Character Creation Has A Race Problem

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nandina

I know it's a character creation issue hence the title. I wanted to make a black girl but was extremely limited in my options to do so because of the way the character creator was set up on the Hyur. I don't know if you saw the videos I posted where you pretty much are just delegated to one hairstyle and the same nose and face combo.

At this point we can really just dead the thread, cause clearly everyone is perceiving the issue differently and we're getting nowhere.

---

You could have said "Character creation needs more options" "Character creation has a race problem" is not a topic title that spawns good feedback.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nandina

My intent was to let SE know that there are black and brown players who pay a sub, too, and we want A, B, C, and D. I feel the Hyur race has a problem because they're a human equivalent, but yet weren't diverse enough. And in previous pages we've already acknowledged that people have a problem with the way I phrased my words. In the previous pages I also clarified further and gave examples. At that point everything revolving around how I said it, and not the main topic, was BS. I'm not responsible for anyone's emotions. I'm responsible for my emotions; just as you're responsible for yours. If there was a misunderstanding of the intent, all they had to do is exactly what you did, and ask me, lol. There's no fuss. No argument. Nothing. Does this clarify things further or is there still a misunderstanding?

---

I dont think that SE thinks there are no brown and black players playing the game, and I would imagine you would concede that too. So if that was youre thinking, its a bit patronizing that you have to 'inform' them of that fact. Just saying.

From here, your post Im quoting seems to acknowledge to some extent that how you phrased things was a problem. So why do you resort to to lowkey assumptions and accusations on detractors? I mean, you do understand that casting aspersions doesnt help your position when you are engaging with your detractors. You use inflammatory language at teh initial post, which gets a lot of people riled. You acknowledge "Hey, maybe thats an issue" then you go back to using it. So, the question is simple. Am I giving you to much credit here? Do you understand fully that using inflammatory language and casting aspersions is pretty much isnt helping you, either in making suggestions to SE or engaging with your detractors?

Im gonna make this a clear point too: Even if your initial intent was to pose a question towards SE, it is in your own best interests to get as many people on your side of the issue, so that the request appears more genuine to SE. If a decent segment of hte player base supports your request, theyre more likely to react to it. So casting aspersions and the like against your detractors, using language that is prone to cause flaming and heated dialogue, and the like isnt in the interest of your goals. 'Cause the greatest irony of this entire damn thread is simple: People want more customization. No one here is seriously arguing against it. What they have issue is how you came to the conclusion the game needs and then casting it as a racial issue in your opener. Whether it is or not, being smart enough to know that "Hey, if I phrase this like this, its going to cause more issues and stall out what I want to see in the game."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nandina

I see what's being said, but I'm hardly the first person to speak on behalf of people. I'm not equating the issue, but just using an example, Martin Luther King spoke up for others. Nelson Mandela spoke up for others, etc. We have a whole Me Too movement going on where people are speaking up for people. We had gay marriage where people spoke up for people. While character creation in a video game is no where near as drastic or severe as those real life issues (and is very trite in comparison), I've never known it to be a problem to speak up for others. I acknowledge that there are black people who never wanted to be integrated, there are gay people who didn't want gay marriage or believed in it, there are women who can't stand the Me Too movement, but it doesn't change the fact that there were others who did and that their opponents still benefit from it. I can't expect to get these things if I don't call it out or speak up on it. I'm sure if we did get the other nose, lips, hair options; that there would be people who disagree with the premise now who may utilize them in the future. But if not, they still have the option to. Does that make sense?

---

Well, Martin Luther King Jr. and Nelson Mandela, both very important people, spoke up during times where black people were not shown or given the same freedom and equality as white people, they stood against a sea of bias hatred and fear because others were either too afraid of being put in jail or worse, killed for their beliefs to freely speak their rights and outcry against others for trying to take them away. But, you're also in agreement that character creation is very trite in comparison towards those issues....same thing with using the Me Too movement which is also a very serious issue. It's fine to speak up and advocate that you want more styles that you think are lacking. But again, that's you. What you perceive is not what everyone else perceives. You are speaking up for what you believe is lacking, you shouldn't be speaking up for an entire and large group of people because you feel or think that they're slighted or that they should feel slighted for it, namely a whole ethnicity. And that's fine, it's fine to speak up for what you believe is lacking. But, don't label it as a racial issue or that you need to speak for an entire group of people and that's your excuse.

I shouldn't speak up, not that I would, for the entirety of another race even if I was part of that said race. It's not my place. It's not your place. It's no one's place on this really. Doing so would make me look and feel arrogant that I'm somehow more important and able to clarify what an entire race of people want and that I'm some expert on it, when clearly, we're all definitely not. Just because you're part of said race, does not mean that you can speak up for what others want and that you know better than they do initially.

That's the thing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nandina

Seems to me people are against the idea. I'm going to need for you all to remain consistent. Can you all just say you don't want the black features in the game and just call it a day? It's really not that hard. Stick by what you say and mean it. All this deflection is unnecessary.

---

Don't.

Don't you even dare to say something like that again. I am black, living in one of the most segregated cities in America. And one of the things I absolutely cannot stand is when people start trying that reverse racism bs in every form of media, employment, daily life, etc. There is a big difference between saying that there is an issue with the character creator, and saying that the developers are tone-deaf to minorities.

Don't you dare sit there and type that out, saying that nobody wants black features. You want the pretense to be dropped, fine, let's drop all pretenses. I find your original post to be utter garbage that is designed to bait and spur on an argument. I find it disgusting that you are taking on the role of a defiant victim, that you and others are accusing many posters of not wanting 'black features'. Yes, the thread goes on track for maybe a couple pages, but somehow it always circles back to this so-called underrepresentation that keeps getting brought up. You already knew that it was going to start a debate when you said that people were going to be up in their feelings. Yeah, no shit, you are race baiting.

Quit it.

Get over yourself. You dare to bring up MLK and Nelson Mandela...people who actually had real issues to deal with, who actually got up and did something about it. What have you done? Jumped on a computer to argue on a forum. How disgustingly arrogant you are. Your name, your forum name, does not belong in the same footnote as those two amazing gentlemen, who made REAL change on REAL issues. You speak on those two in a thread that you started - you are not speaking up for nothing except this victim mentality that you crafted for yourself, and got some like-minded individuals who are riding the same victim-sharing train that you are conducting right now.

That's quite the ego you got there.

I say we aim to over take the Tales From the Duty Finder thread for number of posts. We've only got 16k+ more to go, we can do it!

Is there a thread were we can post hairstyles we want from the CC?

Cause I tried to get that going in this thread but ... no dice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by reivaxe

Is there a thread were we can post hairstyles we want from the CC?

Cause I tried to get that going in this thread but ... no dice.

---

There are several already made, but you'd probably have to use the search fuction to find them. You could start your own. Not the most popular opinion, but it's an option.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nandina

I know it's a character creation issue hence the title. I wanted to make a black girl but was extremely limited in my options to do so because of the way the character creator was set up on the Hyur. I don't know if you saw the videos I posted where you pretty much are just delegated to one hairstyle and the same nose and face combo.

At this point we can really just dead the thread, cause clearly everyone is perceiving the issue differently and we're getting nowhere.

---

How come you did not just not title the thread; Character creator needs more options or something along those lines. I am willing to bet that most responses in this thread are in favor of more options. It is when you frame the thread as a racial issue that created all of these issues. Instead of going with the mindset character creator is dated and lacks options you decided to go with SE is catering to a certain demographic. Which is unfair to SE, since that is a reach to make the claim that was their intent.

Why was my post deleted? Someone can make race-baiting threads, but I can't address it? Nothing I said was anywhere near as inflammatory as what the OP posted.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by REPROBEAN_CHILD

Why was my post deleted? Someone can make race-baiting threads, but I can't address it? Nothing I said was anywhere near as inflammatory as what the OP posted.

---

Mine was, too. But the post I quoted used abrasive language, so that may have been why, if you quoted the same post. For what it’s worth, I agreed with what you had written.

I’ll just repeat the ending part of my post, because it’s what I wanted to say the minute I saw this thread: Ask for more character customization; ask for more options for faces, lips, eyes, jaws, noses; ask for sliders and color wheels, etc.. But don’t bring a racial divide into a game that doesn’t classify races by the color of their skin.