White Raven earring given out at The Rising event 2018

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Yes, but as I said, that makes it clear that it's about the game telling them how special they are, which is an unworthy consideration. It's time for them to grow up and find a more stable sense of self-worth.

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So...from a neutral observer....

This is kind of a hypocritical argument?

You're telling them to "grow up" and not put any worth into digital video game items, but people could also "grow up" and not care if the same digital video game item is simply named differently from the original item?

Both sides are caring about a digital item, just in different ways. If people need to "grow up" and not put any worth into video game items then why does it matter if the item is named replica or not?

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Originally Posted by Miste

So...from a neutral observer....

This is kind of a hypocritical argument?

You're telling them to "grow up" and not put any worth into digital video game items, but people could also "grow up" and not care if the same digital video game item is simply named differently from the original item?

Both sides are caring about a digital item, just in different ways. If people need to "grow up" and not put any worth into video game items then why does it matter if the item is named replica or not?

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You're making a rather unfounded assumption. I don't care about the item at all. I don't care if I get it in any fashion or not. I do, however, care about the attitude that is reflected in being upset by this development, as it's one that I think harms game development when developers allow it to influence them. Perhaps some people care about the item, but most of the posts I see arguing against the OP likewise seem to be more concerned with the attitude than the item per se.

For what it's worth, issues in life are rarely perfectly mirrored dichotomies. If you reflexively seek to understand an issue as a conflict between two sides that are equal, but opposite, you will generally fail to understand much of anything.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

You're making a rather unfounded assumption. I don't care about the item at all. I don't care if I get it in any fashion or not. I do, however, care about the attitude that is reflected in being upset by this development, as it's one that I think harms game development when developers allow it to influence them.

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I never claimed you care about the item or that you care if you get it, so I am not sure where you got that from? So, like, you don't have to defend that to me?

I was pointing out that what you posted is hypocritical....which you didn't bother to address. In fact nothing you've said here has anything to do with what I said?

Why do you care about the attitude? How does it harm game development?

You all might be interested to know that the JP forums also have at thread about this, and bring up lots of the same concerns....but theirs is 12 pages compared to 59.

My concern is that allowing a tiny minority of vocal players to dictate the direction of the game isn't going to end well. The days of 1.0 are long gone. It was a completely different game and one a lot of people never experienced or simply turned their backs on due to how poorly it was received.

The players who remained loyal to 1.0 have their names in the credits and have a discount on their subscription fee. That is more than enough acknowledgement. They don't need to have their every whim catered to, especially when it stifles progress.

What progress would be stifled here?

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Originally Posted by Theodric

My concern is that allowing a tiny minority of vocal players to dictate the direction of the game isn't going to end well. The days of 1.0 are long gone. It was a completely different game and one a lot of people never experienced or simply turned their backs on due to how poorly it was received.

The players who remained loyal to 1.0 have their names in the credits and have a discount on their subscription fee. That is more than enough acknowledgement. They don't need to have their every whim catered to, especially when it stifles progress.

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Why should new players get these old items? As you said, it's from a completely separate game that many people shunned and turned their backs on. The handful of items that carried over were a special perk of taking another chance with ARR. Seems the new players are just envious.

And how is this particular concern stifling progress?

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Originally Posted by Miste

I never claimed you care about the item or that you care if you get it, so I am not sure where you got that from? So, like, you don't have to defend that to me?

I was pointing out that what you posted is hypocritical....which you didn't bother to address. In fact nothing you've said here has anything to do with what I said?

Why do you care about the attitude? How does it harm game development?

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Your accusation of hypocrisy rests on the assumption that I care about the item while telling people they're juvenile if they care about the item, so naturally if I don't care about the item, your accusation is shown to be unfounded. I'm surprised that actually needed explaining. If you need further explanations of such trivial reasoning, I will not bother responding again.

The attitude harms game development because it constrains the potential future directions of the game under threat of a bunch of overly sensitive players getting their feelings hurt via retroactive "depreciation" of their experiences, rather than leaving the developers free to focus solely on producing content that will be enjoyable at the time it is current, which is the product they're selling and how it creates value to consumers.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

My concern is that allowing a tiny minority of vocal players to dictate the direction of the game isn't going to end well. The days of 1.0 are long gone. It was a completely different game and one a lot of people never experienced or simply turned their backs on due to how poorly it was received.

The players who remained loyal to 1.0 have their names in the credits and have a discount on their subscription fee. That is more than enough acknowledgement. They don't need to have their every whim catered to, especially when it stifles progress.

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You mean the progress of copy/paste? All the devs need do is copy the existing White Raven item and change it to Replica White Raven. Bam, problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Your accusation of hypocrisy rests on the assumption that I care about the item while telling people they're juvenile if they care about the item, so naturally if I don't care about the item, your accusation is shown to be unfounded. I'm surprised that actually needed explaining. If you need further explanations of such trivial reasoning, I will not bother responding again.

The attitude harms game development because it constrains the potential future directions of the game under threat of a bunch of overly sensitive players getting their feelings hurt via retroactive "depreciation" of their experiences, rather than leaving the developers free to focus solely on producing content that will be enjoyable at the time it is current, which is the product they're selling and how it creates value to consumers.

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I fail to see how it's juvenile to care about one's accomplishments. You better believe I'd be a little vexed if, come 5.0, Ultimate can be unsynced, thus allowing people who didn't put even half as much work as I did to have the same title and weapons.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Your accusation of hypocrisy rests on the assumption that I care about the item while telling people they're juvenile if they care about the item, so naturally if I don't care about the item, your accusation is shown to be unfounded. I'm surprised that actually needed explaining. If you need further explanations of such trivial reasoning, I will not bother responding again.

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She said the argument was hypocritical, first off. And no, it isn't founded on you caring about the item while telling people they're juvenile; it is founded on the response to OP suggesting they be called "Replicas" instead of just handing out the original items.

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The attitude harms game development because it constrains the potential future directions of the game under threat of a bunch of overly sensitive players getting their feelings hurt via retroactive "depreciation" of their experiences, rather than leaving the developers free to focus solely on producing content that will be enjoyable at the time it is current, which is the product they're selling and how it creates value to consumers.

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TIL: Adding the word "replica" to earrings harms the game and its development overall.