Should tanks ask to do big pulls?

It's always nice to ask, as it's a nice gesture and we were raised to be courteous to others.

Though, from my experience, mass pulling tends to be a bit slower than doing 2 groups and letting your healer DPS, too or get a few AoE's off. (Assuming they land, of course.)

It's a judgement call.

As a healer, I let the tank pull as many as he feels comfortable with. If I feel he is pulling too much for me to heal, I say so.

As a tank, I'll usually tell the healer to let me know if I am pulling too much. Then pull as many as I feel the group can handle. If AOE dmg is lacking, I'll pull smaller groups, but if it's a SMN+BLM combo or the like, I'm gonna pull everything possible. Unless the healer says otherwise.

If you don't tell people you're new, people will assume you know what you are doing. The average tank does big pulls. The average healer can handle big pulls. The tank is under no obligation to tell you that she is going to do the thing she nearly always does and people are nearly always okay with. If you want something done differently, then it's your obligation to say something about it. I have many times seen tanks slow down when asked without complaining.

For one, I tank often, and I will always slow down if asked. But, if no one says anything, I will assume the party wants the dungeon done the way it's usually done, and that usually means big pulls.

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Originally Posted by Vespar

As a healer, I think you should try to assume that every tank will do big pulls. This way you are prepared for it. While its nice that some tanks will specify they are doing big pulls, it has become the norm and therefore most wont blink an eye and immediately will assume the healer can roll with it.

If you arent confident in your ability to handle large pulls (within reason) then I'd suggest making that known at the beginning of the party beforehand.

Ultimately should a wipe occur, I'm of the mindset that both healer and tank share the blame as either could have expressed their preference in the beginning.

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While I agree with you in theory, it's still not the healer's responsibility to assume a big pull, but the tank's to warn them ahead of time or accept fault should their pull cause a wipe. Mobs are grouped in 3-5 for a reason after all. People's impatience is not an excuse, even if the healer doesn't express their preference beforehand.

So, no, OP. Healers shouldn't be blamed. The only exception might be if after a wipe or two, they still don't ask if the tank could not pull so much because they're having trouble.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

So, no, OP. Healers shouldn't be blamed. The only exception might be if after a wipe or two, they still don't ask if the tank could not pull so much because they're having trouble.

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Healers shouldn't be blamed. But, there's nothing with with the tank expecting people to want the usual. I do agree that there's no reason to throw blame around if there's a wipe though, though a wipe is a great reason to ask if the party wants something other than the usual.

Actually got a request to NOT do big pulls during a ex roulette from a healer, citing that the tank was doing stupidly large pulls and risking their life needlessly running to the next batch that's far away, instead of dealing with what's there.

I listened.

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Originally Posted by Zaranghae

Vespar wins this thread. All tanks/healers should assume big pulls, whenever I'm doing either class, nothing pisses me off more than when we have 2 BLM/SMN/BRD and a tank pulls 1 monster at a time.
Grow a fucking pair or if shit is going "too fast" for you, pick a different game.

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Originally Posted by Noshpan

As a melee DPS, I don't think it hurts to ask. "Hey, are you guys okay if I do a big pull to see how this group handles it?"

During the entire 2.+ line I've had one tank stop after the first pull and go "Oh shit, I have a MNK & DRG. Time to adjust my pulls." Sure, the healer, MNK & I were able to handle that big pull, it just took awhile.

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MNK has objectively the best melee AoE in the game at 60, DRG can hold it's own in AoE as well. Point being at any item level you are allowed entry into any level 60 instance at present you should be able to do large pulls and it be more effective for all involved given both consideration to cool downs and efficiency.

It's worth pointing out that healers can dish out a lot of DPS themselves. So while it is nice for tanks to pull a lot of mobs, if they go overboard and pull everything to the extent that you can only focus heal, they could actually be prolonging the dungeon. Especially if the DPS aren't as capable, considering everyone is under assumptions about each other.

And a side note, the tank should definitely get the blame if they die with their HG/LD/Holmgang unused. I've seen it happen countless times, tanks are not just there to hold aggro, part of their toolkit is damage mitigation so it should be used effectively.

I find it's important for a tank to ask their healing partner if they are okay with larger sized pulls because it shows a level of respect to their fellow party members and gauge the healer's comfort level.

With that being said, as a healer I tend to just assume most tanks are "Go big or go home" type tanks and prepare for the worst since I don't recall the last time any tank has actually asked me "Big pulls are okay?" lol

[EDIT] Also, if the tank pulls big and dies due to (1) lack of communication with their healing partner and/or (2) ain't using any cooldowns to help the healer's job, I feel the blame is on the tank unless the healer is so utterly oblivious that they forget to actually heal.

I have a habit of taking the blame even when it's clearly not my fault, but I don't really ask if a Healer is comfortable with it either either, I tend to assume that they are. If they mention that they are new to a run then I certainly won't do anything too demanding, albeit if you are at the end-game dungeons then you might want to mention that you're inexperienced with healing large pulls and may not be up to standard just yet.

I wouldn't say you should blame a Tank for making an assumption in this case. Even if I checked your gear, I likely wouldn't know what's decent and what's not to be honest. Ideally, both parties should be humble and not put the blame anywhere.
If you know that a run is often subject to large pulls then you should speak up. If it catches you off-guard and you end up wiping then simply apologise and explain yourself but by no means feel bad for it. The only person worth a bit of scorn and ridicule is the one who chooses to make a big deal of it and proceeds to talk down to the other party.