I think WHM identity is being THE healer which mean powerful heals for every situation. AST had been buffed so much they lost control over it but it's clear that wasn't their original plan.
So I think the revamp of the battle system and with the new skill will give them the chance to highlight it again.
WHM: big multiple heals + HoTs, burts damage for when no heal is needed
SCH: shields, healing pet and MP to allow persistent DPS
AST: buffer with versatilite healing set
New healer: a debuffer with emergency heal and strong DPS(?)
I expect that the more jobs they add the more it'll be easier for them to focus on the identities of each healer. The same goes for tanks.
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10-31-2016, 12:36 AMGreven
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10-31-2016, 04:51 AMThunda_Cat_SMASHTBF MNK does have more utility than a WHM. The only issue with it is no one likes defensive utility like DK/DE/SP or Mantra. MNK has a lot higher personal dps than any other job in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Morzy
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11-01-2016, 09:57 AMFernosaur
More than reinstating WHM's identity as a healer, I think they need to pull back on AST creeping up on WHM's deal with Diurnal Sect. Of course, I don't think that's happening this expansion, but maybe the system changes in 4.0 will be big enough that AST will have a better identity surrounding the cards and how their space/time manipulation affects their healing output than just having copy-paste spells from WHM. The obvious and immediate "solution" would be to up WHM's healing potencies up a notch or two, but we all know that doesn't really do that much and only causes overhealing.
It would be great if AST's more powerful healing worked in a gated manner instead of just having Helios and Benefic II, much like Scholar's healing bursts are entirely dependent on Aetherflow and Emergency Tactics, but of course with different mechanics that made sense with the lore. I think they could have made a much more interesting toolkit based around the space-time themes but simply copy pasted from the other jobs and called it a day :/ -
11-02-2016, 01:33 AMExiled_TonberryI really think Monk PLD and White Mage are all in a poor state together.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH
They're all jobs that are supposedly supposed to excel in their job, but have competition that match their mitigation/damage/healing and brings more to the table.
Really SE needs to get off this idea that these jobs need to remain simple for the sake of remaining simple. It's obviously hurting what the jobs can do. -
11-02-2016, 01:34 PMOneavi
I'm sure this has been said already in the thread but my perception on the AST vs WHM identity crisis is that there are two primary causes of this:
At a healing level: WHM and AST have very similar standing throughput, although AST brings both consistent (disable) random mitigation (effectively 30 seconds of occasionally allowing the tank to drop stance in situations where they otherwise cannot) and stronger throughput while moving.
At a raid dps level: A WHM playing at an extremely advanced level might be able to compete with an unlucky or mediocre ast in terms of overall raid dps, but an ast at the top of their game/luck is going to blow them out of the water. ASTs have good and sustainable DoT damage on top of their ability to buff the raid. An AST at equivalent skill level to a WHM is almost certainly going to bring more to the table provided they are fulfilling the same group role.
WHM already brings a lot of sick AoE damage to the table, so I'd personally be interested to see WHM maintain its position as the "power" healer through damage adjustments, able to flex a lot more dps muscle while also putting out strong sustained healing at the cost of more strenuous mana management and precise movement requirements. The WHM play style as a raid "main" healer already reflects this, the payoff for executing at a high level though is not equivalent to an AST. The dps they generate is not sufficient to compare to ast and the playstyle is more mentally demanding.
tl;dr: much like a ninja vs a monk, you are trading raid dps buffs for a high personal dps class. Different groups then can decide what works best for their play method, much like many groups do now with monks and ninjas/dragoons
edit: it also certainly helps that WHMs cooldowns are suited for dps. PoM is unarguably more powerful as a dps cooldown than a healing throughput increase. Benediction is best used in a coordinated and consistent manner to gain dps. Tetra is excellent for use when bene is on cooldown: drop out of c-stance for a gcd and do a regen-tetra-maybe-asylum combo then resume c-stance. Asylum is a free and gcd efficient aoe regen and is insanely useful to avoid having to cast many aoe heals or tank heals, depending on the fight. Assize is an obscene dps cooldown, enough said. -
11-09-2016, 07:11 AMTashim
well, I suppose I'll point out that, for now, whm is still the only way to get a mind buff in the party. ast and sch still only provide pie buff.
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11-09-2016, 07:15 AMtechnoleIt'd hardly much of a deal, and considering world first A12S was AST/SCH, having the opportunity for card buff outweighs the half-of-an-accessory MND bonus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tashim
Although I do wish they would change it to as long as there no same healer roles in the party, it should default to MND/PIE. As AST/SCH is a normal composition. -
11-09-2016, 03:07 PMExiled_TonberryThis is really not a issue in the discussion of balance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tashim
Heck if anything, SE wants to remove this strictly from WHM and out it on AST as well. -
11-09-2016, 08:59 PMlordparanoiaThis is not true. Before 3.0 came out AST had more powerful abilities but they nerfed it just before the release and we had a very low-potency/weak buffer healer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greven
I don't think the solution would be nerfing AST again, also because at the moment WHM can gain a spot in every party and nobody will ever say "NO WHM" like ppl said "NO AST" in 3.1.
The only thing I would adjust of White Mage is a bit Mana-efficency. -
11-09-2016, 10:45 PMExiled_TonberryFunny you say that, just yesterday I ran into two PFs that said they want fast farm runs, high dps etc. They had WHM locked out and wanted either one AST or one AST/SCH.Quote:
Originally Posted by lordparanoia