Please let us *really* ride airships

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Originally Posted by Kiote

I believe what people are actually saying is they want immersion and having a way around immersion effectively kills immersion.

The fact is between Mounts and Airships for the times when you are not in a rush there will be no excuse for having 0 anima. The only people who I know of that run out of anima are people teleport absolutely everywhere. Anima is in the game to stop them from doing that. What then would be the point of putting in another way to instantly move what equates to hundreds of miles instantly. Its not like they can just pretend you didn't get there instantly by forcing the game time forward. It kills immersion just by being in the game and it kills any sense of realism in the world.

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You're missing something important. People who use Anima use it to get somewhere quickly. Key word being "quickly". Now say they add no instant option for Airships and keep Ferry as it is. You couldn't go anywhere on either option "quickly" it would take at least 10 minutes for the Ferry as that's how long the ride itself takes, not counting the walk there.

Because they're not going to want to wait 10 minutes or more to get somewhere, they use Anima. Right? So when they run out of Anima, what are they gonna do? They AREN'T going to suck it up all of a sudden and use the long option. Most people are going to get a teleport from someone else at the cost of Gil, typically. What does that sound like? An instant travel option on the airship. And not even, because the airship will likely be limited to main towns and a few other areas.

Having options that don't offer the same or even close to the convenience as the method currently being used means the people will keep using the old method. So then airships become useless for a good deal of people, because the number of folks using Anima who don't care about immersion is likely not small.

Once again, I go back to what I said earlier; people who are against freedom of choice seem more like they just want to have their way, and their way only, the other people be damned. Or rather, like they want it their way with "full immersion" and WANT the other guys who want instant travel to be screwed over, like they get their jollies out of it. That type of thinking is honestly quite petty.

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Originally Posted by AlphaDragoon

You're missing something important. People who use Anima use it to get somewhere quickly. Key word being "quickly". Now say they add no instant option for Airships and keep Ferry as it is. You couldn't go anywhere on either option "quickly" it would take at least 10 minutes for the Ferry as that's how long the ride itself takes, not counting the walk there.

Because they're not going to want to wait 10 minutes or more to get somewhere, they use Anima. Right? So when they run out of Anima, what are they gonna do? They AREN'T going to suck it up all of a sudden and use the long option. Most people are going to get a teleport from someone else at the cost of Gil, typically. What does that sound like? An instant travel option on the airship. And not even, because the airship will likely be limited to main towns and a few other areas.

Having options that don't offer the same or even close to the convenience as the method currently being used means the people will keep using the old method. So then airships become useless for a good deal of people, because the number of folks using Anima who don't care about immersion is likely not small.

Once again, I go back to what I said earlier; people who are against freedom of choice seem more like they just want to have their way, and their way only, the other people be damned. Or rather, like they want it their way with "full immersion" and WANT the other guys who want instant travel to be screwed over, like they get their jollies out of it. That type of thinking is honestly quite petty.

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So again I ask, why invest dev time in making a airship no one will use? I say scrap airships and make a warp NPC avaliable between cities and put the same devs on making actual content that people want to experience.

Cause judging from this thread all the majority of players seems to want just that, an instant warp, while we're at it, scrap chocobos as well and just make anima unlimited, this is what you all want isn't it?

Hosestly if this is whats coming of all the waiting for airships etc, its a huge waste of time, like this I would have been much happier with the above suggestion and a bunch of new NMs, dungeons and whatnot instead.

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Originally Posted by AlphaDragoon

You're missing something important. People who use Anima use it to get somewhere quickly. Key word being "quickly". Now say they add no instant option for Airships and keep Ferry as it is. You couldn't go anywhere on either option "quickly" it would take at least 10 minutes for the Ferry as that's how long the ride itself takes, not counting the walk there.

Because they're not going to want to wait 10 minutes or more to get somewhere, they use Anima. Right? So when they run out of Anima, what are they gonna do? They AREN'T going to suck it up all of a sudden and use the long option. Most people are going to get a teleport from someone else at the cost of Gil, typically. What does that sound like? An instant travel option on the airship. And not even, because the airship will likely be limited to main towns and a few other areas.

Having options that don't offer the same or even close to the convenience as the method currently being used means the people will keep using the old method. So then airships become useless for a good deal of people, because the number of folks using Anima who don't care about immersion is likely not small.

Once again, I go back to what I said earlier; people who are against freedom of choice seem more like they just want to have their way, and their way only, the other people be damned. Or rather, like they want it their way with "full immersion" and WANT the other guys who want instant travel to be screwed over, like they get their jollies out of it. That type of thinking is honestly quite petty.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

The argument that instant is necessarily because walking takes too much time is not really valid. Walking takes 20 mins a normal airship ride would take 3-5 mins. That is already a massive short cut. There is not need to bring it down to instant because you already have anima for that.

Chocobos will reduce anima use by eliminating the need to port to any camp level 30 and under.
A regular airship would reduce anima use by eliminating the need to port from town to town.
Return already allows you to get to the place you use most without using anima

Those three things alone will cut your anima use in half. There is no need to make airships instant because you will have the anima to spare from now on if you desperately need to get to a town instantly.

I would also like to add that the airships in FFXI only took so long because you actually had to wait for them to arrive and take off. That problem is eliminated by simply making airship constantly run rather than once every 12 minutes.

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/10characters

I still dont see why.... 5 min airship ride, if you want to get around that, use anima did not end this conversation...... -.-

I believe Kiote summed up the best arguments for and against instant air travel. We, as a community, need to all take a step back and examine the topic from a neutral bias. Put aside the desire for immersion. Cast away the desire to get there now. What is functionally best for the game? Which argument quoted above holds more water when all other biases are eliminated? Then, with personal biases in place, is there a compromise that a majority of the community would be ok with?

Personally, I hated it when I missed an airship in FFXI, then had to sit waiting for 10 minutes for the next one. In fact, I think what bothered me the most about FFXI airships was not the time in the air, but the time standing on the dock waiting for another one to arrive. So, instant-travel was initially an attractive option.

But, thinking about it longer, I decided that I would be fine if air travel didn't take any longer than 3-5 minutes port-to-port, including dock time. (Limsa -> Gridania would obviously take a little longer than Ul'dah -> Gridania) Having multiple airships in service would cut the wait time even further. For example, if Limsa -> Gridania took 5 minutes one-way, a single airship would take 10 minutes to complete a round trip. Having 2 airships running opposite each other would cut wait time down to 5 minutes, since once one leaves, another is headed back at the same time. Up that to 4 airships (2 pairs running staggered schedules) and now the wait time for another boat drops to 2 1/2 minutes. Something to think about.

I have an idea for airships for the fast vrs slow rides.
express trip- get me there as fast as possible 2k gil
scenic rout- 500gil
i actually would skip all the time and i don't wanna pay 2k so this plan sucks for me but would help instill that sense of reality of "how did i get here so quick", oh i payed extra for the express trip.

Not reading through 21 pages of Chaff..

But,
Personally I'd like to see some Female NPC's giving an In-Flight Safety Demonstration as part of the cut-scene.
Imagine, a Hume and Elezean female in Coatees, and Linen Bottoms with the wedge caps.
For an added laugh, a Male Miqo'te as the token Male Flight Attendant of "Questionable Orientation"

@Blaise that is a good way to put it in perspective.

I personally love the insta-travel option and having both would be great. My issue with making the trip mandatory is that they will make it have short travel time to accommodate those that want to reach their destination in time. 2 minutes is great travel time but for those (myself included) that want grand airship battles, 2 minutes is a terrible time limit.

If you allow insta-porting, the people that want to reach their destination get where they want to go quickly, without any danger, while the devs are given the opportunity to give the "long version" airship rides more focus. What about a nice, scenic 15 minute ride, and if your ship gets attacked, it becomes an exciting, involving battle? I'm sure everyone can appreciate that.

I'd like to see something like this happen and why I stick with the stance that being able to have options to how we play is nothing but good.

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Originally Posted by AlphaDragoon

You're missing something important. People who use Anima use it to get somewhere quickly. Key word being "quickly". Now say they add no instant option for Airships and keep Ferry as it is. You couldn't go anywhere on either option "quickly" it would take at least 10 minutes for the Ferry as that's how long the ride itself takes, not counting the walk there.

Because they're not going to want to wait 10 minutes or more to get somewhere, they use Anima. Right? So when they run out of Anima, what are they gonna do? They AREN'T going to suck it up all of a sudden and use the long option. Most people are going to get a teleport from someone else at the cost of Gil, typically. What does that sound like? An instant travel option on the airship. And not even, because the airship will likely be limited to main towns and a few other areas.

Having options that don't offer the same or even close to the convenience as the method currently being used means the people will keep using the old method. So then airships become useless for a good deal of people, because the number of folks using Anima who don't care about immersion is likely not small.

Once again, I go back to what I said earlier; people who are against freedom of choice seem more like they just want to have their way, and their way only, the other people be damned. Or rather, like they want it their way with "full immersion" and WANT the other guys who want instant travel to be screwed over, like they get their jollies out of it. That type of thinking is honestly quite petty.

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Not to mention that opens a market for RMT.

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Originally Posted by Choyi

So again I ask, why invest dev time in making a airship no one will use?Because people like you will use it. I will too, when I want to. I say scrap airshipsFinal Fantasy thematic heresy. That's why their being implemented as is in the first place. and make a warp NPC avaliable between citiesWhich takes more resources than the already implemented "skip cutscene" mechanism. and put the same devs on making actual content that people want to experience.Different teams, and people do want to experience the airship. People like you and me, when I have time.

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Cause judging from this thread all the majority of players seems to want just that, an instant warpYes! I don't mind having a risk reward mechanic added onto it either. That's gameplay., while we're at it, scrap chocobosAgain, Final Fantasy heresy and you're completely forgetting why people are calling for these things in the first place. When they implement the "My Little Chocobo" feature should they also do away with chocobo rentals? as well and just make anima unlimited, this is what you all want isn't it?Nope. I've seen people suggest they pull out the anima costs but I don't agree with it. I also don't see anyone here claiming that either. This is the most egregious slippery slope I've seen.

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Hosestly if this is whats coming of all the waiting for airships etc, its a huge waste of time,Nope, this is just the beginning. Hold on to your chocobos. The devs have more planned for airships. Let people have their options. like this I would have been much happier with the above suggestion and a bunch of new NMs, dungeons and whatnot insteadDifferent teams man. Just because you say it a lot doesn't make it true..

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I have yet to see a convincing argument that abolishes the option to choose whether or not to view/experience the airship ride.

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Originally Posted by BlaiseLallaise

I believe Kiote summed up the best arguments for and against instant air travel. We, as a community, need to all take a step back and examine the topic from a neutral bias. Put aside the desire for immersion. Cast away the desire to get there now. What is functionally best for the game? Which argument quoted above holds more water when all other biases are eliminated? Then, with personal biases in place, is there a compromise that a majority of the community would be ok with?

Personally, I hated it when I missed an airship in FFXI, then had to sit waiting for 10 minutes for the next one. In fact, I think what bothered me the most about FFXI airships was not the time in the air, but the time standing on the dock waiting for another one to arrive. So, instant-travel was initially an attractive option.

But, thinking about it longer, I decided that I would be fine if air travel didn't take any longer than 3-5 minutes port-to-port, including dock time. (Limsa -> Gridania would obviously take a little longer than Ul'dah -> Gridania) Having multiple airships in service would cut the wait time even further. For example, if Limsa -> Gridania took 5 minutes one-way, a single airship would take 10 minutes to complete a round trip. Having 2 airships running opposite each other would cut wait time down to 5 minutes, since once one leaves, another is headed back at the same time. Up that to 4 airships (2 pairs running staggered schedules) and now the wait time for another boat drops to 2 1/2 minutes. Something to think about.

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The best option is having it remain an option.

That's more than a compromise, that's everyone wins.

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Originally Posted by Estellios

@Blaise that is a good way to put it in perspective.

I personally love the insta-travel option and having both would be great. My issue with making the trip mandatory is that they will make it have short travel time to accommodate those that want to reach their destination in time. 2 minutes is great travel time but for those (myself included) that want grand airship battles, 2 minutes is a terrible time limit.

If you allow insta-porting, the people that want to reach their destination get where they want to go quickly, without any danger, while the devs are given the opportunity to give the "long version" airship rides more focus. What about a nice, scenic 15 minute ride, and if your ship gets attacked, it becomes an exciting, involving battle? I'm sure everyone can appreciate that.

I'd like to see something like this happen and why I stick with the stance that being able to have options to how we play is nothing but good.

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This also provides more worthwhile content that people might actually go out of their way to explore, while still leaving the option open. This is substantially more supported than, "You have the choice to AFK."

How about instead of a more expensive option vs. least expensive option we have a war ship/cruiser ship option vs. express option.

1.) Include an express option. Instant teleport, gil fee is levied and non refundable.

2.) If you just want to enjoy the breathtaking beauty of flying over Eorzea, choose the cruiser ship. Doing tasks for the crew members will cover your airfare if you so choose. Tasks could be themed toward disciples of the hand such as:

• attending the kitchen (CUL)
• controlling the furnace (ALC)
• repairing the sheets for the bedrooms (WVR)
• creating fasteners for emergency parachutes (TAN)
• fixing the delicate instruments for the airship so that it stays on course (GLD)
• repairing the furnace (ARM/BSM)
• repair or patch the hull/deck (CRP)

You could add scenarios to include the DoLs too:

• Collect high quality catches from the chef's holding tank stored beneath the deck. (FSH)
• Add/tend the furnace by adding coal/crystals to the furnace/engine(MNR)
• Arrange a set a flowers for a VIP passenger that the crew couldn't get around to doing (BOT)

This could be an ample opportunity to include different game mechanics for the DoL's rather than a hot/cold game.


3.) If you choose the war ship, with a party of two or more. You're guaranteed to fight some Garleans/Air pirates and if you're successful you're airfare will be waived and you'll even get a bonus of some kind if you're successful in your mission. You could even include a 'losing' scenario where your ship crashes or you are taken aboard their ship and are forced to escape, slightly inconveniencing you by not arriving at your destination directly. It's an aggressive mission from the outset so there's a good chance you'll get the drop on them but sometimes they can get the drop on you, adding a pre-emptive attack advantage/disadvantage to the whole thing. You could even make this instanced content and just get crazy with how dynamic you get with it. You could involve multiple outcome scenarios. Different drops. Could make it really difficult or passably easy depending on developer choice.

I can't see how this does not meet everyone's needs while simultaneously adding meaningful content to the game.

Please don't force me to AFK sammich on the airship.