Yoshi's post about client server and cheating

Are there people actually defending SE in the server lag?! seriously???

This was my main issues that I mentioned in the players poll. And it was one of the main issues with most game reviews. The game is SLOW to respond. PERIOD. Go synth if you want to try something... In EVERY click there is delay... Open a menu or go sell your stuff, it's a dreadful experience.

They have to fix that, there is no excuse. Japanese servers or not. I as a player don't care about where you put your servers, I want to play a good and responsive game... Seriously, the fighting will be 10 times better if this was fixed. But ppl still seem to want to defend SE on this regard. I just don't....

We are not talking about "security". We are talking about the client having to wait for every input to be validated.
Example: you try to sell an item, the client sends the request to the server, wait, wait wait, the server sends it's okay and you see the item sold
While the client is waiting it doesn't allow any other item sold.
How it would be way better:
you try to sell an item, the item is gone right away, client sends the request to the server, on error the client gets a message and the action is undone (this should rarely happen as the client obviously also checks for untradeable, inventory space, etc.)
And of course you can sell another item right away without waiting.
I'm still wondering though why the movement delay is also ~3 seconds which is pretty annoying for Ifrit but by just spamming screenshot a bit people can walk through walls...

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Originally Posted by Majidah

FFXI was instant and didn't have hackers. I don't get it.

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There were tons of exploits in XI due to Client side checks. They never spread very wide because the STFU was pretty good at spotting the exploiters and sending them to oblivion. It's kind of hard to be "Incognito" in a MMO where a few hundred people are around any popular content at a givin time. Warping through walls was obviously a bit tricky to do unnoticed.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

would it shock you to know XI had loads of client checks....and the most popular type of hack used was wall hacking,

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And oh look you can wallhack the crap out of XIV, sometimes you dont even need apps or memory editing, just low spec PC and you get flung out of bounds lol Then it takes about 10 seconds before it DC's you.

You know what else is worse? That DC does nothing. People who have pos hacked into the dungeons before release and over to Ishgard all relog in to be at the same position they was before, and can get DC's about 1000 times, theres no notification to SE, theres no auto fix such as porting you back onto land (like /stuck commands in other mmos), its just pointless checks being done on SE's end.

There are plenty of these pointless checks and validations.

Ok, I am a huge advocate of SE getting the server/client time reduced, but this thread seems to be extremely ill-informed. As Yoshi-P said in an older post, ALL MMO's work this way such as WoW, Rift, etc. The difference is that those other mmos you really don't notice it, but it is there.

The question is, will 2.0 make FFXIV's response time as quick as WoW's (which still has server checks to prevent cheating). If so, we're fine. As long as it's a lot better than what we have now, I'll be very happy along with all the really nice stuff they keep talking about adding.

But you can't tell SE to make everything on the client side only... no game does that, and complaining for THAT answer to the problem is unfair and incorrect. Ask SE if they can make their server communicate and check as fast as the competition... that's what you are after.

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Originally Posted by Riaayo

Ok, I am a huge advocate of SE getting the server/client time reduced, but this thread seems to be extremely ill-informed. As Yoshi-P said in an older post, ALL MMO's work this way such as WoW, Rift, etc. The difference is that those other mmos you really don't notice it, but it is there.

The question is, will 2.0 make FFXIV's response time as quick as WoW's (which still has server checks to prevent cheating). If so, we're fine. As long as it's a lot better than what we have now, I'll be very happy along with all the really nice stuff they keep talking about adding.

But you can't tell SE to make everything on the client side only... no game does that, and complaining for THAT answer to the problem is unfair and incorrect. Ask SE if they can make their server communicate and check as fast as the competition... that's what you are after.

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While you are right that other games might suffer similar round times. Other games do not wait for server response or have algorythms which predict player behaviour such as movement (like aion did, hence the rubber banding cause of bad predictions) and other things. It is not about how fast the server responds, that is an illusion given by predicting stuff client side and then cross checking with the server in certain intervals.

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Originally Posted by Coldfire

There have been issues with "bots" using a modded client to attack targets from anywhere, there are hacks to detect exact locations of gathering spots, etc.
I've played this since beta and met some hackers myself(where it was pretty obvious). It is currently not an issue, yes, but only 'cause the game is pretty dead right now. It's the same with the RMT. There is a lack of customers so their numbers decline.

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I'm suddenly reminded of the "falling through the floor" glitch with how you say it.
Except that wasn't a hack, it was an exploitable glitch that could be done without altering the client in any way or using any other programs other than FFXIV.
There was also the thing where you could glitch through walls which was basically the same thing as falling through the floor.

I remember seeing people doing that as far back as beta and people always called them "hackers" and saying they modded their clients. But I ended up running into one who decided to tell me how it was done and it involved no "hacks" at all.

The people who used this and then botted on the other hand were basically just botting. The bot didn't cause them to be able to attack from anywhere, it just attacked after they were put into place.

If there is a glitch there is also the possibility to make a hack for it to make it easier or better to use. And I'm 100% sure that there are real hacks 'cause I know how to use google unlike some other individuals on this forum <.<

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To goal is to minimise the hacks to a point where they dont break the game. (like in xi)

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>hacks that dont break the game
>xi

Pick one.

Seriously XI is one of the worst AAA MMO when it comes to cheating. You can :

- Speedhack freely
- See things that aren't normally visible (like use ??? before they spawn)
- Position hack at will on both legit and non-legit locations (legit = what can be reached by normal means)
- You can do gathering while being in a non-legit location (i.e. Mine while being underground)
- You can automate movement in a way that a character can chain a repeatable quest that requires to go from A to B. While A>B is a long way for the normal player, for a cheater it takes less than a minute to complete the quest. Reward is often crap, yet since you chain it 24/7 (with several accounts as well), you can make high profit.
- Fish botting...
- Tons of things I forget (lot of possible exploits etc.)

I won't even mention hacks that just enable you to be better than others like claim bots, and all... Game balance on XI was ruined because of hacks. Doesn't mean you cannot enjoy game, don't get me wrong. Yet its one of the worst possible example.

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Originally Posted by Coldfire

If there is a glitch there is also the possibility to make a hack for it to make it easier or better to use. And I'm 100% sure that there are real hacks 'cause I know how to use google unlike some other individuals on this forum <.<

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The glitch involved pressing 2 buttons... There were other requirements (on where you could use it) but it was extremely easy.
I remember a certain LS on Trabia exploiting it to get all of their clears in Darkhold because they couldn't do it legitimately =/

I know there are hacks though. I remember seeing the speed hack back in beta but I never looked into it.