Many Savage PFs are barring PLD and WAR, anyone know what's going on?

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

Mainly a rotation haul on Paladin, damage buffing to a GNB won't suddenly make it amazing, GNB/DRK will still be picked over with their capability to sync raid buffs, while Paladin has to essentially skip 2 Atonements (which is a DPS loss) to stay synced, and lacks burst capability compared to SHBs Pld.

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Getting rid of PLD’s 62 second rotation I agree would be good because then it can keep its magic phase synced to raid buffs but overall it also just needs a DPS buff because even forcing it to correctly sync by changing its rotation would still leave it last in damage

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

WAR is underpowered defensively in raids, dark missionary and heart of light are better than divine veil and shake it off because they last the entire duration, not just till the shield cracks, on top of that in situations like the DOT busters this tier while bloodwhetting gives self healing it’s actual upfront mitigation is weaker than HOC and HS (and DRK has two extra defensives) and the self heal cannot compensate for the higher DOT potency

Bloodwhetting should be changed to have a higher upfront mitigation but only activate healing once per GCD, not once per enemy per GCD, that would fix the “healers aren’t needed when WAR is the tank” in dungeons, and buff WAR’d raid survivability

Both PLD and WAR need a damage buff, PLD should be first in damage not last, it has the most complex tank rotation

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Absolutely horrible takes; the only thing I can agree with is that both PLD and WAR do need damage buffs.

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Originally Posted by Argyle_Darkheart

Absolutely horrible takes; the only thing I can agree with is that both PLD and WAR do need damage buffs.

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And why are they such horrible takes, WAR and PLD are losing out in damage and raid survivability currently (WAR less so on raid survivability but still so due to the DOT busters)

WAR is also stupidly broken in dungeons

WAR is not losing out when it comes to raid survivability; that's a completely out of touch opinion. The only valid point of contention on that front is whether Dark Missionary/Heart of Light are better than Shake it Off, but that really just comes down to what they're being used for.

The Holy Sheltron DoT issue is overblown, especially when the option exists to swap short CDs with your co-tank. Granted, I don't expect randoms in PFs to have the presence of mind to realize this is an option, let alone utilize it. All that said, there's no good reason, balance-wise, that Blocking shouldn't factor into the DoT calculation.

PLD is in bad shape, but defensively it's fine outside of having no counterpart to Thrill of Battle, Dark Mind, or Camouflage. If a fight like DSR P6 didn't exist, I would maybe try to argue that even that's not that big of a big deal, but it does.

People actually out here pretending WAR has bad survivability, now I've seen everything.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

People actually out here pretending WAR has bad survivability, now I've seen everything.

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WAR’s survivability on the DOT busters isn’t great compared to GNB and DRK because bloodwhetting’s upfront mitigation isn’t great and the healing doesn’t compensate for the DOT damage that does more because bloodwhettings mitigation is lower, same as shake it off being weaker than dark missionary and heart of light

Other than that WAR is great on survivability, but the only risk tanks ever face is busters and right now WAR on the DOT busters isn’t going fantastic, PLD is the big problem

To be frank War is pretty terrible handling P8S P2 busters, they hit like a freight train and Drk takes around 70k by it using TBN, Dark Mind, Oblation and Rampart.

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

To be frank War is pretty terrible handling P8S P2 busters, they hit like a freight train and Drk takes around 70k by it using TBN, Dark Mind, Oblation and Rampart.

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What? WAR Holmgangs the 1st and 4th busters (and the following autos) and kitchen sinks the other two; they're trivial.

Still pretty terrible, 4th is late in the fight. I'm pretty much dumping War now for raids, Drk/Gnb are honestly too good in this Xpac and Warrior only has Holmgang left to make it "useful". War only comes closer on GNB with a very restrictive comp and that's awful.

How is absolutely trivializing the busters "still pretty terrible?"

You can just say WAR has bad DPS; we already know.