The great streamer Asmongold is joining FFXIV

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Originally Posted by Lanadra

Don't be silly. We got a perfectly good Raen waiting to actually get her dues in Yugiri.

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She's effectively bound to Doma but she'll probably show up to play a part in Endwalker yet between Yugiri and Mikoto I've had my fill of female Raen.

I think the men look cool and distinct, so it'd be nice to see one accompany us at least for a while.

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Originally Posted by Lanadra

Don't be silly. We got a perfectly good Raen waiting to actually get her dues in Yugiri.

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She's fine and all but some Raen male representation, pls

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

The problem with the consequence of said guy is he is a minor character. It doesn’t feel as strong of a consequence because said person hasn’t even been on screen for a long time and they’re just brought in at random for one patch. The problem with it is if we know everything is going to be okay then what’s the point? Where’s the pull? There’s a literal world ending apocalypse and if everyone ends up okay that’s just ridiculous lol. There’s a reason literally every single other ff game has dealt with character deaths and hell, a good chunk of them even have the protagonists fail and the antagonists succeed. So it’s not like it’s just out of the blue, it’s part of what makes a good story. Look at ff7 for example. The story wouldn’t be nearly as good if it wasn’t for a certain characters death that is literally one of the most well known moments in gaming history. Death is a part of the realistic sense of plot in a lot of games. It’s unreasonable to think the protagonists should always come out unscathed, especially in end of the world scenarios. My problem is when they give unreasonable amounts of plot armor or create plot holes just to keep characters alive which we’ve seen with both Graha and Yshtola. It makes the story very jarring when they won’t even commit to things and just tease them. This isn’t a disney or anime game. This is an mmorpg that deals with dark themes.

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I was going to reformat my answer because I worded it not how I liked. But since you saved the reply and answered I have to reply. Mainly cause we had that in XIV as well. Does a character need to die each expac for you to feel the danger? We had quite a few in the beginning up to SB. And I just disagree with the one character not mattering because he didn't have alot of screen time. It's still there. He still can't walk anymore. And we SAW it. It's not like it was offscreen. We saw the battle and saw the after math. Hell it was a decent amount of the plot towards the end. It's one thing to be tired of some characters in the cast, but it's another thing altogether to forget things just because. Or to undermind what does happen simply because it's not death. So here's my question. If all the main cast - your party- survive all of 6.0 but some of them can't fight anymore. BUT we lost over 70% of the world would you still call that bad? What if we SAW people being killed burned or whatever. Would that not solve the issue you have?

I guess I just see it differently cause people are dying all the time in this game, dying, being raped, turned into things they can't cure from, hell some of them were EATEN!!! Yes I know the primal thing is being undone but I'm not talking about that. Also correct me if I'm wrong but what's the point of killing a main cast member JUST to replace them with someone else? Wouldn't it be better to work with what you have? Seems kindof pointless to me.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

The problem with the consequence of said guy is he is a minor character. It doesn’t feel as strong of a consequence because said person hasn’t even been on screen for a long time and they’re just brought in at random for one patch. The problem with it is if we know everything is going to be okay then what’s the point? Where’s the pull? There’s a literal world ending apocalypse and if everyone ends up okay that’s just ridiculous lol. There’s a reason literally every single other ff game has dealt with character deaths and hell, a good chunk of them even have the protagonists fail and the antagonists succeed. So it’s not like it’s just out of the blue, it’s part of what makes a good story. Look at ff7 for example. The story wouldn’t be nearly as good if it wasn’t for a certain characters death that is literally one of the most well known moments in gaming history. Death is a part of the realistic sense of plot in a lot of games. It’s unreasonable to think the protagonists should always come out unscathed, especially in end of the world scenarios. My problem is when they give unreasonable amounts of plot armor or create plot holes just to keep characters alive which we’ve seen with both Graha and Yshtola. It makes the story very jarring when they won’t even commit to things and just tease them. This isn’t a disney or anime game. This is an mmorpg that deals with dark themes.

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What I WILL say I wished happened in SB but never did and it'll made Zenos a much more liked villain for me.. is if.. he killed us in the first fight. Hear me out. They could've worked in a solo dungeon for us to fight thur to come back to life. Since we're so special and all that. I mean... that'll set us apart from everyone us and I think it'll made more sense. My issue if we're going to bring up those with the main cast is they can do everything we can do. With one or two things they can't. The Echo being one of them. It's hard to believe we're so skilled and OP when most of the cast is just as OP. THAT I think needs to be fixed in my opinion. HW was REALLY bad with that... they'll be entire scenes where you the WOL did nothing but stand there and watch the NPCs and your party get the work done. SB and SB2 fixed it for the most part but it's still there in a few things. I just wished our character did more and was a true main character in the plot instead of just gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Gameovers

I was going to reformat my answer because I worded it not how I liked. But since you saved the reply and answered I have to reply. Mainly cause we had that in XIV as well. Does a character need to die each expac for you to feel the danger? We had quite a few in the beginning up to SB. And I just disagree with the one character not mattering because he didn't have alot of screen time. It's still there. He still can't walk anymore. And we SAW it. It's not like it was offscreen. We saw the battle and saw the after math. Hell it was a decent amount of the plot towards the end. It's one thing to be tired of some characters in the cast, but it's another thing altogether to forget things just because. Or to undermind what does happen simply because it's not death. So here's my question. If all the main cast - your party- survive all of 6.0 but some of them can't fight anymore. BUT we lost over 70% of the world would you still call that bad? What if we SAW people being killed burned or whatever. Would that not solve the issue you have?

I guess I just see it differently cause people are dying all the time in this game, dying, being raped, turned into things they can't cure from, hell some of them were EATEN!!! Yes I know the primal thing is being undone but I'm not talking about that. Also correct me if I'm wrong but what's the point of killing a main cast member JUST to replace them with someone else? Wouldn't it be better to work with what you have? Seems kindof pointless to me.

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The problem is that in ShB for example. They describe it as the expansion where we face our strongest foes yet. There’s the constant danger of the scions slowly fading away and they dangle that in front of our faces constantly but then...nothing comes from it. We fight against two of the strongest foes so far and nothing happens to any of the scions. Yet in other expansions some die despite it being against lesser foes. At this point i’m not even asking for deaths but consequences period. Despite it being advertised as the darkest and grimest expansion against the strongest foes ever, it’s played the safest with no consequences whatsoever for the main cast. As for your last point, it’s to replace them with someone new to add something new to the story. “Working with what you have” only works for so long.When we’ve been stuck with the same cast for multiple expansions and nothing new happens in regards to them they become stale and boring. We’re already seeing this with Graha whose overstayed his welcome within just 1 expansion, and he’s a character who they wrote immense plot armor and plot holes for to keep alive.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

The problem is that in ShB for example. They describe it as the expansion where we face our strongest foes yet. There’s the constant danger of the scions slowly fading away and they dangle that in front of our faces constantly but then...nothing comes from it. We fight against two of the strongest foes so far and nothing happens to any of the scions. Yet in other expansions some die despite it being against lesser foes. At this point i’m not even asking for deaths but consequences period. Despite it being advertised as the darkest and grimest expansion against the strongest foes ever, it’s played the safest with no consequences whatsoever for the main cast. As for your last point, it’s to replace them with someone new to add something new to the story. “Working with what you have” only works for so long.When we’ve been stuck with the same cast for multiple expansions and nothing new happens in regards to them they become stale and boring. We’re already seeing this with Graha whose overstayed his welcome within just 1 expansion, and he’s a character who they wrote immense plot armor and plot holes for to keep alive.

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I have to just be seeing it differently because I never felt the cast being teased in front of my face. I was too invested in the fact that my character was actually going thur things for the maybe first time? I mean it's rare to be in the direct main plot and have things effect the WOL. Was it fluff... ofcourse. But it was still nice. So I didn't notice nor care that the cast were not being killed. Then again I couldn't count all the deaths we've seen cause there was alot.. it just wasn't the main cast. And I'mma say this. If you're not liking how they are writing the main cast now, then why on earth do you want them to replace them with new faces. To do what? Do the same thing you're sick of the main cast doing? That's what I mean. Changing the players would do nothing if the writing isn't going to change. All you'll be doing is giving the party Fantas to look and sound different. They would still have the plot armor you hate and they still won't be getting killed off. The problem isn't death OR the cast. It's the writing.

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Originally Posted by Hysterior

OK then, from page 1 of this thread only (won't go through 14 pages)







Better? Feels more welcoming?

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Truth be told This is a forum where people yell and complain about everything you are just in the biggest condensed version of it. Maybe talk to people more in the game and you might get the toxicity less, cause I know I rarely come across the jerk attitude from players. Even if you do come across people from asmongold's seething community You should still keep a levelhead and remain nice to them, cause they can't win if they don't get a negative reaction from you.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

The problem is that in ShB for example. They describe it as the expansion where we face our strongest foes yet. There’s the constant danger of the scions slowly fading away and they dangle that in front of our faces constantly but then...nothing comes from it. We fight against two of the strongest foes so far and nothing happens to any of the scions. Yet in other expansions some die despite it being against lesser foes. At this point i’m not even asking for deaths but consequences period. Despite it being advertised as the darkest and grimest expansion against the strongest foes ever, it’s played the safest with no consequences whatsoever for the main cast. As for your last point, it’s to replace them with someone new to add something new to the story. “Working with what you have” only works for so long.When we’ve been stuck with the same cast for multiple expansions and nothing new happens in regards to them they become stale and boring. We’re already seeing this with Graha whose overstayed his welcome within just 1 expansion, and he’s a character who they wrote immense plot armor and plot holes for to keep alive.

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I enjoyed Shadowbringers' story a lot, easily more than any expansion's story before it. But yeah, that is still one of my biggest gripes with the game. There's no real consequences for the actions of the story's major characters except for 3-4, and 3 of them were just semi important side characters. 1 wasn't around long enough to actually be important. lol I'm not asking for Game of Thrones here. But if it were like most other FFs, characters would die, even some of the ones we've grown attached to. And they stay dead. It adds a bit more emotional weight to the game and accurately depicts the high stakes of such a large, important conflict.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It's less a case of people asking for death for the sake of death and more so an acknowledgement that consequences for the antagonists but not the protagonists makes for a pretty stale story.

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I think that depends entirely on the story being told. The entirety of Alphinaud's story arc is about consequence. Consequence does not and should not have to mean deaths, although there are deaths already, regardless if people think they're minor deaths.

If anything, I hate when character (especially major character) deaths are used to show consequences. That makes them less real and more tools for plot device.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Meanwhile i still see people both on the forums,reddit, and in game bash on WoW players constantly. Idk why people still try to defend it when it’s literally a known major problem. Our community sucks. It’s a cesspool of toxicity hidden behind a shiny piece of plastic with glitter and stickers on it. Just because people try to keep it underwraps doesn’t make it any less true. The fact people sent death threats and tried to physically harass an ex wow veteran simply because he gave an opinion on the game should speak volumes. You can argue all you want that “that doesn’t represent our community,” but when it happens multiple times, yeah sorry but one time is an accident, a second time isn’t. Don’t give me that crap.

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Our community sucks as much as you want to wallow in the negativity. Blacklist people who are jerks, don't stay in FC's full of them either. Everyone else I've met has enriched my gaming experience pretty nicely. I've played many many MMO's and so far This and GuildWars are the "nicest" ones.

Yeah it's not a utopia and yes some people act like the community is nothing but milk and honey (it totally is not) but both extremes are completely untrue.

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Originally Posted by Awha

FFXIV community is a meme though GCBTW, is how a many others view us because of those minority posters. The reality is yes if someone saw something crazy multiple times many would attribute that behavior the community at large.

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And that's their problem. The truth being the extreme majority of the FFXIV community is the same as anywhere else, people playing games. And since we aren't also indoctrinated with this pseudo rivalry of say.. Alliance VS Horde or Asmodean Vs Elyos, most people in the game are helpful and willing to treat you as a fellow gamer no matter where you come from. Memes are memes and should be taken as such. Games are populated with gamers who are as diverse as the rest of the world and for the most part largely just people amusing themselves with the game.