Calling players bad because they're slow at improving...

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Originally Posted by ZeraSkiratea

that fails to account for the fact, that people DO indeed like to go into things blind at times, even savage+ content.
I dont like knowing an encounter beforehand so that the only thing that matters is strict memorisation and execution, i like to have to think at least for the first few things what the mechanic right now wants from me quickly.
If you dont want people who may or may not be blind to the encounter, make a party finder, specificy that you must have watched a guide, and do content that way.
Instead of assuming people in the DF will do that

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This exact thing can be said for wanting a blind run.

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Originally Posted by Ativan

You must think you are very hilarious. But no, I am simply responding to this disappointing video made by Zepla

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You made some good points in your post, but none of those bad reasons to call someone bad met the criteria that Zepla presented. Here are some highlights from the video that I can recall off the top of my head (I watched it last week):

• There's a difference between playing badly and being a bad player. Even the best players play badly from time to time.
• Playing badly doesn't make you a bad player, as long as you're willing to improve. Playing badly is the first step towards playing well.
• If you find yourself having to complete every leveling trial on "Very Easy" difficulty while you're leveling, then you're probably playing badly.
• Bad players are the ones who double down on their mistakes, refusing to acknowledge or correct them.

Nowhere in her video did she suggest that anyone should be calling anyone else a bad player for simply failing mechanics or because they don't want to engage in Savage/Extreme/Ultimate content.

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Originally Posted by Ativan

... is supremely unconstructive, pointless, and only exacerbates the issue. Telling someone that they're bad when you're so impatient as to ridicule them after they fail to the same mechanic three times; telling someone they're bad when they declined your unwarranted, unasked for, and unprompted "feedback"; telling someone they're bad when they just want a stress-free, casual experience of this game - these are all behaviors that are rotten to the core. They reek of elitism and ableism, and belie a hollow core of morality, in which any shred of empathy can not be found.

It is therefore beyond disappointing to see community leaders and content creators chide those who are slower at improving as being 'bad'.

First of all, not everyone is able to learn at the same speed as you. While it might take you only two or three tries to comprehend a mechanic, someone might take fifty times - and that's OK. This game is not a job and there is no metric for players to meet. We are here to play the game, not to fulfill some arbitrary performance metric like in an Amazon warehouse.

Second of all, people can and do forget mechanics over time that they have not seen frequently. Not everyone no-lifes this game for 10 hours a day to instantly recognize every mechanic that they see. Do not assume that people are locked in the basement as you are to be able to perfectly memorize every single mechanic and rotation in the game.

Third of all, it is the height of ableism to assume that everyone playing this game can dodge AoEs perfectly all the time. People do and will age, and reaction times do grow slower. Complaining and insulting a player as "bad" because they stood in an AoE can and often are instances of ableism and ageism, by indirectly insulting their decreased reaction speed as they grow older.

What makes a "bad player" is not failure at improving. What makes a "bad player" are those that go around personally harassing, insulting, and picking fights with other players because of some self-conceived notion of good and bad. Get off your high horse and let players enjoy the game the way they want to.

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This reminds me soooooooooooooo much of WoW. We will get a huge chance to see who is toxic and who is helpful by the answers on this thread.

/Grabs popcorn and sits back.

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Originally Posted by GeminiReed

I can watch videos all day and they won't do me a lick of good until I've seen the fight firsthand. My static is aware of this so we our first night is a series of blind pulls and then pull up some vids if a mechanic has us stumped. Having that context helps enormously since we can filter out the flashy VFX from the true mechanics.

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*nods* There is no right way to approach content. Your way is just as valid as mine. The point is, we are both trying to be good players.

Honestly, I seldom totally understand the mechanics after viewing a video. All they do is give me a heads up on what to expect when I dive in. It's only after I see things in action do the mechanics click.

Well I guess I am bad. A random lancer in sastasha told me so tonight.

Me on my baby Conjurer. Still very much learning to heal. Him pulling everything in sight and not waiting for the tank. SO when he ran into the room with all the pirates WAY ahead of everyone. I um...well I stayed back with the tank and let him reap the rewards of his actions. Lets just say what he had to say to me was Colorful. ;)

I like be a fail in game and a success IRL. :p i don't collect trophies, and will never be top 5 FF14 ULTIMATE clearer....so what? Behind someone that its not 100% dedicated to gaming is a successful friend, parents, and professionals.

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Originally Posted by Fellgon

I like be a fail in game and a success IRL. :p i don't collect trophies, and will never be top 5 FF14 ULTIMATE clearer....so what? Behind someone that its not 100% dedicated to gaming is a successful friend, parents, and professionals.

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So you “like be a fail in game”. Don’t suppose you have any consideration for the others you play with? Considering this is a multiplayer game.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

So you “like be a fail in game”. Don’t suppose you have any consideration for the others you play with? Considering this is a multiplayer game.

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i have consideration for those who play this game sure! i dont have consideration for competition, last time i tryed compete, i lost i felt miserable. I don't have anything against who play.

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Originally Posted by Fellgon

i have consideration for those who play this game sure! i dont have consideration for competition, last time i tryed compete, i lost i felt miserable. I don't have anything against who play.

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It’s not about competing. It’s about Tryin to do well. You tried to show pride in failure. I questioned that. The general player base doesn’t expect raid level dps. But there’s definitely players out there who perform horribly and don’t care. I’ve seen a black mage in lvl 80 dungeons casting only blizzard 3 and thunder 4. That’s not even making a solid attempt

Its not pride exactly. Sure players need improve, i mean...i had past bad experience with competition, cause the winners (not all) do bully to those whos not Hight as them, but i understand that we all need improve enough to do well in game and anything...its just...not my cup of tea. But if you need get better in game, sure its need to be done. Competition reminds me a few traumas i had, but I'm not saying if you like do it, you shouldn't. Its just....i cant expect a beginner perform with same expertise as those who perform for much more time. i tried compete swimming, tried compete in marital arts....failed every competition i had, wasn't a good experience, so i stopped doing it.

the need to get better its a must, show off...its not.