Omega raid comes out. Heck it's already outdated now that you can upgrade mendacity gear to i370. Most of this raid's gear stats are meh compared to sigmascape gear, all it is, is just a slight ilvl increase and nothing more than that. Imagine if SE made All Greed a thing in 4 man content like dungeons....there are many players I'm sure that would be royally pissed off if SE made that change. Just go for the coin and upgrade your mendacity tome gear. It's gonna get outdated eventually too, like the majority of gear in this game, so it's nothing to worry over haha.

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Originally Posted by Usho

It's gonna get outdated eventually too, like the majority of gear in this game, so it's nothing to worry over haha.

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Higher ilvl doesn't automatically mean better gear unless the ilvl jump is huge. You only want to entirely concentrate on just higher ilvl if you want to max out your hp as much as possible. Very few raiding environments require the maximum possible hp, and most of us are not all-star players who can make even the worst gear produce great numbers. Most of us need to balance our secondaries with care. Nevermind how some classes suffer more than others if they don't have enough of certain stats.

Also whether gear of a specific ilvl is in or out of date is meaningless to someone wants gear for glam. Wanting glam gear isn't something that goes out of date.

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

And yes I have used a combination of crafted gear, sigmascape normal, and mendacity gear to gear my alt jobs.

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Good for you! It's always nice to have options. But as explained prior, not everyone has access to them so telling them to gear up via these other means doesn't address the problem.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Higher ilvl Also whether gear of a specific ilvl is in or out of date is meaningless to someone wants gear for glam.

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+1 on that, but also consider that just because higher tier gear exists doesn't mean you can access it. Many people are hurt by this change because they can't use Rabanastre to gear up to gain access to later content. Creation is noticeably easier to farm than Mendacity but it still takes time. This debate would've been completely different if they had used it only for the Lighthouse, but alas, they didn't.

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

I do raid on alt jobs including savage content and I have geared up alt jobs with the different methods I've mentioned- mendacity, crafted gear/weapons, sigma normal. To me this is just a game and I'm just gearing up for fun. I'm not going to cry if I lose a roll on a piece of gear.

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So if you already did that with the need option still there, why exactly is the all greed a better change? It seemingly changes nothing for you because if you use the other jobs in savage too and use all the other methods to gear up you seemingly dont really need the other gear in the raids that much. Which means that it should be a neutral change for you but a bad one for all those that need it to level up their main job because they dont have ex primals, savage or crafted stuff to gear up.

I am really confused by your view.

Also we are not whining..we are giving SE the feedback and show them how far people will use the greed roll and that it messed up the gear for others. Please stop seeing negative feedback as crying or something like that.

SE this is why you do not make blind changes, when it comes to topics such as this either side can justify their position and either one will be hard pressed to say one is wrong and the other is right. SE next time please think before you make a change, this rage feast would not be a thing if the change never saw the light of the day.

I worry about the the people coming after, trying to gear their main classes with pieces from there when the limit won't be around (to get the ilvl for 4.4 content.
now it's gonna be hell for them with greed only, seeing a piece they could use, only to be greeded on for seals or whatever purposes.)

and maybe it's to make it fair and allow everyone to play their main class while gearing alt, but I can't help and think, it's just to forces more runs to make old raid more relevant
(thankfully I often get my loots in one run and the gears are ugly...)

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Originally Posted by DatPotato

I worry about the the people coming after, trying to gear their main classes with pieces from there when the limit won't be around (to get the ilvl for 4.4 content.
now it's gonna be hell for them with greed only, seeing a piece they could use, only to be greeded on for seals or whatever purposes.)

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That's already the case for people trying to use Rabanastre as catch-up.

I rolled for tank gear once - I think I was on as my DPS. But I asked the tank in our group if he needed it first. He said he was good; otherwise, I would have passed.

Why can't people be decent in this game? Presumably, EVERYONE has had to deal with nonsense like this, where you go there for gear and someone wins it for an off-spec. Hell, for all we know SE rigs the RNG specifically for this use case. It's too easy for people to lose perspective that there are other people on the other side of those characters on the screen.

Doesn't matter anymore; the patch yesterday re-implemented the Need option.

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Originally Posted by Raldo

Doesn't matter anymore; the patch yesterday re-implemented the Need option.

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There's still the problem of the people that are decked out in 370+ gear rolling "need" just because they wanted the wardrobe graphic or just because the button is available. Game functionality is no substitute for being decent towards others.

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

There's still the problem of the people that are decked out in 370+ gear rolling "need" just because they wanted the wardrobe graphic or just because the button is available. Game functionality is no substitute for being decent towards others.

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What's wrong with rolling Need on stuff if you do need it though?
I mean yeah it sucks that they're just rolling for something that they're going to use for glamour but at the same time think about this, how many times do you think a player could have run the dungeon for a specific piece of loot? Last week I had to run Ridorana an ungodly amount of times to get the tank chest piece, it dropped twice and I couldn't get it both times because I was outrolled and while to be fair those people probably did need it to gear their alt tank classes, how is that fair to me, a tank main who's been running the raid multiple times a day on the role whose gear I'm rolling for and then having it be snatched away by someone who probably plays tank once a month and would most likely be perfectly content with any other piece of loot?

My definition of "Need" is obviously different than most people in this community. I only regularly play three classes (dark knight, red mage, and astrologian). I don't "need" to look pretty. Looking pretty doesn't help the group dynamic. I "need" to be able to heal better, tank better, or do more damage against mobs. My rolls reflect those goals. Yeah, I agree that it's messed up for people that "probably plays tank once a month", but I'd almost positive that I see the glamour crew far more than the super-casually-played-this-role people - hence why I didn't mention it earlier.

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

There's still the problem of the people that are decked out in 370+ gear rolling "need" just because they wanted the wardrobe graphic or just because the button is available. Game functionality is no substitute for being decent towards others.

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This. it happened to me on my last run, other healer in all 370, rolled need on the Healer Boots that I was looking at for an upgrade...and they didn't even heal/raise the entire Raid, unless you count a Healer LB3..during the first boss.

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

My definition of "Need" is obviously different than most people in this community. I only regularly play three classes (dark knight, red mage, and astrologian). I don't "need" to look pretty. Looking pretty doesn't help the group dynamic. I "need" to be able to heal better, tank better, or do more damage against mobs. My rolls reflect those goals. Yeah, I agree that it's messed up for people that "probably plays tank once a month", but I'd almost positive that I see the glamour crew far more than the super-casually-played-this-role people - hence why I didn't mention it earlier.

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Your definition of "Need" ultimately doesn't matter. The only person whose definition of need matters is the person rolling on the loot, because if they think they need it for whatever purpose they might be needing it for, then that is their right. Glamour, ilvl, GC

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Originally Posted by Saraphin

This. it happened to me on my last run, other healer in all 370, rolled need on the Healer Boots that I was looking at for an upgrade...and they didn't even heal/raise the entire Raid, unless you count a Healer LB3..during the first boss.

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So you lost the loot roll fairly? I don't see what the issue is.

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

I don't "need" to look pretty. Looking pretty doesn't help the group dynamic. I "need" to be able to heal better, tank better, or do more damage against mobs. My rolls reflect those goals.

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Does greeding on loot you can't even wear until the group's disbanded help the dynamic any more than needing on gear for glamour purposes?

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Originally Posted by Ameela

Does greeding on loot you can't even wear until the group's disbanded help the dynamic any more than needing on gear for glamour purposes?

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I'll rephrase to ensure I got your question. I believe you are asking that if one joined a group and a piece of gear dropped that was specific for off-spec, you'd like to know my thoughts if rolling for an off-spec is better than rolling for a glamour. Personally, if someone says "hey, can I get this for my off-spec", I'll pass. I damn near never care enough about glamours. To be honest, if no one else calls for it, I'd probably greed it for the vendor since I need gil far more than I need glamours. To be straightforward - if I wanted gear for a specific a class, I'd run it as that class.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Your definition of "Need" ultimately doesn't matter.

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Obviously. I'm not saying you have to think the same way - it's your $15/month - but it typically helps to put things into perspective.

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

Obviously. I'm not saying you have to think the same way - it's your $15/month - but it typically helps to put things into perspective.

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How does the purchase of a subscription come into this? I don't understand your response. I'm saying that everyone who can roll on a piece of gear chooses their own definition of what needing a piece of gear means. We now know what yours is when you press need, but that doesn't make it any more valid than someone who rolls need for GC seals or glamour, because to them these things may be far more important than ilvl or stats. In that regard, all you have done is shown YOUR perspective, which again, is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

You said that people in ilvl 370 rolling need for glamour is a "problem", and I think that is a very selfish and entitled mentality.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

So you lost the loot roll fairly? I don't see what the issue is.

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if a healer does the brunt of the healing, and someone's there in all savage gear...it'd be courteous to pass or ask if they need that. I did that in raids back during creator went into the 24 man stuff. my retainers aren't that important for me to need on something that's an upgrade for my co-healer.