The premium app is what finally made me unsub.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

As I've stated in other threads, just because you don't LIKE you choices, does NOT mean you don't have a choice.

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Actually it does mean you have no choice. That app is coming out no matter what. Are you denying that? I promise you OP has no bearing on whether it's getting released. He's perfectly entitled to not want it to affect the game and quit as a result, but that app is gonna be there whether he likes it or not. Does he have to use the app is an irrelevant question as it's existence and implementation is the root.

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Originally Posted by MilanFrozen

Actually it does mean you have no choice. *snip* Does he have to use the app is an irrelevant question as it's existence and implementation is the root.

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Your statement is so flawed it's laughable. It's the equivalent of saying Nuclear Bombs exist, so we HAVE to use them, so everyone MUST kill themselves.

1) The existence of the app has zero effect on you game experience as evidenced by the fact that a) the game has existed for over 5 years without it and b) NOTHING currently in the game is being removed and relegated to the app only.
2) You have a CHOICE whether or not to use the app, hell you have a CHOICE whether or not to even download the app.
3) IT DOESN'T EVEN EXIST YET!

You still have choices to make, maybe none that you like, but they are still choices. That is undisputable.


I want to add that I don't necessarily agree with the concepts presented for the app and have not personally decided whether or not I will use it. But people going all END OF THE WORLD over something they have a choice on, is asinine.

I dunno, sounds like a whole lot of nothing. Its not a P2W model thus far. The game offers you mounts pretty generously, and shop mounts are cosmetic mostly. Accessing and taking care of retainers remotely, while can be nifty, isnt exactly game breakingly huge. If people want that feature, why not? Those who dont have it wont be 'left in the dust'. Furthermore, has it ever struck the OP that maybe they want to move away from subs, or to generate more revenue to improve the game, they need to expand into these markets.

So long as there are no "Buy this to get special access to bosses/player content/etc" Ive no problem with them creating fun things on the side I can opt out of. Thats called player choice. Im not going to tell SE that they cant do that, becausee SE is a business, and there are people who want that stuff. Why should my views prevent other people from having things that I myself dont benefit from or that I am hurt by? You want to quit over an app you dont have to use that has some QoL features for players who buy and want those feature? Man, if thats the issue youre going to die on a hill for, maybe gaming in general isnt for you.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

Your statement is so flawed it's laughable. It's the equivalent of saying Nuclear Bombs exist, so we HAVE to use them, so everyone MUST kill themselves.

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Man that is such a gross misrepresentation of my argument. I said the app is gonna be there no matter what. Doesn't matter whether he uses it or not. His enjoyment of the game being hindered by the app is his choice. It can be hard to understand that people go into a theme park to be entertained and leave when they aren't though. Perhaps you should take a minute to gather your thoughts?

So do we all have to buy the app to be able to play the game or what?

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

You make very good points and respect your perspective. Being that the gaming industry is a competitive nature and they keep things under wrap is to avoid unnecessary competition from the start of the idea. Revealing it near the end of completions is a strategic way of maintaining an edge against competitors. ( from a business analytical perspective ) I agree it does bring out controversies within the community and lets face it drama is part of human nature no matter what in one way or another. The fact of the matter is that it is a source of revenue so yes waving a free version to entice the consumer may seem as not being fair, however it si fair play in the business world.

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And in equal respect I ask you: Who is FFXIV really competing with? It's only other direct competitor in the same business model is WoW, and it pales when comparing sub numbers alone. The F2P MMOs? Most of them you buy the main game/expac and don't bother with subs, due to the "freemium" options.

We're not business people and we certainly can understand the "keep it a surprise". But its not, it never is because they already talk about it to a degree. A surprise would've been never expecting the app at all (or the XIV Go App to have been the real app all along). The real surprise to a number of people was never disclosing it'll come with its own business model.
And this is again, looping back to poor communication. We can address that they do it in the "legal sense" and the upgrade campaign is a good example of communication that they handled well, credit where its due, but we can also show credit where its been... interesting to see them crash and burn with their hype, let alone the recent display of "disconnect" with the western side of the community in regards to the alliance loot change

All in all, they do things right and they do things right on the legal manner and that's fine. Business be business. The rest of the points, like LL translations, the EU issue with the maid/butler promos to name a few are instances where communication is not on point. Game wise, there's plenty that has been said that hasn't met the expectations they set, housing is the best example of something that has had horrid communication issues of expectation vs result.

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

Now as for the cash and grab perspective, yes based on the user base it may seem that way, what did people expect based on so many subscribers. Would it make a huge difference if they were only 5000 players? Do the numbers of potential subscribers dignify the means of these results? No it comes with the idea and potential. What I fail to understand, and correct me if I'm wrong, why consumers see it as scheme? its a product that justifies the needs of their players with both options of subscription and free versions. If people want to pay fine, if not don't? Yet to rage quit over this, I would think as a matter of principle will only show how many hypocrites there are. We all know eventually the majority will accept the fact and just come back just on the fact that this game is meeting their current internment need which is really what business do to begin with. If people don't accept it a simple concept and see it as evil they are welcome to perceive that. I just wonder what is the greater evil, what SE is doing, or ignorance of blaming a company for a product that meets consumers needs and thriving from it as well.

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I think here we're overlapping and cross-sampling things

Players wanted: An app that allowed them to keep interacting with the game to a degree
Players got: exactly what they asked with a catch: money. Catch because: they weren't expecting to pay for certain features.

Company wanted: an app that addressed the request the players made.
Company gave: exactly what players asked but added a "premium" to make the service sustainable from those who're willing to pay for it and in turn, they (said players and company) get "a little extra".

The problem doesn't fall on where the ideas overlap, it where they didn't and the lack of transparency behind it. If they had said "off the bat" that it would come with costs, the consumer would've given them an early indicator of appeal. Regardless of drama, the feedback would've been early enough to consider the costs of this overall.

(the lack of) Communication is the reason: People (don't) understand what/how/why is being offered. It's not the product that its at fault. Its the communication one party is unable (albeit not incapable) of offering and the other party being unable to get the (reliable) information it needs to understand.

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Originally Posted by MilanFrozen

Actually it does mean you have no choice.

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Originally Posted by MilanFrozen

His enjoyment of the game being hindered by the app is his choice.

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Soooooo..........choice or no choice? Which is it? My whole statement is based around the premise of CHOICE. Your statements conflict severely on that matter. Maybe you should be the one gathering your thoughts?

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Originally Posted by Leloa

So do we all have to buy the app to be able to play the game or what?

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No at all. Quite the opposite. You can play the game, and ALL of its essential content, just fine without ever even thinking about the app.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

Soooooo..........choice or no choice? Which is it? My whole statement is based around the premise of CHOICE. Your statements conflict severely on that matter. Maybe you should be the one gathering your thoughts?

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You cut off this part:

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Actually it does mean you have no choice. That app is coming out no matter what.

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You're talking about options to do things. They addressed the part of "we're getting the app anyways".

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Originally Posted by Mahrze

You cut off this part:



You're talking about options to do things. They addressed the part of "we're getting the app anyways".

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So explain to me EXACTLY how the apps existence effects in anyway, shape, or form your CHOICE whether or not to use it? The only reason you even have a CHOICE is because it exists, so saying that you have no choice because it exists defy's logic.