Alienation of Dedicated and Skilled players

That is a valid view point, but I see it as us finding stronger and tougher enemies to prevail against, rather than everything just kinda lurking at the same values.

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Originally Posted by Caelum_Dragguell

On another note it's gotten so bad as to make me play FFXI as I view it to have way more depth than FFXIV in its current state. For those who have played FFXI I'm sure many of you understand how I'm feeling at this stage and I hope you will help the development team see they need a change

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No I don't understand how you feel and yes I played FFXI for 11/12 years. I feel in the amount of time I play 14 and I put in a lot of hours I get way more done. No shouting for partys or shouting to build partys for hours. I think I actually spent more time on there shouting for stuff than actually getting stuff done.

I sort of miss haste etc on gear and buffs to abilities, but then I remember how I had multiple gear sets. The main thing I miss is having more open world stuff and since doing Aquapolis that has sort of appeased me for now. Hopefully Diadem will get some love and Deep Dungeon proves successful I will be happy.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

I kinda get where you're coming from when I consider running Mhach City 15 times has not rewarded me with a caster body drop even once. 30 hours of my life wasted with no reward. And it's my second week in and it still hasn't dropped.

I must agree though that we need more then these cookie cutter stats that only buff your main attack stat or have very menial reduction on the GCD.

Don't even have stats to buff up your defense more.

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Nah on FFXi u spent 1-2 years to get a red mage hat to drop to you. Each run taking a few hours to complete so 30 hours for an item in here is fine with me lol

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Originally Posted by Seraphix2407

start attacking OP for having his opinion on end game.

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Nobody has "attacked" the OP. We simply have different opinions and are asserting our own reasons for them. He presented an idea which not everyone is going to agree with. Instead of engaging in the debate, I've mostly seen replies that essentially boil down to "well, if they don't implement my idea, then the game will die."

And that's silly.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Evidently, you don't, because your post literally demands people adapt to how you want the game to be played. If the market changes, why in the world would games stubbornly stick to old formulas that no longer garner interest? That's financial suicide. Wildstar attempted that and will likely shut down by the year's end because of it.

The journey was more memorable to you. I, on the other hand, find a year or two long "journey" for a weapon upgrade mind numbingly boring. No amount of flavor text will make grind quests appealing. FFXIV's closest example would be doing Beast Tribe dailies for the ilvl 210 Anima step. Those are not fun. Instead, I have increased desire to burn down the Sylph forest every time Boars Wars rolls up. Sure, the actual quests with the tribe leaders is cute, but all those little quests you do to build reputation? Boring. I'm not alone in this mindset considering the majority audience doesn't even touch the harder content, let alone cares about the Anima weapon or stuff like it. Hence why I reiterate this game simply may not be for you long term.

This doesn't even touch another significant issue with horizontal progression. If the best gear is gated behind this "struggle," then anyone wanting to get into raid content will now have to do it. Most won't nowadays, which is why you don't see games like FFXI or Vanilla WoW anymore.

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How predictable. I mean, I could flip that and say the same thing on the other end of the spectrum right? Just shut up and color because it sells? Pretty sure keeping both parties happy is better than losing a portion of the population.

I don't understand why you keep choosing to allude to Dynamis Relic. In truth, it didn't even take that long. It all depended on how much support you had behind you. But..Given how you worded it, it just sounds like -to me- that you didn't really experience that first hand. But that's just observation speaking based on your preferences. The difference between XIV and XI's conquest of relics(since this is your constant reference) is one will actually matter in the long run over the other. The journey, as you say, may differ to others...But at least one won't make you feel like you actually wasted time versus the other. Ah, but that's just my opinion of course.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

Isn't that entirely so people could practice rotations in a way that both allows you to learn them while giving you a goal towards pushing for? I am thinking the correct thing, right? Are you saying everyone should only learn rotations against end-game things where, depending on the fight, you can't learn it on the fly?



Now this is just not true at all. Yes, the gear did get replaced, but the better your gear was at the end of 2.55 the longer it took for a replacement to come up.

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I didn't replace my right side till level 60 I used them to level all crafts. I dont even think i started really upgrading armour till 54-55 but I cant remember. I do know it was only tools main and body though.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Nobody has "attacked" the OP. We simply have different opinions and are asserting our own reasons for them. He presented an idea which not everyone is going to agree with. Instead of engaging in the debate, I've mostly seen replies that essentially boil down to "well, if they don't implement my idea, then the game will die."

And that's silly.

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Well yah okay, true. However, how long have the game been out and tell how long the current formula have lasted. This isn't something we are only aware of, also yoshida. TBH, square playing either safe card or simply not willing to give yoshida enough resources he desveres, which sucks for this game.

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Originally Posted by Lorielle

How predictable. I mean, I could flip that and say the same thing on the other end of the spectrum right? Just shut up and color because it sells? Pretty sure keeping both parties happy is better than losing a portion of the population.

I don't understand why you keep choosing to allude to Dynamis Relic. In truth, it didn't even take that long. It all depended on how much support you had behind you. But..Given how you worded it, it just sounds like -to me- that you didn't really experience that first hand. But that's just observation speaking based on your preferences. The difference between XIV and XI's conquest of relics(since this is your constant reference) is one will actually matter in the long run over the other. The journey, as you say, may differ to others...But at least one won't make you feel like you actually wasted time versus the other. Ah, but that's just my opinion of course.

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You could. But then your argument hinges on 95% of the playerbase "adapting" to what maybe 5% wants. Spoilers: they won't. Keeping both parties happy only stretches so far. You eventually have to consider what part of your audience is more financially viable. FFXIV is a game where the majority don't care about hardcore progression content. Catering towards those who do will inevitably drive the others away. And that will cripple your game.

Admittedly, I haven't. FFXI didn't keep my interest long due to its grind heavy nature. I, however, do know plenty of people who have done the prolonged relic quests and don't look back on them fondly. I have also done similar stuff in other games-- with the same result. Either way, all of this is irrelevant because you're still assuming FFXIV's audience will gravitate to what essentially would be FFXI-2. They won't because they are different games, with different audience preferences.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

You could. But then your argument hinges on 95% of the playerbase "adapting" to what maybe 5% wants. Spoilers: they won't. Keeping both parties happy only stretches so far. You eventually have to consider what part of your audience is more financially viable. FFXIV is a game where the majority don't care about hardcore progression content. Catering towards those who do will inevitably drive the others away. And that will cripple your game.

Admittedly, I haven't. FFXI didn't keep my interest long due to its grind heavy nature. I, however, do know plenty of people who have done the prolonged relic quests and don't look back on them fondly. I have also done similar stuff in other games-- with the same result. Either way, all of this is irrelevant because you're still assuming FFXIV's audience will gravitate to what essentially would be FFXI-2. They won't because they are different games, with different audience preferences.

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I'm sure anyone, for example, would love to have their time and effort rewarded with longer lasting gear. Your Relic. From 2.0 having relevance in today's patch would be sung to high heavens. But instead, it's treated like trash and just used as silly stepping stone to "save time". That turned me away from this current relic because SE isn't about doing something new or making your gear long lasting. It would just be a waste of my time and effort. Look...That minority is actually trying to make the game better, but we're being ignored because it's not "financially better".

Even I can tell you that the majority will get bored eventually if they're being spoon fed the same formula for years to come. Playing "Safe" isn't going to work forever.

And I'm not saying the game should be a direct XI-2. I'm saying the game should just have more going for it. If you'd stop twisting my words, that too would be nice. I want Eorzea to feel more than a lifeless, pretty landscape. I want the community to interact more with each other. But this content that we have is not going to do it.

Attributes are so shallow that attribute distribution has only one answer with any job in any situation, it may aswell not exist in the game's current state as it just wastes peoples time adding points. Item level is the only stat that needs to be considered now, ilevel 230 gear or 220 gear? Go with the 230. The stat system has no quirks or anything interesting to get to grips with. Crafting is a massive commitment yet is always way behind in gear progression. There really needs to be more variety in high ilevel gear as opposed to one or two highest ilevel sets.