If you're unhappy with this game then unsub... forever.

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Originally Posted by Koros

Also, a lot of people gravitate to jobs because of the visuals. How do you disentangle the % of players picking up a job because of the visuals vs. them picking it up because of the simplicity? A lot of players play DNC, WHM, and SMN purely because of the class fantasy, not because of the mechanics.

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True. DNC is one of those jobs that someone is going to play just because they dance.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

True. DNC is one of those jobs that someone is going to play just because they dance.

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I just like the job myself, after whm its what I am most on. I couldnt give a rats behind if its meta or not, I just like it

The devs are treating the playerbase like a pimp treats a hoe.

People gravitate towards simple jobs because square makes them stupidly overpowered relative to their complexity

Why play yugioh on Astro and get RSI when WHM does 99.9% of the same job and you can macro it’s entire rotation onto 3 buttons

Same as SMN, BLM is the only complex job left in the game and RDM is in the toilet, what incentive have they provided you to not play SMN

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

It will be interesting to see how SAM is designed for Dawntrail. I suspect Kaiten will be back along with some additional button bloat since the impression left is that SAM players like a lot of unnecessary buttons to press.

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Not really.
- Right now you use every skill when it's ready (if not paired with a DRG) <-- need some adjustment
- SAM needs situational abilities
- SAM needs the merging of some single/multi target version abilities.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

People gravitate towards simple jobs because square makes them stupidly overpowered relative to their complexity

Why play yugioh on Astro and get RSI when WHM does 99.9% of the same job and you can macro it’s entire rotation onto 3 buttons

Same as SMN, BLM is the only complex job left in the game and RDM is in the toilet, what incentive have they provided you to not play SMN

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I really don’t find blm hard at all. Bard is harder to play iMO.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I really don’t find blm hard at all. Bard is harder to play iMO.

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Bard is easy too. We all know Fisher is the hardest job in the game. Having to go around looking for fishing spots. Going underwater to hunt them with spears. Fighting off random bears and retainers trying to mug you for your catch... >.>

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Originally Posted by Koros

So why do the jobs have to be gutted beyond their SB designs? If newer players are neutral and veterans are unhappy then the net result is unhappy.

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I wasn't trying to pass judgement on the state of job design overall or state that they need to be gutted. I agree some improvement would be good, assuming it doesn't involve button bloat. There's a point where too many different actions is worse than not enough.

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Originally Posted by Koros

No, people gravitate to meta jobs. WAR, DNC, and SMN are all meta for casual prog because of WAR's Holmgang for PF invuln strats, SMN for raise and the high mobility, and DNC+SAM is one of the easiest way to boost your rDPS. DRK is actually the most played tank in JP, along with SAM being the most played DPS. A lot of people don't actually like playing DRK though. These statistics don't show anything other than what's meta.

Nerf WAR's self-sustain and you'll see WAR becoming far less popular.

Also, a lot of people gravitate to jobs because of the visuals. How do you disentangle the % of players picking up a job because of the visuals vs. them picking it up because of the simplicity? A lot of players play DNC, WHM, and SMN purely because of the class fantasy, not because of the mechanics.

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It's raiders who use PF that gravitate toward meta jobs, not casual players in general. Those who don't raid are free to play whatever they want. Those who have a static are also generally free to use what they want as long as the roles needed get filled.

Those who rely on PF feel constricted by what the raiding community has decided is meta because if their job isn't part of the meta, it's harder to get accepted into a group. That could be solved by starting the PF but a lot of players prefer to avoid anything that smacks of responsibility, such as being a party leader.

It will always be a problem in MMOs until such time as player communities decide metas aren't accomplishing anything, and I doubt that will ever happen.

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

Not really.
- Right now you use every skill when it's ready (if not paired with a DRG) <-- need some adjustment
- SAM needs situational abilities
- SAM needs the merging of some single/multi target version abilities.

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Oh, I'm not saying that SAM players really do like button bloat, only that the uproar over Kaiten leaves that impression. It's hard to say how the developers will interpret it.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Bard is easy too. We all know Fisher is the hardest job in the game. Having to go around looking for fishing spots. Going underwater to hunt them with spears. Fighting off random bears and retainers trying to mug you for your catch... >.>

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Your roof nails are more in danger from my retainers than your fish.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I really don’t find blm hard at all. Bard is harder to play iMO.

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I mean, all jobs are easy in pre-Extreme content.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

Is that why there are several threads of pure negativity about how bad this game is every single day on the forums?

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Because if people take their time to criticise a game they are actively playing, they are doing it because THEY CARE. They like some aspects of it, but think that others could use improvement. Wanting something you enjoy to be the best it possibly can be isn't that outlandish of a concept, surely?

The people who just hate everything aren't taking the time to post their criticism. They just leave.